POINT SHOOTING -- The best way for using a handgun in defense?

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Thread: POINT SHOOTING -- The best way for using a handgun in defense?

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    Member Array SnubMan's Avatar
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    POINT SHOOTING -- The best way for using a handgun in defense?

    Hey all,
    I could not care less about making impressive groups to show my friends at the range. I want to learn to use a handgun for the sole purpose of defending my life in the unfortunate event I am threatened w/ great bodily harm or death. Is point shooting the way to go? It seems that from reading A LOT of info that no one really ever sees their sights in a defensive shooting. So, should I almost exclusively train like this (I can shoot pretty well using my plain sights – but that takes time…)? Are there any training regimes that you typically use? In essence point shooting is exactly how it sounds right? POINT AND SHOOT --- Please comment b/c I want to train the way I will mostly likely fight.

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    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    I would respect what Sixto has to say, if he sees your post.
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    Point shooting works for me.

    At close range, you simply shoot where you look. With practice, its very quick and very effective.

    Try it will Simunitions or even AirSoft.

    At 5 yards two guys draw and fire.The one that takes the time to use his sights will get hit first.
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    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    It would seem that incredibly few survivors of gunfights ever recall using their sights, regardless of how they trained. Find a gun that you shoot well naturally. For me it's an XD, I can't hit crap with a glock without using the sights. The XD puts 'em where I point. For you, might be the opposite or something else alltogether.
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    There are a lot of different things meant by "point shooting," depending on the instructor. They all take practice. Personally, I would argue that any sort of accurate point shooting is a combination of well indexed physical motions and at least a flash sight picture.

    For me, I practice doing everything right at the range---the grip, the stance, the sight picture, and the trigger control---(not to say it all works all the time, but I practice it ) and the result is that my short range shooting in IDPA scenarios, where I really don't bother to get a full sight picture, improves. Why? Because getting the arms straight out to where I could see the sights and getting a hard grip on the gun to steady it even if I pull the trigger a little too zealously pays off at 3--5 yards.

    And what happens if your self defense scenario is being caught out in the open in the mall atrium against the wacko with an AK 20 yards away from you? That's not a point shooting situation. That's duck behind something and get a good, full sight picture.

    So, my take---short range shooting with quick sight pictures follows from more thorough practice, but practicing only point shooting will never get you accuracy beyond a few yards.
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    I think using the front sight should be part of the skill set. I would never rely on it nor would it be my first choice in a defensive shooting scenario. I want to get rounds on target as quickly as possible after drawing my weapon. Hip shooting, point shooting and shooting while moving are the most important skills.

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    Fist Fire has it right in my opinion. You transition from totally threat focused to totally sight focused depending on the amount of time you have to deal with the threat (and time is a function of distance). At 5 yards, I'm not even going to consider my sights. At 10 that changes. Out beyond 25 yards or so I am going to apply every fundamental of marksmanship that I can muster.

    For my purposes, I've found the XS Big Dot to be just about perfect. When you want the sights for most realistic distances you just put that big dot center mass and squeeze the trigger. YMMV

    As for what people remember seeing- it is debatable. You are in sensory overload and can't process everything that is going on. It is plausible that someone had a perfect sight picture and they simply don't remember it. I can't possibly guess what they actually saw, even if they tell me what they remember seeing. There are also a remarkable number of people that have said they fired 2 or 3 rounds and in reality ran the thing dry.
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    Ditto

    Quote Originally Posted by Cupcake View Post
    It would seem that incredibly few survivors of gunfights ever recall using their sights, regardless of how they trained. Find a gun that you shoot well naturally. For me it's an XD, I can't hit crap with a glock without using the sights. The XD puts 'em where I point. For you, might be the opposite or something else alltogether.
    That's how I normally practice with my XD

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    Possibly generate a list of situations you might encounter and develop an appropriate plan of response to each. Look at your list and alter your training accordingly (ie 25% close quarter, 25% total darkness, 15% in vehicle...)

    Competitions are good not because you get to show off your trophies, but so you are forced to train and practice under pressure.

    You training should make it so you are totally familiar with your gun, are capable of making good decisions under stress, and can hit what you want to hit. Simple
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    Quote Originally Posted by Echo_Four View Post
    As for what people remember seeing- it is debatable. You are in sensory overload and can't process everything that is going on. It is plausible that someone had a perfect sight picture and they simply don't remember it. I can't possibly guess what they actually saw, even if they tell me what they remember seeing.
    My bet is all they saw was the weapon the other guy had....gun or knife or whatever.....

    The problem is that you instinctively focus on that even though you know and have trained to focus on COM. Many shoot outs end up with the weapon hand/arm being shot.........or....no hits at all due to the fact that the shooter was unconsciously focusing and aiming at the threatening weapon.

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    I have been training for years in CQB scenarios without using the sights. It works excellent. Last week I attended a training session that relied on sighting 100%. My groups at 10ft were substandard just because it was something new for me. I say try both and see what sticks and how you feel more comfortable. You will find that a specific method makes more sense than the other. That method will be the right one for you.
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    Its rather easy to learn to instinctive shoot, its more of a mental issue than it is a physical one. Shooting a gun is a very unnatural process, however pointing one isn't. Learn the basics with good trigger control, line up the sights etc. first.

    Once you have mastered that, then just let go mentally the idea that you must use the sights. You don't have sights built into your hand when you point at stuff, and thats all you're doing with the pistol. Its that simple.

    Take things slow, speed will come by itself. If you try to do things quickly, you will just be burning up ammo and not doing yourself any good.

    I know it sounds stupid, but you have to let yourself "become one with the pistol" Know your pistol inside and out, and it should become an extension of your arm. As hokey as that sounds, once you do that, you will improve dramatically.

    There are others here that can explain things much better than I can, I'm much more of a doer than a teacher.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    I know it sounds stupid, but you have to let yourself "become one with the pistol" Know your pistol inside and out, and it should become an extension of your arm. As hokey as that sounds, once you do that, you will improve dramatically.
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    We call it reflex shooting in the army. Works well and I have trained with it a lot. We do shooting while walking drills and also shooting while facing a different direction and quickly turning in a safe manner and putting rounds on target. We usually just use a regular piece of 8 1/2 by 11 paper. We place it about chest level. We consider any rounds in that area a kill or atleast knocking them out of combat.
    With a carbine we practice shooting two rounds everytime we fire at the target. Pistols can be either one or two rounds. You will be surprised how accurate you can get if you train with it extensively.

    The downside is you might not have the area needed to perform these kinds of drills at a normal range. I'm lucky enough to shoot on military ranges or on my own private land.
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