what would you do in situation?

This is a discussion on what would you do in situation? within the Home (And Away From Home) Defense Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by Bark'n [B]Which is why I pointed out in my first post, it is my intention not to let it get far enough ...

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 39

Thread: what would you do in situation?

  1. #16
    Member Array TXcougar8000's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Spring, TX
    Posts
    55
    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    [B]Which is why I pointed out in my first post, it is my intention not to let it get far enough to turn into an armed robbery. If I see a man approaching me from a distance as this man did with a gun sticking out of his waistband, I'm going to order him to stop as I clear my cover garment and place my hand on my gun.
    A very understandable and important viewpoint, but my response was tied in to the idea of hosing the thug in gasoline. As I see this situation, a man was approached by another man with a gun and demanded money. The scenario dictates that we would have to operate under the same faculties the victim had (i.e. no gun, OC spray, knife, etc...). The victim had no equal means of self defense and complied with the thug. If it were me personally I would employ different tactics and modes of self defense, but in the case of the victim, he chose to leave his life up to chance.
    "Eternal Vigilance is the Price of Liberty"
    -Wendell Phillips

    Men trained in arms from their infancy, and animated by the love of liberty, will afford neither a cheap nor easy conquest.
    -The Declaration of the Continental Congress, July 1775

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #17
    Moderator
    Array Bark'n's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    West Central Missouri
    Posts
    9,917
    Quote Originally Posted by TXcougar8000 View Post
    A very understandable and important viewpoint, but my response was tied in to the idea of hosing the thug in gasoline. As I see this situation, a man was approached by another man with a gun and demanded money. The scenario dictates that we would have to operate under the same faculties the victim had (i.e. no gun, OC spray, knife, etc...). The victim had no equal means of self defense and complied with the thug. If it were me personally I would employ different tactics and modes of self defense, but in the case of the victim, he chose to leave his life up to chance.
    I didn't read it as having to be unarmed with our response. As the original poster stated in his last paragraph on what he would do, would be to try and distract him so he could draw his own gun. I took it as what would we do giving our current state of readiness if the same scenario played out on us. Since I carry full time, I would be going for my gun.

    If I were unarmed, using the gasoline nozzle is an option. However, with 15 years of firefighting experience, using the gas hose as an improvised flame thrower would never be an option I would willingly want to try unless there was just no other way. The nozzle of a gasoline fuel pump was never designed to be a flame thrower. Yes, it can be used as one, but my God, it could have disastrous results for the operator of such a weapon. Flame throwers never used straight gasoline. They had a gelling agent mixed with the fuel. It's the vapors of the gas which are highly volatile. Depending on the ambient temperature, air density and the humidity at the time, you could be totally engulfed in a fire ball as the vapors surrounding you ignite.

    Would I ever try to use a gas pump as an improvised flame thrower? Maybe, but it is way, way down the list of options in my toolbox.
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  4. #18
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    5,272
    I believe that being doused and probably blinded with gas without the flames would probably be pretty effective.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  5. #19
    Moderator
    Array Bark'n's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    West Central Missouri
    Posts
    9,917
    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    I believe that being doused and probably blinded with gas without the flames would probably be pretty effective.
    Well, there's no doubt the psychological factor of just being hosed down with gas would be a good attitude adjustment for the criminal. I'll definitely keep that in mind.

    But if it does get lit, I still don't want the paint on my truck getting scorched and blistered by the heat.
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,579
    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    Extract hose, point at robber while maintaining finger pressure on hose valve.
    Great idea, except that bullets are cheaper than gas, lol.

    This same thing happened to me 5-6 years ago, and I posted it here in another thread somewhere. I was trapped between the open door of my truck. the gas hose blocking a quick exscape and the pumps when man walked upon me from nowhere. This is a very realistic situation to find onesself in.
    Last edited by glockman10mm; January 4th, 2011 at 04:51 PM.

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    5,272
    As virtually always, it would depend on the exact circumstances. My thought is that the removing of the nozzle from the vehicle would not be an unexpected movement by the perp, therefor would not raise his alert level until it was too late, unlike a move to draw. Using such a tactic, I would expect to drop the hose right after dousing him, shutting it off, and draw and move to the front or rear end, depending, for cover.

    Bark'n,
    I don't have a fancy paint job.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  8. #22
    VIP Member Array Old School's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Florida Treasure Coast
    Posts
    3,211

    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by Guantes View Post
    Extract hose, point at robber while maintaining finger pressure on hose valve.
    Then again with a little help from Mr. Zippo............


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mQwZLr_qRI
    "Violence is seldom the answer, but when it is the answer it is the only answer".

    "A nation of sheep breeds a government of wolves".

    http://www.woundedwarriorproject.org/

  9. #23
    Distinguished Member Array bladenbullet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    englewood, fl
    Posts
    1,751
    i like the hose down if it indeed came to the point that i was faced with an armed aggressor demanding money...be forewarned though...the open fuel tank is spewing fumes from the fresh fill and the amount of fumes around you are gonna be a bomb in the event the situation goes to fire...youre not going to want to be in close proximity and the pump will not be a good flamethrower as the fumes around it will torch the operator...

    i am going to stop barkn from clearing cover and exposing his firearm in full view of someone with a gun in their wasteband before knowing their intent as if it does turn out to be another concealed carry with poor fashion sense youre liable to end up in a gun fight with someone asking directions and seeing you go for a gun...

    i would suggest the cover of the pump and an order to stop where they are and state their business...theres plenty of cover at a pump and not many fools are dumb enough to start pumping shots into a gas pump to rob you...youll have plenty of time to clear a firearm from cover if necessary or youll be turning an aggressor away...if you want you can carry the nozzle with you pointed at the person as you remove it so they understand the possibilities and stop immediately....

    this is what it looks like at a pump when gas ignites....you are standing in a cloud of fumes rushing out of the filler neck of your car...this one is mild...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9MQ3C9GEEc

  10. #24
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    5,272
    The fire danger was part of my thinking on hosing him then immediately dropping the hose and retreating around the end of the vehicle.
    IF he was observed soon enough with the exposed weapon, I can see clearing and gripping, but not drawing. That should put you way ahead, but could cause problems if you misread the situation. With the hose, he has already made clear that its a robbery. There is always submit to the demands or DATD. As always circumstances, at the time, will be imperative in action determination.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  11. #25
    Member Array dgreen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    125
    Quote Originally Posted by Devilsclaw View Post
    A snarly civil attorney for the "victims" family would love to pull this statement from an internet forum and use it against you. Just saying, beware what you post.

    #2 whether or not kids are with you. He did it right. Other than stopping for gas at 10:30 PM, would have been better if possible to do it earlier.

    Good question BTW....possible scenerio.
    Cheers
    i'm not running around the ghetto trying to get into self defense situations. what i said or tried to say is if in that situation, i have someone approaching with a gun showing, he will most likely draw first while i try and make sense of the situation. if he draws first, my only hope would be a distraction for me to get a better defensive position. we unfortunatly have the disadvantage in defensive situations because we just dont know what the person approaching us is intending. like someone stated, he could have a chl and is poorly carrying his gun. sometimes i need to choose my words better.

  12. #26
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    6,781
    Quote Originally Posted by chiefjason View Post
    Just because it's a great, simple idea in a pinch. It need to be repeated. I've told my wife the exact same thing. It's going to be hard for the BG to draw when he can't see because of the gas in his eyes. And does he want to risk making himself an instant BBQ by firing his gun?
    Agreed...This is a very much 'tactical to practical' no gun required idea.
    Functional and McGyver style genius.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  13. #27
    Member Array JPCleary's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Summerville, SC
    Posts
    182
    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Great idea, except that bullets are cheaper than gas, lol.

    This same thing happened to me 5-6 years ago, and I posted it here in another thread somewhere. I was trapped between the open door of my truck. the gas hose blocking a quick exscape and the pumps when man walked upon me from nowhere. This is a very realistic situation to find onesself in.
    It was because of your story that I always start my gas pumping and then walk behind my Jeep and maintain SA.
    Kimber Tactical Ultra II, Kahr PM45, Kahr PM9, Kahr P380

  14. #28
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    7,602
    First... so what if a man with a gun on his waist approaches anyone on here, he may have been legally open carrying.
    Second... he had not committed a crime until the point he "demanded" them to give him money. In many cases, they have been throw out because it was found they "asked" for all their money but there was no "threat" nor "demand" actually made.

    Did the guy walk backwards to his vehicle ? Did the guy not have the brains to get a tag number ?

    A man here followed 3 men who robbed a store...... they realized they were being followed, stopped and turned around on the guy, shot & killed him. Be careful how you "follow" anyone.

    All depends upon on how it went down.... but, if he's got his gun in his waist, 1) can I outdraw him before he even realizes I have a gun , 2) do I want to ? , 3) what about when he walks away.... and then perform a citizens' arrest, 4) get tag # , follow safely behind to give location to 911.
    Lots of options, all in how the situation goes down, how much of a threat it really is perceived to be, etc.

    One technique I learned was simple...... grab his gun hand so he can't pull his gun as you draw yours, put it into his neck or body and pulling the trigger. So, how much of a threat to life was this guy ?? Is it justified to just take him out ? Is it smart ? Can it be defended in court ?
    I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
    Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."

  15. #29
    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Hickory, NC
    Posts
    2,737
    Quote Originally Posted by dgreen View Post
    The victim, a 44-year-old man from Elyria, said he was pumping gas when a man carrying a gun in his waistband approached and demanded money.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    he may have been legally open carrying.
    As someone that does OC, that's not even a thought in my head if this happens. At least, it it fits my idea of "in waistband". You know, the kind where you just shove it in the front of your pants and lift your shirt to show it off. If they guy has a holstered firearm it would be different. And yes I know you can't alway see the IWB holsters. I'll let my judgement be my guide. If they dress the part, are acting the part, and have the gun just shoved in their pants; then I've got some quick decisions to make.
    I prefer to live dangerously free than safely caged!

    "Our houses are protected by the good Lord and a gun. And you might meet 'em both if you show up here not welcome son." Josh Thompson "Way Out Here"

  16. #30
    Moderator
    Array Bark'n's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    West Central Missouri
    Posts
    9,917
    Quote Originally Posted by JPCleary View Post
    It was because of your story that I always start my gas pumping and then walk behind my Jeep and maintain SA.
    I essentially do the same thing when I wash my windshield and other innocuous stuff. It allows me to look around to scan the area, yet otherwise look like I'm not paying attention.

    In the winter and it's really cold when I don't wash the windshield, I still stand there and scan the area 360, but it's more obvious I'm scanning for trouble if some nogoodnik is observing and trying to target me from the corner of the building or some distant place.
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Bad LEO situation in TN
    By proscene in forum Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: May 3rd, 2010, 11:25 PM
  2. What do you do in this situation?
    By Locust Grove in forum Off Topic & Humor Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: March 27th, 2009, 10:09 AM
  3. No win situation?
    By Pete in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: June 15th, 2007, 05:07 PM
  4. Apt Situation
    By blare in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: September 27th, 2006, 02:06 PM
  5. I had a situation
    By HK45/FN5.7 in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 34
    Last Post: August 21st, 2006, 11:52 PM

Search tags for this page

lift shirt show ccw

,

what should i do if i see a man with a concealed weapon

Click on a term to search for related topics.