Thoughts about Aurora... - Page 4

Thoughts about Aurora...

This is a discussion on Thoughts about Aurora... within the Home (And Away From Home) Defense Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I also noticed a lot of people thinking they could have stopped the guy, when in reality it's just not going to happen. The BG ...

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  1. #46
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
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    I also noticed a lot of people thinking they could have stopped the guy, when in reality it's just not going to happen. The BG had WAY too many advantages, body armor, ar-15, shotgun, pistols, tear gas, not to mention the civilians that would be in your way, and you would barely have any night vision since you were just staring at a bright movie theater screen, there's too many to list.

    I thought the Hollywood bank robbery already taught us all a lesson about what it would actually take to stop somebody like him.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK


  2. #47
    Ex Member Array ScottM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    I also noticed a lot of people thinking they could have stopped the guy, when in reality it's just not going to happen. The BG had WAY too many advantages, body armor, ar-15, shotgun, pistols, tear gas, not to mention the civilians that would be in your way, and you would barely have any night vision since you were just staring at a bright movie theater screen, there's too many to list.

    I thought the Hollywood bank robbery already taught us all a lesson about what it would actually take to stop somebody like him.
    I think he could have been stopped.

    But not with a defeatist attitude.
    BkCo1 likes this.

  3. #48
    Senior Member Array Happypuppy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottM View Post
    I think he could have been stopped.

    But not with a defeatist attitude.
    Agreed. Sort of like this

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsVCH...e_gdata_player


    Sent using 2 cans and string
    Burns likes this.

  4. #49
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    The only way someone could have stopped him without adding to the overall danger in there would have been to
    somehow get in back or to the side--his vision blocked by the mask-- and shove a knife in him. I assume however
    that he kept his back to a wall so that couldn't happen. Maybe from the side.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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  5. #50
    Member Array WHYDAH's Avatar
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    I think some are giving this murderer too much credit. He wasn't some trained operator with combat experience. He was an "egg head" college student who had bought for himself some neat toys, and then decided to use them to kill people.

    As far as someone with a CCW being able to choose whether or not they enter a business that prohibits firearms, a lot of people do not have that option. They may work in that building, or, like Chicago or New York City, they can't even carry a gun.

    Guns aside, what if five guys had simply rushed the shooter once the firing began? Something to think about along with everything else.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I agree, except on one point. Charles Whitman is one exception to your active shooter characterization I can think of. Even then, return fire from armed citizens impeded his progress and hampered his efforts.
    Ahhh. Yes, and I considered Charles Whitman, except his circumstance was strategically a different kind of event than the situation at the movie theater.

    Whitman was firing essentially from an elevated and ensconced position as a sniper. A strategic move on his part designed to keep those who would intervene at bay. His situation was uniquely unique compared to every other mass shooting event in the last 40 years where the shooters walk among the group of victims as they engage. So, I didn't include his sniper incident in my comparison. I consider snipers to be in a different category.

    But yes, you are correct in that Mr. Whitman was a mass murder spree killer. You win a free consolation cookie for your effort Mike. Good post.
    -Bark'n
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  7. #52
    Senior Member Array Geezer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    There's never been any evidence or examples of people who have continued to randomly kill people once someone... anyone, intervened.
    Actually, there is some evidence, but your point is well taken. In 1966, Charles Whitman, our first mass murderer, was randomly shooting people from the top of the UT Tower. After about 20 minutes of virtual slaughter, citizens with their deer rifles, and police began firing at the small openings of the tower railing, preventing him from any aiming/shooting advantage on the people below. He, instead, continued his killing by selecting his targets at random out to 300 yards away, killing at least two more, and injuring several others, before the police got him.

  8. #53
    VIP Member Array CLASS3NH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullet1234 View Post
    GUNFREE ZONES are ALWAYS targets,,,,, do you believe these NUTJOBS would try this at
    a SHERIFF CONVENTION,,,,, not likely,,,,, they want the meek, the mild, those unable
    to defend themselves,,,,, the only way to stop this kind of BG is with force & as soon
    as he was confronted with possible death for himself ,,,,, he gave up without a fight.
    NO GUNS = NO ME
    Good point on the above. The shooter, chose the particular movie, and the location (gun free establishment) to unleash hell.
    With that said, and with the fact that he (the shooter) surrendered without a fight when he found himself confronted with his own possible death. I do believe, that had there been a armed response to his actions, there would be a lot less fatalities.
    A few rounds returned back to him would have reveiled he didn't have true body armor on him, and that may have been just enough to cause a different outcome. Then again, given that type of situation, who knows what the outcome would have been.
    tcox4freedom likes this.
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  9. #54
    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CLASS3NH View Post
    Good point on the above. The shooter, chose the particular movie, and the location (gun free establishment) to unleash hell.
    With that said, and with the fact that he (the shooter) surrendered without a fight when he found himself confronted with his own possible death. I do believe, that had there been a armed response to his actions, there would be a lot less fatalities.
    A few rounds returned back to him would have reveiled he didn't have true body armor on him, and that may have been just enough to cause a different outcome. Then again, given that type of situation, who knows what the outcome would have been.
    Do we know for a fact that the shooter chose this location because it was a gun free zone?

    Michael
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  10. #55
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    Do we know for a fact that the shooter chose this location because it was a gun free zone?
    He was there. It was a gun free zone. Does it matter whether he chose it because it was a gun free zone?

    Probably not.
    tcox4freedom, CLASS3NH and l1a1 like this.
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  11. #56
    Senior Member Array Cold Shot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottM View Post
    I think he could have been stopped.

    But not with a defeatist attitude.
    Anybody can be defeated, but I agree with some of the other people who believe it would have been difficult. But then again, someone brought up the point that these psychos are not trained operators, but rather just punks who bought some toys and went nuts.

    Sure, 12 people dead and 50+ wounded is terrible, but if somebody really knew what they were doing and went about it in an organized manner, i.e. not a psycho, more of a terrorist type, they could do much more damage than that.

    So I guess my point is - it would definitely be doable to take this guy (or any mass murderer) out, but the Aurora shooter would have been tricky.
    CLASS3NH likes this.

  12. #57
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    No one ever said it would be an easy task to take out this gunman, but if you are just going to sit by and stick your head in sand, then leave your gun at home. You are no benefit to society. As for those that say it will never happen to me, or in my area. Well it just happened and might happen again. This time it could be coming to a theater near you....
    CLASS3NH likes this.
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  13. #58
    VIP Member Array CLASS3NH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlr1m View Post
    Do we know for a fact that the shooter chose this location because it was a gun free zone?

    Michael
    Not so much the gunfree zone, but more as it was the movie itself. I'm sure it was his psycosis <sp> of being dressed as one of the villans in the movie, that drew him to that particular theater, but being a gunfree zone gave him that extra atvantage.
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  14. #59
    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    He was there. It was a gun free zone. Does it matter whether he chose it because it was a gun free zone?

    Probably not.
    No not to the victims it doesn't. But if one is trying to show that it was a reason the shooter went there then yes. Proof to back it up would be reasonable. My question was in response to a post that seemed to imply that was the case.

    Michael

  15. #60
    Member Array quack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    Historically speaking, regarding mass shooting incidents, no shooter has continued his carnage once someone directly intervened.
    as CLASS3NH said even one( however inaccurate) returned shot could have altered the dynamics of this tragedy.

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