I can't believe I'm saying this.... - Page 3

I can't believe I'm saying this....

This is a discussion on I can't believe I'm saying this.... within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; My son got me started on glocks.We now have three in the house! He young and tends to go for the larger caliber and I ...

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  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array Stetson's Avatar
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    My son got me started on glocks.We now have three in the house! He young and tends to go for the larger caliber and I like 9mm.My next one will be glock 34.


  2. #32
    Senior Member Array jualdeaux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stetson View Post
    My son got me started on glocks.We now have three in the house! He young and tends to go for the larger caliber and I like 9mm.My next one will be glock 34.
    You won't regret it. The 34 is my favourite of the bunch.
    Bend the knees, smooth is fast, watch the front sight.

  3. #33
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    I think I can resist.

  4. #34
    New Member Array GaryV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Electraclyde View Post
    At this time I do not own any Glocks. I have owned G23 (2 of them), a G27, and a G21 (1st generation) I liked shooting all of them especially the G21. Never had any kind of a failure with any of them. I had one Kahr P40 and hated that gun, poorest trigger I have ever fired. Currently have several 1911's and plan to stay with them. I do wish they were as reliable as the Glocks were.
    You need to try a better 1911. From what I've seen in high-round - multiple-gun settings, Glocks aren't really significantly more reliable than any other semi-auto, including well-tuned 1911s. I've seen Glocks FTF, FTE, Double-feed, etc., and I've seen 1911s go 1000s of rounds without a hiccup. Glocks just have the advantage of being made by one company, to only that company's specs, without every wannabe gunsmith out there "tweeking" them, or adding 3rd-party junk to them from Joe Blow's Gun Supply, so you don't get as many of the really crappy guns that you do with something that gets modded, molested, and copied as much as some 1911s do.

  5. #35
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    I resisted for a long time too. But, I now carry a G23 and have for a couple of years.

    However, as much as I love it, I held one of the new XDm pistols tonight and now I am really jonesing for one. It feels like no other gun I have ever held. The grip and ergonomics are far superior to my G23. Not much larger and it holds a full 16 rounds of .40 in the mag. And, it comes with 3 mags and a match grade barrel.

    I will never get rid of my G23 but I see a new XDm in my future.
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  6. #36
    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    I suppose Glocks have a love or hate relationship, you either like em or you don't. I'm glad that Gaston Glock made pistols that low middle class people like myself can afford, and trust our lives with. They're not the prettiest of handguns, but they work, and are quite accurate in spite of their loose tolerances.
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  7. #37
    Member Array packin45's Avatar
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    ....in addition to being very corrosion resistant (a big deal to me, especially after carrying an XD45 Bi-Tone that was rusting around the cocking serrations, despite the fact that it was one year old and got wiped down with oil daily).

    Also, you can get the same basic platform, with the same ergonomics and trigger pull, in 4 popular (and one not-so-popular) calibers, and 3 different sizes.

    And then there's the parts availability (again, especially appreciated after owning an XD).
    G17, G26

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  8. #38
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    Glocks are nice, but save the applause and fanfair and go try out an XD. i wanted a glock until i handled an XD

    I own an XD tactical 45, and owned the xd service model of the same caliber. Their high bore axis [ compared to glock ] didn't turn me on at all when firing it due to muzzle flip. I'll keep the xd but carry the glocks.

    It's just..........firing a Glock is like scoring with a big girl. Yeah, you'll do it....and enjoy it..

    Thats a hell of an assumption isn't it?

    Glocks aren't really significantly more reliable than any other semi-auto, including well-tuned 1911s.

    Yes they are. Well tuned 1911's? The glocks don't need tuning, and run right out of the box, no break in, no worrying about keeping it lubed properly to make it function with any form of reliability, less maintenance overall, etc. I really like the disclaimer when comparing the glock to a 1911--"well tuned 1911" vs stock glock, but then you have to have a well tuned 1911 to have a chance a the same reliability as the glock right?

    They're not the prettiest of handguns, but they work

    I don't buy guns to protect myself based on how pretty they are or pricing. I buy carry guns based on documented reliability. All this talk about grip angle not right, trigger is worse than a 1911, the "feel" of the plastic gun, how it's not pretty, etc, means one hasn't taken the time to run the gun and learn how to shoot it as well.

    I shot and carried 1911's [ many worked on professionally for reliability ] for well over 20 years. None of them was ever as reliable as my first glock 17 or subsequent glocks have been. That first gen 17 has over 90K through it and has nothing but a trigger return spring replaced besides recoil springs being replaced as they got about 10K on them.

    Brownie
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  9. #39
    Member Array jonesy_26's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzQkr View Post
    All this talk about grip angle not right, trigger is worse than a 1911, the "feel" of the plastic gun, how it's not pretty, etc, means one hasn't taken the time to run the gun and learn how to shoot it as well.
    Well, just as you would purchase a glock for its hands down reliability, someone else might NOT purchase a glock because of the grip angle if its not comfortable, or doesn't point natural in their hand. Why should one have to "learn" how to shoot it if the grip isn't agreeable with them or if the trigger doesn't "feel" right? I for one have this issue with glocks, the grip just does not work for me and I tend to pull the trigger over when I shoot it. When I picked up a 1911, the learning curve was very small, ergonomically it just worked better for me. The Kahrs and XD's both have nice grips as well, haven't shot them, but they feel better in my hand than a glock.

  10. #40
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    Why should one have to "learn" how to shoot it if the grip isn't agreeable with them or if the trigger doesn't "feel" right?

    Why? Because they are the most reliable semi auto out of the box on the market, and reliability [ going bang when you pull the trigger ] is paramount to surviving a SD shooting.

    I for one have this issue with glocks, the grip just does not work for me and I tend to pull the trigger over when I shoot it.

    Underlined: Thats a training issue, not some fault of the gun itself.

    Italisized: Thats a training issue as well, not the fault of the gun itself.

    When I picked up a 1911, the learning curve was very small

    So you are saying it is a training issue as I suspected.

    I've had that first gen glock 17 since 87. I carried 1911's [ as mentioned above ] for over 2 decades during the time I owned the g17. I found the same things you've mentioned above back when I bought it, that being the grip didn't feel right, the trigger wasn't as "sweet", didn't point like the 1911's I was used to.

    Guess what-------I moved out here to the heat of the desert and the 1911's don't cut it in 110 heat for me. I went to the safe and dragged out the glock. I WAS going to learn to shoot it as well as my 1911's, period.

    Took a little over 2K in ammo in two range sessions alone and by myself and guess what?--I shoot the glocks as well as any 1911 I've owned [ which has been dozens over 30 years ], or the 3 I presently own.

    It was nothing more than developing the proprioceptors for that gun, but I understand many people will take the easy route out and stay with a 1911 as it's "easier" to shoot for them. Thing is, they aren't as reliable, and I have first hand knowledge of that having carried and shot dozens of 1911's of every flavor and dollar amount between myself and buddies who had them over the years.

    Compromising on reliability to get a better trigger, better grip angle, better ergos, whatever [ which is all very subjective as it related to the individual him/herself ], is not something I'm willing to do at this stage of my life. My glocks will regularly run 6K without cleaning, without lubing/oiling, without any user intervention except pulling the triggers on them. I've not owned any 1911 that would run worth a crap, let alone 6K when not oiled and maintained properly.

    Your arguments fits exactly with my own circumstances and experiences first hand. But I took the time, made the effort to learn the ergos of the glocks. It's in my best interest to do so as GLOCKS reliability is what other guns are comapred to, not the other way around. Until that changes, I'll carry the most reliable gun I can and enjoy the benefit of knowing I do carry the most reliable firearm I can.

    When you are deep in alligators, it's not the time to be worrying about reliability. I'll place the odds in my favor, not against it when the chips are down and learn to run the most reliable gun I can get my hands on [ and thats been a glock ].

    Brownie
    Last edited by Scott; August 15th, 2008 at 09:56 PM. Reason: profanity workaround
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  11. #41
    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    Another thing I like about Glock pistols is, no matter what caliber or size you buy, it field strips the same way. If you own one or two Glocks, then you should be familiar with their field strip procedure. Buying different size 1911s, they all take down a little differently, so you would need to consult the owners manual before taking it apart.
    USMC rule # 23 of gunfighting: Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

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  12. #42
    Member Array jonesy_26's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzQkr View Post
    Why should one have to "learn" how to shoot it if the grip isn't agreeable with them or if the trigger doesn't "feel" right?

    Why? Because they are the most reliable semi auto out of the box on the market, and reliability [ going bang when you pull the trigger ] is paramount to surviving a SD shooting.

    I for one have this issue with glocks, the grip just does not work for me and I tend to pull the trigger over when I shoot it.

    Underlined: Thats a training issue, not some fault of the gun itself.

    Italisized: Thats a training issue as well, not the fault of the gun itself.

    When I picked up a 1911, the learning curve was very small

    So you are saying it is a training issue as I suspected.

    I've had that first gen glock 17 since 87. I carried 1911's [ as mentioned above ] for over 2 decades during the time I owned the g17. I found the same things you've mentioned above back when I bought it, that being the grip didn't feel right, the trigger wasn't as "sweet", didn't point like the 1911's I was used to.

    Guess what-------I moved out here to the heat of the desert and the 1911's don't cut it in 110 heat for me. I went to the safe and dragged out the glock. I WAS going to learn to shoot it as well as my 1911's, period.

    Took a little over 2K in ammo in two range sessions alone and by myself and guess what?--I shoot the glocks as well as any 1911 I've owned [ which has been dozens over 30 years ], or the 3 I presently own.

    It was nothing more than developing the proprioceptors for that gun, but I understand many people will take the easy route out and stay with a 1911 as it's "easier" to shoot for them. Thing is, they aren't as reliable, and I have first hand knowledge of that having carried and shot dozens of 1911's of every flavor and dollar amount between myself and buddies who had them over the years.

    Compromising on reliability to get a better trigger, better grip angle, better ergos, whatever [ which is all very subjective as it related to the individual him/herself ], is not something I'm willing to do at this stage of my life. My glocks will regularly run 6K without cleaning, without lubing/oiling, without any user intervention except pulling the triggers on them. I've not owned any 1911 that would run worth a crap, let alone 6K when not oiled and maintained properly.

    Your arguments fits exactly with my own circumstances and experiences first hand. But I took the time, made the effort to learn the ergos of the glocks. It's in my best interest to do so as GLOCKS reliability is what other guns are comapred to, not the other way around. Until that changes, I'll carry the most reliable gun I can and enjoy the benefit of knowing I do carry the most reliable firearm I can.

    When you are deep in alligators, it's not the time to be worrying about reliability. I'll place the odds in my favor, not against it when the chips are down and learn to run the most reliable gun I can get my hands on [ and thats been a glock ].

    Brownie
    As far as training issues go, the reasonI was pulling the trigger was because the grip angle didn't work for my hand. The angle, combined with my hand's biomechanics and the trigger pull was uncomfortable. I don't consider going to a 1911 taking the "easy way" out. I'm not going to fight basic fit issues. That's like telling someone with very small hands to just "get over" the fact that a double stack grip is just too big for them. Its not the guns fault and its not a training issue....they just don't work well together. Maybe if I spent a few months, I could overcome the issues I had, but the gun isn't doing me any good until then (if I was ever to succeed). It could be the most reliable gun on the planet, but if I can't put lead on target, its a chunk of scrap steel and plastic. You also mention you spent 2K rounds before you shot the glock and 1911 equally. Well, 2K rounds of .45 is the cost of an additional gun! My budget does not allow sessions like this.

    As far as reliability goes, I'm not going to enter the endless debate on what guns are better than others....yes I know glocks are known for this, but my (2) 1911's run fine as plenty of others do. I have had success with both, and I am comfortable trusting my life to either of them.
    Last edited by Scott; August 19th, 2008 at 10:39 PM. Reason: edited quote

  13. #43
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    jonesy_26,

    Good points, if the persons hand/s are not capable of controlling the weapon due to it's total circumference, the weapon is a bad fit.

    You mentioned grip angle and not pointing naturally as contentions against the glock and that was what I responded to where the mention of training was concerned.

    Maybe if I spent a few months, I could overcome the issues I had

    As to grip angle/pointing naturally, yes it can be overcome, I'm one who has done so.

    2K rounds of .45 is the cost of an additional gun! My budget does not allow sessions like this.

    I understand and it's unfortunate for many people that can't afford the cost of 2K in 45acp or other calibers ammo pricing.

    I am comfortable trusting my life to either of them.

    One certainly should have trust in their carry weapon. It would seem most wouldn't carry it if they didn't have some semblance of confidence in it.

    I'm not going to enter the endless debate on what guns are better than others.

    I didn't think we were.

    Brownie
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  14. #44
    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    There is a handgun for every person. They don't call it "personal protection" for nothing! What works for you may not work for someone else, but in the end, their handgun is just as dangerous as yours.
    USMC rule # 23 of gunfighting: Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

    I am the God fearing, gun toting, flag waving conservative you were warned about!

  15. #45
    Member Array Picketeer's Avatar
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    I'm tellin' you - GLOCKs ROCK!
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