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My Wife Handles Situation with 9mm

9K views 93 replies 54 participants last post by  oldcurmudgeo 
#1 ·
Wifey and I ( along with two daughters (8&9 yrs old) live way back in the sticks on my family property. It is a very peaceful and beautiful place where visitors are extememley rare. My nearest neighbors lives almost 3 miles way and the road that leads to our house runs up over a mountain and dead ends at my garage.

There are 4 different "No tresspassing" signs the last mile into my house where the road is for solely our use. There is no way you could "accidentally" end up at my house.

A few evenings ago while I was at work, wifey and the girls were eating dinner and a white van pulled into my parking area in front of the garage and just sat there. Wifey grabbed the M&P and told the girls to watch out the window and if anything happens dial 911.

She went out and asked the guy, who was still sitting in the drivers seat, If she could help him. She had the M&P in her hand behind her back. By this time my two very large and protective farm dogs are right by her side ( they know something was not right) she asked again if she could help him and he said no, and that he was lost. He then got out of the van and stood there for a second looking around. (wifey said it was very strange) She told him that he needed to get in his van and leave. He still stood there. She was roughly 30 ft from him at the time. He then started walking towards her! The dogs started growling at this time. She then put the M&P in front of her waist ( not pointing it at him, just showing him she has a gun) and told him to stop and get in his dam van and leave right now! He stopped dead in his tracks and did exactly that.

This guy was NOT armed but what if he hadn't stopped walking towards her after she told him to stop? Afterall, she was outside our residence in the parking area. But I mean, there she was in the middle of nowhere with two small kids in the house watching what is going down with cellphone in hand.
I think she did a great job and I am totally proud of how she handled herself. I asked her what she was planning to do if he continued towards her. She said she planned on yelling at him to stop one more time with the weapon pointed at him and if he didn't she was more than willing to protect herself and our kids. Yes, he was unarmed and yes they were outside in the middle of the day but hey, atleast all three of them would be around for the jury trial.....
 
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#81 ·
I think they are weird.

I have never gone out to a visitor to take a picture of his vehicle or of him. It would be the last thing on my mind.

I have walked out to strange vehicles many times. It is just a fact of life that I don't know everyone in this world.

And when you live in the country you get occasional visits from the grandson or son or some relative to the old family two miles down the road, descendants who you last saw when they were small children...or something similar.

One does not make any friends running out the door with guns and cameras to confront the neighbor's children when that child or by now grown man only wants to ask you if he can hunt deer on the place this winter. Or maybe he wants to borrow a hay wagon....

So you go out to see who it is. The first indication you really have that things are not just right is when he behaves a little off.

In her case, it was the fact that he said he was lost. That is OK. I have been lost many times. But where he failed was.....when you are lost, the next words out of your mouth are questions: How do I get to Billy Jones farm? How do I get to highway 202?

The next bad move was when he moved toward her and ignored her instructions to keep his distance.

That was a really really bad signal. Any man who advances toward a woman when instructed to keep his distance is a serious threat.

These are the earliest signs of a threat and this is where your picture taking would begin because up until then you would have no reason for doing so.

At this stage, it would be very foolish to divide your attention between a camera and the BG because by this time it is clear that he is a BG.

If she had a camera on her and chose to take a photo of the rear of the van as it was going out her road, OK. But not in the middle of a confrontation.

Further, as someone said earlier, he probably would have lunged at her to grab the camera and at that point she would have been in real trouble with the gun holstered or otherwise not at instant ready.

You mention cameras on your belt, armed backups, etc.....perhaps it is time to describe your profession and some of your real life experiences of survival in the briers.
 
#82 ·
By the way, this may be a good time to discuss proper manners when approaching people you do not know, especially in the country and now that hunting season has begun.

Proper manners:

Do NOT invade a person's private space. Stand at a minimum of 6 to 10 ft. away while talking to them. If it is a woman the distance should be double that unless you are well known in the neighborhood and can identify yourself....as in " my name is xxxxx" and it is well known that you own land nearby. Or "My name is xxx and I just bought the Jones farm and I would like to ask you....."

In the latter example, you have identified yourself but you still have not demonstrated character so you should still be respectful of personal space.

I despise strangers that stand at bad breath distance. It is very dangerous.

If you must go up to the door and knock, knock or ring the bell and step back off the porch or steps a respectful distance. You must not stand with your nose right up against the door when the door opens. In my younger days in some of the more remote areas that was a good way to get shot.

Just remember the #1 rule and the rest is easy. DO NOT invade anyone's personal space.

That was the real danger signal in the OP's original post. The BG was starting to crowd her.
 
#83 ·
BadgerJ

A digital Nikon and a partner to back her up were not available to the missus.

She had, as backup, two kids with a phone... not a great idea, but it all worked out.

As to never showing a weapon except to put lead downrange... Well, she wasn't on the range, so it never should have come out. She just shoulda said "smile for the birdie" and taken his pic.

Never showing the weapon until ready to use it might be a better axiom. After all, I believe John Lott's work shows that a shown weapon has deterred many crimes, as it did in this case.

I'll agree that the courts might decide if the van driver was guilty of a crime that would justify his being shot. In many jurisdictions a woman has an almost automatic "disparity of force" claim when the perpetrator is male. Add to that:

  1. the man in the van was on her property.
  2. did not leave when asked.
  3. advanced on the missus after being asked to leave.

My wager is that: If arrested for this "horrible armed assault," the woman would be:

  1. Released on her own recognizance.
  2. Not prosecuted.
  3. and if it went so far... a No Bill from the Grand Jury


In a state without front plates (not the case this time), the van would have to turn around to leave as you say. I have a question for you... (multiple choice, easy peasy)


What will NOT cause the van to turn around to leave..?
  1. The digital Nikon in hand.
  2. The successful culmination of a burglary, rape, and murder of 2 children and the wife?
  3. A weapon displayed with the obvious intent to use it.

The goal here is to get the bad man/stranger danger to leave with no harm done...

I notice that the local Sheriff apparently hasn't made a visit to the house on a complaint from some innocent lost soul who reported an assault with a weapon. So apparently, the bad man wasn't just lost and really bothered that the locals are so unmannerly.

Yeah, it takes a while in the country to get response... even with the "shots fired" call... And then, with that call, you may wait even LONGER because the Sheriff's gonna assemble a team... And then they're going to advance on the place slowly and tactically... So 1/2 hour response time is now 45 minutes minimum.

And if the "shots fired" call isn't made, what's she s'posed to do, run around the grounds taking multiple photos of the guy chasing her around the house? After all, she can't pull the weapon 'til she's gonna send lead downrange... and she didn't make "that" call.

Nope, sorry.... Iff'n my wife had shot him on the property, and I lived that far out in the sticks... Id'a debated whether to bother the sheriff at all... just bury the fool and use the van as a storage shed.

I'm sorry, that last bit was the egotistic, foolhardy, testosterone poisoned, stupid, noob talking... I'm not really that way at all... I've just been hanging around here on DC too long.
 
#84 ·
I might have missed it, but did anyone mention the use of a video security system for getting the "big picture"? That leaves the homeowner free to focus on the situation and keep the pistol in her hand. I think its a good idea for all homes but especially for a home as isolated as this.
 
#85 ·
Glad you brought this up. We did install a video system after this happened. We discussed it before this incident and this made us put it on the fast track.

And to clear a few other questions up. My wife handles a firearm very well. She has grown up shooting and hunting with her dad and is comfortable with a handgun as well.

It is just a common practice of the locals who live back in the sticks around here to go out and greet visitors. It is just what we do. Wifey looked out the window, noticed it was someone she didn't know and could see it was a single male in the van. That is why she told the girls to watch out the window with the phone. She has done this before (and takes her gun with her) only to find it is someone looking for the next farm over. No big deal usually.

Law enforcement in this area is spread very thin. Calling them to intervene is a waste of time. They are simply too far away to be of any use when you really need them.


Trainercb,
You can come up and give the duck hunting a try.. I do see them occassionally on the pond. I have to other ponds that have ducks on them also. I am more into hunting the deer up here than the ducks.
 
#86 ·
She did just fine. She got the best possible outcome to the situation. I am completely against this picture taking rouse.
Eyes and FULL attention on threat, hand on weapon. A camera is an unneeded distraction.
Best case-he leaves, no picture needed.
Worst case-she has to shoot him, no picture needed.
No pictures needed, if someone wants a souvenir that bad, take him to the taxidermist, and hang him above the fireplace. :yup:
 
#87 · (Edited)
The only thing I can find on this is from the NRA/ILA.

Apparently and according to this source, in Maryland brandishing doesn't exist on ones own property.

It is unlawful for any person without a permit to wear or carry a handgun, openly or concealed, upon or about his person, or to knowingly transport a handgun in any vehicle traveling on public roads, highways, waterways or airways or upon roads or parking lots generally used by the public. This does not apply to any person wearing, carrying or transporting a handgun within the confines of real estate owned or leased by him, or on which he resided, or within the confines of a business establishment owned or leased by him. [3]
MCSM: Maryland Firearm Laws

I think the key is what she tells him. If she holds the gun in the open and tells him to leave, it shouldn't be a problem. However, if she holds the gun and says leave or I'll blow your brains out or points it at him without a reasonable threat, that could be a problem and some form of assault.

Of course when there are no witnesses and it's her word against his, better to err on the side of letting somebody know you can defend yourself. And in that case, caution dictates that without the weapon she and the kids are at the mercy of almost any man of any stature whatsoever. I suspect no DA or solicitor in his right mind would indict a woman in such a situation. Especially one that is otherwise law abiding and on her own property alone.
 
#90 ·
I think she did everything right, considering where you live. You say you live out in the sticks--I don't know about MD, but in my part of KS, a call to 911 generally means an hour wait or so, and that is if they stand on the gas pedal awful hard getting there. Plus, if everyone called everytime a "strange" vehicle pulled into the yard, it would turn into a boy who cried wolf type of thing, and they would never show up anyway. Lots of salesmen, oil lease guys, hunters, etc. always showing up.

She did exactly what I would have done. She deserves a big thank you, for protecting her/your children, she did her job as a mom very well. I think you definately have a "keeper"!!
 
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