This is a discussion on NRA membership and gun registration within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Is there a reason to be "worried" about registering weapons to myself, or joining an organization like the NRA? I know there are people that ...
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Is there a reason to be "worried" about registering weapons to myself, or joining an organization like the NRA? I know there are people that legally carry weapons that they did not purchase because they want to be "off the grid". Is there really a reason to be concerned?
With the BATFE Form 4473 a weapon can be traced to the original purchaser. These forms are maintained by the seller of the FFL dealer until he dies or goes out of business. If the original purchaser sells the gun through a private sale that is where the paperwork trail will end.
As to being a member of the NRA or other gun rights advocacy group, that proves nothing. I know people who are members of the NRA but do not own any guns. I'm a life member of B.A.S.S. but haven't bass fished in over 25 years. Lost interest when I got stationed overseas and never took it back up. I still get the magazine, but that doesn't make me a bass fisherman.
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Thank you for your reply Archer51. I will take your advice on advocacy group membership and I'm very happy to hear from someone with a similar understanding. But..... can you address the concept of private purchase solely for the purpose of owning a weapon that can't be traced to you? I know this might sound like something that shouldn't be discussed on Al Gore's Internet, but I'm truly just curious. (I will purchase my new handguns soon, and will register them to me)
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FWIW, you can not register a weapon to yourself in FL. Such a thing does not exist. Walk into your nearest gun shop or PD and ask how you go about registering a gun if you don't believe me. I also truly believe there is no way to really know a firearm is "off the grid".
And something to consider. I've recently gotten intersted in NFA and Class III firearms. Consider the last amnesty to register machineguns in the Registry. Those who did it legally have an investment that has increased 1000% at least. Those who wrapped the gun in oily rags and hid it in the attic have an instant ticket to a Federal pen that has absolutely no value.
I can't help this because I am a librarian and a stickler for proper terminology. Your info states that you are in Florida. Neither the US nor Florida has gun registration. What we have is a background check to see if you meet the requirements to purchase a firearm. The disqualifiers are fairly easy to understand. You have to be the right age, for a handgun live in the state where the gun is purchased or transferred to you, have not legal or mental conditions that disqualify, be a citizen, or qualified non-citizen. The paperwork that is done is not provide to any governmental agency. The info given over the phone to the NICS operator are name, date of birth, height, weight, SSAN if you provide it, gender, ethnicity, place of birth, and citizenship. The other question asked is what type of firearm. By law that info is to be removed from ATF computers within 24 hours. The FFL who does the transfer is required to keep the 4473 that you filled out permanently. If he goes out of business the documents are transferred to the ATF and placed at the tracing center. This document will include the info about the firearm.Originally Posted by Kaneco
Under normal circumstances there is no reason for the ATF or any government agency to examine a 4473. During an inspection they will be examined for completeness and errors. If there is a reason to trace the gun, i.e. recovered at the scene of a crime, etc. then the tracing center starts at the back of the chain. It starts with the manufacturer and based on serial number finds out where the gun went. It keep checking through distributors and FFLs until it gets to the initial individual purchaser. The purchaser may have had the gun stolen and not know it or sold the gun or any number of other things. The tracing center traces as far as it can and that is the end of the matter for the gun owner.
Could the government come in and demand that FFLs turn over their records to the ATF? Not legally under current law. Can the law be changed? Of course. The thing I recognize is that there are records of millions of transactions out there and they are all on paper. To transfer that all to computer so that there is a list of guns and who bought them would be a massive and time consuming job. It could be done, but not in a few months and maybe not in a few years. It would depend on the size of the workforce put on the job.
With that said would you be safer only buying guns from individuals? Yes. Is it a realistic approach? Well, it depends on what you want, how much you are willing to pay, how soon you want it and how much time you have to put into the search. It is realistic if the person you are talking to has the gun you want at a price you are willing to pay.
George
Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein
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Do you have a CHL? If you're on here, you're probably not off the grid, and most of us are probably on several lists of something. Don't sweat the small stuff, and don't upset your life worrying about trivial stuff either or you'll be worrying all the time.
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None what so ever that I can think of. And Ramrod is right. Many of us belong to a number different lists, groups and organizations.
Please accept my thanks and apprecation if you choose to join the NRA.
Best!
Diddle
Indusrtrial Machine Tool Technician - Certified Refrigeration Technician - CET
NRA Life Member
Be a NRA member!
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What he said !!!
All of us are on some lists ... just don't worry about it.
And definitely join the NRA !!!
The first rule of a gunfight: "Don't be there !"
The second rule: "Bring enough gun"
jfl (NRA Life Member/Instructor - GOA - IDPA - GSSF - ex-IHMSA)
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I suspect most LEO's have a "throw down gun" that can't be traced back to them. Just in case.
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Can't! They gladly took my money, and my brothers money, but they still won't recognize either of us as members a year later. Maybe they have a rule about who can, and can not be a member!
Y'all be safe now, ya hear!
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson
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Excuse me! Could you clarify that, because the way I take it, you just slapped in the face every single honorable current and former LEO who participates in this forum.
To the OP, join the NRA and stand up with the rest of us to protect our rights.
I will support gun control when you can guarantee all guns are removed from this planet. That includes military and law enforcement. When you can accomplish that, then I will be the last person to lay down my gun. Then I will carry the weapon that replaces the gun.
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What? No!
And just exactly how would an LEO discover that a gun could not be traced? Perhaps running the serial #, thus generating a query in the computer. After the LEO "throws it down" and it gets run again, guess where it will show up. Get a freind to run it for you? Same thing and anybody think your friend won't give you up when the detectives show up? If you could even find anybody willing to do something so dumb and potentially career and life destroying for you. You'd be better off not trying to falsify the evidence, that kind of stuff went out when Bill Jordan was a new hire.
Bad insult, dude.
I recently heard about leadsonline.com the local police use this to help solve burglaries. Seems that pawn shops must register all serial numbers of items traded/turned in for loans.
I received a rifle from my dad who purchased it about 30-40 years ago. I then traded it in for a Glock. The gun shop where I traded it in now has the serial number but nobody would know where it has been for the last 30 years. I am pretty certain they have sold it to someone else.
I think fears of systematic future gun confiscation using ATF paperwork are unfounded and those people that only buy undocumented weapons (i.e., from individuals) are paranoid or could not legally make the purchase to begin with.
If you are not a felon or otherwise restricted from firearm purchase dont sweat it.
Yoda, I am, yes.
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Total bull!
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