This is a discussion on I'm steamed... within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; EUREEEEEKA!
> THIS ONE SHOULD SCARE THE HELL OUT OF YOU.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gun Owners of America" <Gun_Owners_of_America@capwiz.mailmanager.net>
June 19th, 2009 07:46 PM
> THIS ONE SHOULD SCARE THE HELL OUT OF YOU.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gun Owners of America" <Gun_Owners_of_America@capwiz.mailmanager.net>
> Ted Kennedy Bill Could Send Your Gun Info Into A Massive Federal
> -- And you could be forced to spend $13,000 of your own money toward
> this effort!
> Gun Owners of America E-Mail Alert
> 8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151
> Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408
> Gun Owners of America
> Tuesday, June 16, 2009
> At long last, Teddy Kennedy has partially revealed the health care
> system he wants to foist on the whole country -- and it isn't pretty.
> It won't be pretty for your pocket book... OR FOR YOUR GUN RIGHTS!
> But first, let us explain what TeddyCare is all about.
> At the center of the plan is what's called a "universal
> mandate." What
> this means is that you -- and virtually everyone in the country -- will
> have to buy as much health insurance as the government demands, and that
> insurance plan will actually have to be approved by the government.
> If you work for a small business, the business will buy the insurance on
> your behalf. But you may be saddled with an enormous part of the cost.
> And, if the employer's contribution is too large, you will be fired.
> If you fail to buy TeddyCare, as the government orders you to do, the
> IRS will fine you, garnish your wages, put a lien on your house, and,
> ultimately, put you in prison.
> How much will you have to spend on your TeddyCare insurance? Teddy's not
> The portion of your paycheck that will have to be forked over to Teddy's
> latest social experiment will be revealed ONLY AFTER THE MASSIVE HEALTH
> CARE BILL IS SIGNED INTO LAW.
> This should set off alarm bells in your brain, because, for instance,
> the average family policy is currently $12,700. "So,"
> proclaims Teddy,
> "everyone's going to get a subsidy to pay for this." There's
> going to
> be a "chicken in every pot," and no one's going to have to
> pay for it.
> Yeah, right. If you're a welfare mother, the government will pay for
> your TeddyCare, and it would pay for it -- the first time -- by taxing
> employer-provided health benefits of working Americans. But if you a
> "working Joe" your Kennedy-subsidy will be a microscopic
> fraction of the
> cost of your mandated TeddyCare insurance policy.
> Okay, all of this sounds ominous... but why is this a gun issue?
> The answer is that TeddyCare will allow radical left Health and Human
> Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius to determine all of the fine print
> in every TeddyCare policy -- which you will be required to buy under
> penalty of imprisonment.
> Currently, as a result of the stimulus bill and a whole lot of other
> factors, the government is rapidly moving in the direction of
> computerizing all of your most confidential medical records and putting
> them into a federal database.
> So remember when your son was asked by his pediatrician about your gun
> collection? That would be in the federal database.
> Or remember when your wife told her gynecologist that she had regularly
> smoked marijuana ten years ago -- thereby potentially barring both her
> and you from ever owning a gun again? That would be in the database.
> Or if a military veteran complains to his psychiatrist that he's had
> emotional stress since coming back to the States, that would be in the
> Or remember when gramps was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, thereby making
> him a "mental defective" who would have to relinquish his
> life-long gun
> collection? That's in there too.
> And, while we are dangerously close to allowing BATFE to troll all of
> that information, TeddyCare would allow Sebelius to put EVERYONE'S
> private data in a database with a stroke of a pen.
> When we say "everyone," we don't mean quite everyone.
> Teddy has conveniently excluded Washington bureaucrats from his
> TeddyCare mandate.
> Also, Teddy and his friends in the media don't want you to hear about
> the details until after the bill is passed. That's why they're trying to
> slam it through within the next month and a half before anyone's had a
> chance to read or debate it.
> In fact, the TeddyCare proposal is currently circulating around Capitol
> Hill without even a bill number.
> ACTION: Urge your two U.S. Senators to oppose Sen. Ted Kennedy's
> mandate that will result in the registration of all your gun
> Please forward this email to your friends and family and urge them to
> contact their Senators as well.
> You can go to the Gun Owners Legislative Action Center at
> http://www.gunowners.org/activism.htm to send your Senators the
> pre-written e-mail message below.
June 19th, 2009 10:12 PM
Wow, that story is hard to believe, and I'm a practicing physician! Since I'm a member of this forum, I'm obviously pro-gun, but even if I weren't, I can't imagine having the desire or time to go nitpicking into my patient's personal choices on gun ownership! Yeah, I talk to my patients about exercising, not eating too much, smoking, etc. etc. etc. If I had to throw in gun safety, I suppose I'd have to through in swimming safety, bicycle safety, fire safety, don't answer the door for strangers, ad infinitum. Your "doctor" must not have very many patients, particularly if he has time to make a home visit! If I were making home visits for every "risky" behavior I came across, I'd spend all day going house to house pulling the forks out of the mouths of all my overweight diabetics!
So yeah, I'd probably advise finding a new doctor also. Come on down to SC. Every doc in my office carries, including the lady doc!
June 19th, 2009 10:20 PM
This one should scare the hell out of you, no!
It is real easy for those who have good health, no chronic conditions, and jobs that provide decent health insurance to throw stones at the idea of finally putting the crooks who cost us 20-30% of our health care dollar for administrative expenses and profits in their place.
Originally Posted by Zsnake
There are two different issues being addressed above.
1) Do we get to have universal coverage. We need it desperately.
2) Computerized records and information sharing.
That second one is more concerning because of the potential for misuse, but it is happening already anyhow.
I'm tired of hearing about 50 something individuals who having lost a job lost their ability to purchase insurance-- at any price.
I'm tired of hearing of twenty somethings unable to get insurance because of minor medical issues, or not being able to get jobs because the employer fears hiring them would raise the insurance rates for the group.
I'm tired of 30 somethings and 40 somethings finding that they pay more for insurance than for income taxes, or finding out that a relatively minor illness can put them into financial catastrophe and bankruptcy; everyone thinks it can never happen to them. If you are one of those everyones, think again.
I've been ripped for thousands by the Blues through the years---there was always an excuse why they wouldn't pay, or pay what they owed. The present health insurance industry is little more than criminal organized fraud.
Since our country lacks the backbone to shoot the criminals behind our present non-system, the least we can do is try to make it work better for everyone.
No more Harry and Louise ads thank you.
Ignore the carping scare tactics of the CPR crowd and its TV ads. They are just trying to scare the heck out of you so those behind the ads can keep making billions on your misery.
And by the way. I've got great insurance. It is called Medicare. And I have great secondary insurance. Single payer primary insurance with a secondary coverage through private insurance market is the way to go.
A mandate is the only way it can be made to work, otherwise those who think they are healthy and those who think they will never have an accident, won't buy insurance and the rest of us will continue to pay for their care one way or another with higher insurance rates for ourselves.
There are twin evils at play in our present system. Greed and greed.
Greed by the insurance industry and greed by practitioners who have an entitlement mentality.
Its time to put a stop to it.
June 19th, 2009 10:28 PM
Apparently many docs put gun talk above diabetes
Apparently many of your colleagues think gun safety ranks right up there with diabetes.
Originally Posted by DrJ
Mine (on the first visit) had a questionnaire asking if I had guns in my home. I answered yes to see how she would react. When she got to that part of my history she merely said that she was asking in case there are children in the house.
Sounds nice. Sounds well intentioned. Probably is well intentioned, but as you point out, she didn't ask about a swimming pool, a bicycle, fire alarms, or other similar hazards.
Someone has put many practitioners up to asking this type of question, and it wasn't "the government." Think about that.
June 19th, 2009 10:39 PM
I made a comment and my Doctor realized I rode a motorcycle.... and immediately told me how I needed to stop.... for my health.
I told him at that point, the next dang thing you'll tell me to give up skydiving and rattlesnake hunting too..... forget it.
We don't have to answer any question by a Doctor or for that matter, anyone else. Some times, it's a good thing to remember.
June 19th, 2009 10:44 PM
Sixto,I remember when my kids were you the doctors asked the wife ,kids and me. I clearly remember the conversation with the doctor when I asked what
difference does it make and who wants to know and what are you doing with the complied information.First thing out of his mouth was unsecured guns were dangerous with young kids and I told him not mine he was brought up with them and there's no mystery with them;they kill no second chances ! I also told the doctor I didn't like being question or my family being question about guns he claimed Uncle Sam wanted this data.Kids are all grown up and never been asked
about this stupid question again ! One other thing you are a minority you are a traditional family which is rare today.
June 19th, 2009 10:46 PM
Copy and print the following and insist your doc fill in the blanks and sign it:
FIREARMS SAFETY COUNSELING REPRESENTATION:
PHYSICIAN QUALIFICATIONS AND LIABILITY
Part One: Qualifications
I affirm that I am certified to offer (Name of Patient: ), herineafter referred to as "the Patient", qualified advice about firearms safety in the home, having received:
Specify Course(s) of Study: __________________________________________________ __________
Specify Institution(s) __________________________________________________ __________
Specify Course Completion Date(s): __________________________________________________ ____
Specify Accreditation(s), Certification(s), License(s) etc.: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________
Check one, as appropriate:
___ I represent that I have reviewed applicable scientific literature pertaining to defensive gun use and beneficial results of private firearms ownership. I further represent that I have reviewed all other relevant home safety issues with the Patient, including those relating to electricity, drains, disposals, compactors, garage doors, driveway safety, pool safety, pool fence codes and special locks for pool gates, auto safety, gas, broken glass, stored cleaning chemicals, buckets, toilets, sharp objects, garden tools, home tools, power tools, lawnmowers, lawn chemicals, scissors, needles, forks, knives, etc. I also acknowledge, by receiving this document, I have been made aware that, in his inaugural address before the American Medical Association on June 20, 2001, new president Richard Corlin, MD, admitted "What we don't know about violence and guns is literally killing us...researchers do not have the data to tell how kids get guns, if trigger locks work, what the warning signs of violence in schools and at the workplace are and other critical questions due to lack of research funding." (UPI). In spite of this admission, I represent that I have sufficient data and expertise to provide expert and clinically sound advice to patients regarding firearms in the home.
___ I am knowingly engaging in Home/Firearms Safety Counseling without certification, license or formal training in Risk Management, and; I have not reviewed applicable scientific literature pertaining to defensive gun use and beneficial results of private firearms ownership.
Part Two: Liability
I have determined, from a review of my medical malpractice insurance, that if I engage in an activity for which I am not certified, such as Firearms Safety Counseling, the carrier (check one, as appropriate):
___ will not
cover lawsuits resulting from neglect, lack of qualification, etc.
Insurance Carrier name, address and policy number insuring me for firearms safety expertise:
I further warrant that, should the Patient follow my firearm safety counseling and remove from the home and/or disable firearms with trigger locks or other mechanisms, and if the patient or a family member, friend or visitor is subsequently injured or killed as a result of said removal or disabling, that my malpractice insurance and/or personal assets will cover all actual and punitive damages resulting from a lawsuit initiated by the patient, the patient's legal reprerentative, or the patient's survivors.
Signature of attesting physician and date: __________________________________________________ _
Name of attesting physician (please print):___________________________________________ _______
Signature of patient and date: __________________________________________________ __________
Name of patient (please print):___________________________________________ _________________
Note to patient: Indicate if physician "REFUSED TO SIGN", and if so, require physician to place copy in chart/medical record.
"If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan
June 20th, 2009 12:15 AM
Don't answer the question whether it's written or oral, just smile and say next question.
Turn the election's in 2014 to a "2A Revolution". It will serve as a 1994 refresher not to "infringe" on our Second Amendment. We know who they are now.........SEND 'EM HOME. Our success in this will be proportional to how hard we work to make it happen.
June 20th, 2009 12:30 AM
Hi Doc, thanks for the reply. It actually is a very big practice with several Docs. My wife is a doc too, she was a little taken back by the whole thing as well.
Originally Posted by DrJ
My own doc is a cool guy, we trap shoot together and he's my medic on the SWAT team. I trust the man completely. He saved my life or limbs more than once.
June 20th, 2009 08:08 AM
find the doc's attitude, not to mention his/her desire to have a home visit to see how you store guns to be ridiculous, and I'm a medical professional. And giving your wife a hard time about it also blows. If it was me, the next time that I was sick, I would call his/her office to find out when he would be over to take care of me. No house calls? Well, if he can make a house call to see how I store my guns, which has absolutely nothing to do with my medical care, he can certainly come to my house to care for me in the area that he's supposed to be involved in.
June 20th, 2009 02:25 PM
HAPPY NEW YEAR
June 20th, 2009 02:33 PM
Sir, you did better than I would have done. I would have gone down to the office myself to give them a piece of my mind, which would be filled with language too explicit to post.
I do, long as you don't mind the reloading equipment. Then again, my couch is pretty comfortable.
Originally Posted by SIXTO
Vis consili expers mole ruit sua.
June 20th, 2009 09:37 PM
Sorry if this seems a little off topic, but in a way it has a correlation to the OP. For folks living in Texas:
Parental Rights In Jeopardy: Ask Gov. Perry to Veto SB 1440 Texas Legislative Update
Yesterday, Governor Perry Vetoed SB 1440
Governor Perry will be attacked by the leftists and the media.
SB 1440 allows CPS to enter your home and take your child from you where ever your child can be found, without prior notice, without a prior hearing, without a search warrant for an “interview, examination, and investigation.” The law previously required a showing of “good cause.” This requirement has now been eliminated under SB 1440. This series of attacks on your family can take place “based on information available”-which could be an anonymous caller who believes “abuse” or “neglect” “may be” taking place in the home. This unconstitutional law can also be used to access your child’s medical records, without your consent, against your objections, and without prior notice.
It wouldn't hurt to send a supportive e-mail to Governor Perry, thanking him for taking a stand in the battle to protect children from intrusive and abusive actions by CPS.
Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy. — Winston Churchill
June 20th, 2009 09:56 PM
Good thing my kids doc carries a 40 glock and a Kel Tec P3AT.
"You cannot invade mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass." - Admiral Yamamoto
June 21st, 2009 12:02 AM
That poor head of hair with nothing underneath
That poor head of hair with nothing underneath excuse of a governor and our attny general amply demonstrated that they don't care a thing at all about civil right with the manner in which they raided the mormon compund and seized hundreds of children on the basis of a fraudulent complaint. The judge also demonstrated a lack of concern for parental rights and civil rights.
Originally Posted by Patti
Perry is no model on much of anything but a guy with good looks and too much ambition.
And since Patti you don't live here, you might not be aware that there are plenty of other indications that he needs to go.
He and his cronies just created a big mess at Texas A&M U by slandering and firing the University President who was doing a fine job, is a fine person, and was doing well for the University---and I know because she is a friend. They (Board of Reagents on Governor's initiative) attempted to make a place for Perry as Chancellor---just in case Kay B. Hutchinson happens to beat him in the next primary; which I hope she does. Can you say, "dirty and corrupt?"
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