Let's talk springs

This is a discussion on Let's talk springs within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I want to start toying with my recoil spring. I'm considering adding 2 to 4 lbs. I shot a P228 with a 4lb heavier spring, ...

Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: Let's talk springs

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array C9H13NO3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    1,513

    Let's talk springs

    I want to start toying with my recoil spring. I'm considering adding 2 to 4 lbs. I shot a P228 with a 4lb heavier spring, and it was damn smooth. I'd like to tune up my 229. I know a little about springs, but would like some insight before I start tuning.

    Recoil Spring - From what I understand, heavier than stock makes the gun run smoother. I've heard you want to run the heaviest spring you can while still enabling the gun to cycle fully and reliably with the ammo you shoot.

    Magazine Spring - According to Wolf Gunsprings, if you go with a heavier recoil spring, you might want heavier magazine springs because there's less time for the magazine to feed a round. Couldn't this also cause problems with doublefeed though? Or would that only happen with stronger mag springs and a standard recoil spring?

    Extractor Spring - I don't see how you could see benefits from tuning this away from stock. If it's weak, it's going to leave shells in the chamber, if it's at stock specs, should run reliably. Anyone with more insight?

    Firing Pin Spring - This just pushes the firing pin back after firing. Wolf says they ship them with their stiffer recoil springs. What benefits/detriments would you see from changing the weight of the firing pin spring?

    Mainspring - You want the lightest possible without having light primer strikes. For a carry gun, I think I would always leave this stock. Input?
    -Ryan

    All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    Senior Member Array Shadowsbane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    1,051
    For a carry gun I would leave everything stock. Except possibly night sights

    I also know that extractor spring power is increased in ARs to improve functionality. My guess is that in a rifle they grip onto the rim of the casing better to aid in extraction. Particularly useful when you engage in modifications that can affect the timing.
    Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.

    www.Lonelymountainleather.com

  4. #3
    Moderator
    Array gasmitty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Gilbert, AZ
    Posts
    10,392
    Quote Originally Posted by C9H13NO3 View Post
    I want to start toying with my recoil spring. I'm considering adding 2 to 4 lbs. I shot a P228 with a 4lb heavier spring, and it was damn smooth. I'd like to tune up my 229. I know a little about springs, but would like some insight before I start tuning.

    Recoil Spring - From what I understand, heavier than stock makes the gun run smoother. I've heard you want to run the heaviest spring you can while still enabling the gun to cycle fully and reliably with the ammo you shoot.

    Magazine Spring - According to Wolf Gunsprings, if you go with a heavier recoil spring, you might want heavier magazine springs because there's less time for the magazine to feed a round. Couldn't this also cause problems with doublefeed though? Or would that only happen with stronger mag springs and a standard recoil spring?

    Extractor Spring - I don't see how you could see benefits from tuning this away from stock. If it's weak, it's going to leave shells in the chamber, if it's at stock specs, should run reliably. Anyone with more insight?

    Firing Pin Spring - This just pushes the firing pin back after firing. Wolf says they ship them with their stiffer recoil springs. What benefits/detriments would you see from changing the weight of the firing pin spring?

    Mainspring - You want the lightest possible without having light primer strikes. For a carry gun, I think I would always leave this stock. Input?
    This is one of those areas where "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing."

    SIGS are among the most reliable guns out there... I would stick to stock spring replacements. Don't try to second-guess the factory! If you are shooting "softball" reloads and you're not getting proper ejection, then perhaps substitute a softer spring just for range work.

    I have a few thousand rounds of mixed .45 thru my Sig 220... it handles the mild reloads just as well as hardball and full-power JHP. If your gun is accurate in your hands with your choice of ammo, don't mess with it!

    If you were asking about a 1911, I'd have a different answer, but - we're not!
    Smitty
    NRA Endowment Member

  5. #4
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Fayetteville, AR
    Posts
    13,687
    Recoil spring.........a heavier than stock recoil spring is going to be harder on your pistol. You may also experience more recoil. Reason some manufacturers send a heavier rated firing pin spring in a kit along with a heavier rated recoil spring is because of the force and momentum. With a stiffer recoil spring, you want the firing pin to stay where it is when the slide closes.
    I just don't see how folks would be 'tuning' their pistols by changing springs every time they change ammo. I shoot such a broad range of ammo that I'd go nuts swapping things around all the time. If you do competition with reloads or something, I might see that. Actually lighter recoil springs should yield less recoil and better follow-up shots as the slide cycles slower and there is less momentum and force. I'd say in general that the factory does know best for the average pistol and the average user with a wide range of ammo.

  6. #5
    Member Array Archie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Hastings, Nebrasksa - the Heartland!
    Posts
    313

    Hello Charley

    Couple things you lack here.

    Recoil spring ideally is balanced against the user. Basic rule is the stronger the grip or more recoil from ammo, the harder the spring. At some point, the stiffer spring will start beating the slide and frame as the action closes. However, if the ejected brass gets tossed more than about five or six feet to first bounce, you could use a stiffer spring.

    The firing pin spring needs to be balanced against the recoil spring. If the slide slams too hard, a weak firing pin can allow the inertial firing pin to slam into the primer. So 'tis said. Usually a stiffer recoil spring comes with a stiffer firing pin spring; it can't hurt.

    Extractors get to be complicated. A functioning extractor is the combination of length and angle of claw, as well as the angle of the extractor arm and spring pressure. Until one gets to know all the details, it's a trial and error process.

    The mainspring or hammer spring. A lighter spring will soften the trigger pull. But make sure it has enough snap to activate the primer. Activate the primer all the time. Activate ANY primer ALL the time.

    Also - and I don't know if this applies - a softer hammer spring will make for a mushier single action trigger.

    Magazine springs. I've never had a problem with it. Here's the caveat: My experience in this is limited to Colt Government Models only. I've run 24 pound recoil springs and never had a magazine problem due to spring pressure. I don't know about SIGs.

    Firearms manufacturers build guns and install springs to function in the widest variety of situations. They can be improved in function on various levels. They can also be screwed up pretty bad, as well. If you wish to start experimenting, do so carefully and slowly. test everything prior to betting your safety on the modification or alteration. And if you screw something up, you may end up paying a pistolsmith to fix it. Good pistolsmiths are often neurotic and can be quite merciless; be warned.

    You'll more than likely learn something in the process.
    Anyone Worth Shooting Is Worth Shooting Well
    Please take a look at my Blog: http://oldmanmontgomery.wordpress.com/

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array automatic slim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    The western edge of The Confederacy
    Posts
    2,198
    If it's not broken, don't fix it...
    "First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand."
    Edge of Darkness

  8. #7
    Distinguished Member Array C9H13NO3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    1,513
    I think that's part of it for me...stock springs are designed with "one size fits all" as far as what ammo you're shooting. If you're handloading and always shooting the exact same loads, why not set up your springs so they work BEST with that ammo? It may not work with cheap ammo, low power rounds, etc...but if you're not shooting that stuff, why worry about it? They make different weight springs for a reason...if stock was always best, there wouldn't be a market for it.
    -Ryan

    All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.

  9. #8
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Fayetteville, AR
    Posts
    13,687
    Quote Originally Posted by C9H13NO3 View Post
    They make different weight springs for a reason...if stock was always best, there wouldn't be a market for it.
    Who does? The original manufacturer? Reasons? You are going to start experimenting with your carry pistol? See...thing is, the OEM spring systems were set up the way they were for a reason.....a wide span of reliability over a broad range of circumstances. Once you change anything in a stock pistol (other than stock OEM items available), you're narrowing down that reliability factor considerably. IMO....you're also going to cost yourself in time, efforts, and ammo just testing things out to be completely confident, and also I might add....you'll more than likely be changing more than one thing at a time which in handyman terms isn't the best thing to do once you go troubleshooting after the fact. As we've already discussed the recoil spring/firing pin spring kits that pretty much go along with each other....that's changing two parts at one time. My P220 SAO came with a factory recoil spring rating of 20lb.....double wound spring at that. By gosh it's the toughest pistol I own to rack the slide all the way back to chamber a round from a full mag sometimes. I see where you are coming from, and I myself question the engineers at my work sometimes daily because I have to deal with their concepts on a regular basis. Most of those are still in the learning process, and quite frankly, I don't think some of them will ever get it right. Thing is....they don't have a lengthy history in a single subject like firearms engineering, design, and testing. Either way, engineering in general still pretty much relies on statistics and results after a design change to make it or break it. I'm still not trying to dissuade you in any way on trying something different, and what you think might be better...but listen to this quote:
    if stock was always best, there wouldn't be a market for it.
    Today....there's a market for anything and everything...it's the sales pitch that makes part of the difference, and the other is those who think they need it after the sales pitch that keeps that market going. Have you ever seen a Kansas turd bird? Do you need a bird made out of turd? I've seen them, and I'll bet they're still selling somewhere to tourists from who knows where. You'd just have to be from Kansas to understand.
    You asked for insight. I only give less than 100% on a bad day, and those days are few and far between.

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. sp 101 springs?
    By usmc0811 in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: January 30th, 2011, 02:57 PM
  2. Bad range day, with new springs
    By j21blackjack in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: October 25th, 2010, 04:03 PM
  3. Replies: 51
    Last Post: May 20th, 2010, 11:40 AM
  4. Wolff Springs
    By Miggy in forum Related Gear & Equipment
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: July 14th, 2007, 07:49 PM
  5. Let's Talk About Magazine Springs
    By QKShooter in forum Related Gear & Equipment
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: September 12th, 2005, 11:06 PM

Search tags for this page

how often should you change sig springs on a p220

,
light main spring sig p220
,

p228 hammer spring

,
sig p220 carry sas recoil spring
,

sig p220 hammer spring

,

sig p220 heavy recoil spring

,
sig p220 heavy recoil springs
,

sig p220 magazine spring

,

sig p228 hammer spring

,

sig p228 recoil spring

,

sig p228 recoil spring weight

,
sig sauer hammer spring
Click on a term to search for related topics.