Thoughts about Aurora...

This is a discussion on Thoughts about Aurora... within the Home (And Away From Home) Defense Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Bark'n and I usually agree.. But I don't know if resistance would have stopped this one... he was apparently prepared for resistance... but then, some ...

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  1. #31
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Bark'n and I usually agree.. But I don't know if resistance would have stopped this one... he was apparently prepared for resistance... but then, some are saying it wasn't really body armor...

    A new scenario for the tough guys to train to, those with red dot sights on their Glocks able to score head shots at 100 yards, will be changing to night vision scopes... And there will be more who say... "How can you be in the 'beat before you start crowd,' and still carry a gun or be on DC?"

    Those of us who realize that it would have been a dire situation... and one from which any were lucky to escape.... should just turn in our man cards...

    Both sides are standing in the blood of the tragedy... and continue their harping songs... and that makes me sick.
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    All that said....
    It could be worse.
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  3. #32
    Member Array Roon's Avatar
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    I could be wrong, but aren't movie theater emergency exits typically 1 way exit only? There is no way to re-enter via an emergency exit at the Theaters around my house, they lack a handle and thus would need to be kicked in or propped open. If this was the case in Aurora, a propped open emergency exit should tingle the spidey sense of anyone who is even half paying attention. If he needed to kick the door in prior to entering that would give you ample time to deploy your weapon and be ready. Then it all comes down to how long he waited after deploying the gas, if he came right in you should have still been able to react without TOO much interference from the gas. Who knows, it really is all speculation.

  4. #33
    VIP Member Array xXxplosive's Avatar
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    As i said................I just don't know....with all that smoke and in the dark and confusion.......for sure, if I was there I would have hit the deck and prepaired myself for the worst.

  5. #34
    Ex Member Array ScottM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roon View Post
    I could be wrong, but aren't movie theater emergency exits typically 1 way exit only? There is no way to re-enter via an emergency exit at the Theaters around my house, they lack a handle and thus would need to be kicked in or propped open. If this was the case in Aurora, a propped open emergency exit should tingle the spidey sense of anyone who is even half paying attention. If he needed to kick the door in prior to entering that would give you ample time to deploy your weapon and be ready. Then it all comes down to how long he waited after deploying the gas, if he came right in you should have still been able to react without TOO much interference from the gas. Who knows, it really is all speculation.
    From later reports, he bought a ticket, and left through the emergency exit after the movie started.

    He had apparently wedged the door from locking, retrieved his gear from his vehicle, and then returned to inflict carnage.

  6. #35
    Ex Member Array ScottM's Avatar
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    Not Monday-morning QB-ing.

    Just trying to get people to realize It can/may happen to you. One can be a little more prepared next time in case your location comes up.

    I know I feel more comfortable with my G26 or 19 (and yes, I do have RDS on them), and a spare 17 magazine than the "5-shots is enough" J-frame from the thread running last week.

  7. #36
    VIP Member Array rammerjammer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottM View Post
    Not Monday-morning QB-ing.

    Just trying to get people to realize It can/may happen to you. One can be a little more prepared next time in case your location comes up.

    I know I feel more comfortable with my G26 or 19 (and yes, I do have RDS on them), and a spare 17 magazine than the "5-shots is enough" J-frame from the thread running last week.
    The chances of this actually happening to you are so remote that I still feel comfortable with my 5 shot snubbie.

    I refuse to live my life like a soldier entering a war zone.
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  8. #37
    Ex Member Array ScottM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rammerjammer View Post
    I refuse to live my life like a soldier entering a war zone.
    No one said anything about that.

    My family is worth more than a J-frame carry load.

    And if anything like this never happens, what have I lost?
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  9. #38
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    So far, I stand by my post in this thread and the other long thread on this event ( http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/...ml#post2326107 ). Historically speaking, regarding mass shooting incidents, no shooter has continued his carnage once someone directly intervened.

    In regards to oakchas, feelings that resistance may not have stopped this madman in this case is moot as so far, there hasn't been any reports that anyone tried to intervene. To my knowledge no one even tried to intervene in this case and he was allowed to continue at the shooters choice. So we'll never know. And yes, it's starting to be reported that the shooter in fact, did not wear body armor. If that is in fact, true... then again, any attempt to by an armed citizen would have likely ended it.

    Regarding the North Hollywood shootout, another poster mentioned... It was a totally different type of situation. It was not a mass shooter incident. It was a bank robbery gone bad, and the bad guys continued shooting in an attempt to escape. They did not continue shooting just to shoot unarmed people at a gathering. I know it's splitting hairs, but there is a significant difference between the two types of events.
    -Bark'n
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  10. #39
    New Member Array packing's Avatar
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    Its easy to carry a gun but determining when and how to use it is hard. And you have to be a "hero" type in this situation to do anything. Heroes are just as rare as madmen. So, I think there probably were some guns there but like in Tucson everybody was running for their lives except for the unarmed hero...

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottM View Post
    Defender Advantage:

    Mentally unstable dirtbag is expecting ZERO resistance
    I don't know how you can claim that he was expecting zero resistance. If he didn't expect anyone to fight back there would have been no need for the armor. He may have been unprepared for the reality of resistance, but he wouldn't have been shocked that someone fought back.

    Later in this thread you said something about people on a defensive carry forum having a mindset of being defeated before it starts. I know I wouldn't feel defeated in the situation and I'd do the best I could to intervene. I've taken training seriously in my life, but this shows me some holes. I plan to correct the situation, and I hope others honestly examine their abilities and work to correct areas they find to be lacking.

    Thus far I've come to the conclusion that I need to attend SI's active shooter course. I know how to deal with as a part of a team but could use some instruction on individual actions. Another low light class of some sort will be in the very near future. And I think most importantly an RMR is going to find its way to my Glock. This situation pinpoints the value in a red dot and I feel stupid for not taking it seriously enough to put one on before now.
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  12. #41
    Distinguished Member Array Doghandler's Avatar
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    Even Batman must occasionally retreat from the Joker.

  13. #42
    Ex Member Array ScottM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Echo_Four View Post
    I've taken training seriously in my life, but this shows me some holes. I plan to correct the situation, and I hope others honestly examine their abilities and work to correct areas they find to be lacking.
    This is the best reason for dissecting incidents such as these.
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  14. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottM View Post
    From later reports, he bought a ticket, and left through the emergency exit after the movie started.

    He had apparently wedged the door from locking, retrieved his gear from his vehicle, and then returned to inflict carnage.
    And that begs the question of why some sort of alarm didn't go off when the door was opened and locked open.
    Maybe it shouldn't have gone off in the theater proper, but in a management office. He had to have had that
    door propped for some time to be able to leave, armor up, and bring his stuff inside.

    I'm not blaming the theater management, they have probably had two bazillion false alerts from goofy customers
    who think it is just fine to leave through the fire ext at the end of the movie. Still, deactivating their alarm or
    simply ignoring it is what enabled this man to do his thing. You can almost be certain he was there
    earlier a few times and checked that out ahead of time.
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  15. #44
    VIP Member Array Yoda's Avatar
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    I am at batman now, but I am in Texas. Movie should start in 20 mins or so.


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  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    So far, I stand by my post in this thread and the other long thread on this event ( http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum/...ml#post2326107 ). Historically speaking, regarding mass shooting incidents, no shooter has continued his carnage once someone directly intervened.

    In regards to oakchas, feelings that resistance may not have stopped this madman in this case is moot as so far, there hasn't been any reports that anyone tried to intervene. To my knowledge no one even tried to intervene in this case and he was allowed to continue at the shooters choice. So we'll never know. And yes, it's starting to be reported that the shooter in fact, did not wear body armor. If that is in fact, true... then again, any attempt to by an armed citizen would have likely ended it.

    Regarding the North Hollywood shootout, another poster mentioned... It was a totally different type of situation. It was not a mass shooter incident. It was a bank robbery gone bad, and the bad guys continued shooting in an attempt to escape. They did not continue shooting just to shoot unarmed people at a gathering. I know it's splitting hairs, but there is a significant difference between the two types of events.
    I agree, except on one point. Charles Whitman is one exception to your active shooter characterization I can think of. Even then, return fire from armed citizens impeded his progress and hampered his efforts.
    "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk."
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