Fully Automatic Weapon

This is a discussion on Fully Automatic Weapon within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I have been told (and my BS detector went off) that if you turn a AR-15 into an automatic weapon that is registered with the ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array Pete14's Avatar
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    Fully Automatic Weapon

    I have been told (and my BS detector went off) that if you turn a AR-15 into an automatic weapon that is registered with the proper authorities that it is not transferable when the owner of record passes away and that the government will destroy the weapon when you die.

    Does anyone know if this is true or not?

    P.S.: I don't have one and don't plan on it but it just sounded crazy and paranoid.

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
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    Might depend on the state. IIRC, in NC you can do a "trust" for your NFA weapons and anyone on the trust can inherit the weapon with no extra fees. If it is registered to your person, you would have to get the NFA paperwork and pay the taxes before taking ownership. If neither you could probably get an NFA dealer to move it for you. I don't think the Gov is going to come after it. I don't do the NFA thing so someone may correct me. But I have looked into it a bit, just a bit too rich for my blood right now.

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    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete14 View Post
    I have been told (and my BS detector went off) that if you turn a AR-15 into an automatic weapon that is registered with the proper authorities that it is not transferable when the owner of record passes away and that the government will destroy the weapon when you die.

    Does anyone know if this is true or not?

    P.S.: I don't have one and don't plan on it but it just sounded crazy and paranoid.
    you can not convert an AR to fully auto. You would need a different lower, hammer, disconnect, safety, detents, and associated springs and pins as well as have the other 12 or 13 parts for the fully auto part.

    All the parts needed are ATF tracked and controlled. They aren't readily available and are expensive.
    The M4 and M16 have parts the AR 15 was never designed to have. The AR is a civilian version of the military rifle and was not ment to be full auto

    The anti-gun people seem to think its an easy thing and you should listen to your BS meter.

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    Distinguished Member Array kazzaerexys's Avatar
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    Disclaimer: I have never owned any NFA weapons.

    That said, the 1986 federal law says it is unlawful to own a fully-automatic weapon manufactured after that date. There are, thus, extreme limits on how one would turn a post-1986 AR into an automatic weapon.

    I think (and am happy to be corrected) that there are only two options: install a pre-1986 full-auto sear with a valid tax stamp into your gun, or get one of the FFL dealer exceptions.

    Once the legal NFA gun is created, it should be no different than any other NFA weapon. Put it in your will and legally transfer it to somebody else who can get the tax stamp and own it. I don't believe there are "gun police" swooping in on estate auctions to cart NFA weapons off to the big bucket o' Dip...
    “What is a moderate interpretation of [the Constitution]? Halfway between what it says and [...] what you want it to say?” —Justice Antonin Scalia

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Parts aren't that hard to get,they cost a little more than AR15 parts,If you have a AR15 and M16 parts the ATF considers that as a machinegun even if they aren't installed,It is Illegal to convert An AR15 to FA you will go to prison if and when caught.Everybody I know that has legal FA's have them in a trust
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    Member Array Pete14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    you can not convert an AR to fully auto. You would need a different lower, hammer, disconnect, safety, detents, and associated springs and pins as well as have the other 12 or 13 parts for the fully auto part.

    All the parts needed are ATF tracked and controlled. They aren't readily available and are expensive.
    The M4 and M16 have parts the AR 15 was never designed to have. The AR is a civilian version of the military rifle and was not ment to be full auto

    The anti-gun people seem to think its an easy thing and you should listen to your BS meter.
    This says I can: Drop In Auto Sear

    By the way my AR is a 1981.
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    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete14 View Post
    This says I can: Drop In Auto Sear

    By the way my AR is a 1981.
    Read please...


    The Drop In Auto Sear (DIAS) is a device that is adds an auto sear to an otherwise semi-automatic AR-15 so that when used with M-16 fire control parts including an M-16 carrier produces full auto fire. The DIAS is referred to as a "Drop In" as this piece can be added to an AR-15 without drilling a receiver for a traditional auto sear. Following is a photo of a registered Drop In Auto Sear (rDIAS) made by JCB and registered before 1986.
    you need more then the auto sear

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    Member Array Pete14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    you can not convert an AR to fully auto.
    This is what I was disputing. With the right parts (and alot of money) I could with the right permits. I wouldn't alter my AR because it was my Dad's and it has sentimental value.

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    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete14 View Post
    This is what I was disputing. With the right parts (and alot of money) I could with the right permits. I wouldn't alter my AR because it was my Dad's and it has sentimental value.
    I understand that but you can't convert the AR to full auto. You have to convert the AR to an M16 platform first (a totally different rifle). That isn't the same thing.

    The anti gun nuts play it up that you can readily convert an AR to fire in full auto with minimal effort. The companies that market "drop in sear" kits and such just add gas onto the fire. It may drop in but it will not work without further modification and the use of restricted machine gun parts.

    An AR and M16 work similar and have some parts that look alike but they both operate in a very different way.

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete14 View Post
    This is what I was disputing. With the right parts (and alot of money) I could with the right permits. I wouldn't alter my AR because it was my Dad's and it has sentimental value.
    A legal DIAS is the machinegun,It's registered with the ATF,you can slap the auto sear in any AR15 with the M16 fire control parts and turn it into a machinegun.What you cannot do is take a 1981 semi auto AR15 convert it to FA by installing M16 parts and drilling and installing the M16 auto sear.Also you just don't drop in an auto sear it has to be adjusted and timed so it doesn't release the hammer too early or too late
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    Member Array Pete14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    I understand that but you can't convert the AR to full auto. You have to convert the AR to an M16 platform first (a totally different rifle). That isn't the same thing.
    My bad I had understood that the difference was basically one was full auto. Didn't realize they were that different internally. I don't know a whole lot about AR's but they are neat guns. This was my Dad's that I inherited.

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    Distinguished Member Array razor02097's Avatar
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    The armalite corp. did a fine job making the first civilian version of the famed M16 rifle. It is still enjoyed today by millions of gun owners. The idea of converting a civilian rifle to an M16 spawned the full auto sear kits you find. They do require the M16 parts and an experienced gunsmith to install.

    Unfortunately the anti gun lobbyists of today put the "if it looks and quacks like a duck, it’s a duck" philosophy to our beloved sporting rifles. They hear what they want to hear. All they would read is AR 15, full auto, and kit in the same sentance and they start spewing nonsense out about people shooting up places with easily converted rifles... they have nothing to back their statements and there is a very very very very small percentage of rifles that have ever been converted to an M16 type lower.

    To really convert a rifle you would need the M16 bolt, hammer, sear, disconnect, select fire switch, safety detent, trigger, full auto sear and detents, pins, springs and screws. Then to fit it in you would need an M16 lower. Keep in mind that the M4 parts arn't nessesarily compatible either since I believe they went to burst fire on certain models.

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    Member Array Pete14's Avatar
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    I didn't even know until recently that the A in AR stands for Armalite.

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    Distinguished Member Array AutoFan's Avatar
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    If you legally own an NFA item, when you die, you can leave it to someone in your will. If that person can possess an NFA item, and passes the ATF background check, it will then pass to them without paying the $200 tax.

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    New Member Array Mopar40's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
    I understand that but you can't convert the AR to full auto. You have to convert the AR to an M16 platform first (a totally different rifle). That isn't the same thing.

    The anti gun nuts play it up that you can readily convert an AR to fire in full auto with minimal effort. The companies that market "drop in sear" kits and such just add gas onto the fire. It may drop in but it will not work without further modification and the use of restricted machine gun parts.

    An AR and M16 work similar and have some parts that look alike but they both operate in a very different way.

    Sorry to bust your bubble but my dad works for the sheriff department here and they had a drop in sear. we located and purchased the bolt carrier and fire control for not much more than you would pay for the ar bolt carrier and saftey. the carrier anybody can own. but when you add the auto sear is when it comes to havin a class 2 or 3 ffl or law enforement
    aus71383 likes this.

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