12 gauge vs .40 cal vs 5.56 for home defense - Page 3

12 gauge vs .40 cal vs 5.56 for home defense

This is a discussion on 12 gauge vs .40 cal vs 5.56 for home defense within the Home (And Away From Home) Defense Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by cltyus1 Hey forum, I currently have a glock 23 (40 cal) and a remington 870 12 gauge shotgun for home defense. I ...

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Thread: 12 gauge vs .40 cal vs 5.56 for home defense

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by cltyus1 View Post
    Hey forum, I currently have a glock 23 (40 cal) and a remington 870 12 gauge shotgun for home defense. I am getting an AR 15 in the next couple of months rather I use it for home defense or not. I have heard that the 5.56 is actually a better home defense round that the .40 caliber when it comes to over penetration. I guess there is a better chance at the 40 over penetrating. Also with the shotgun, if you use slugs definite over penetration, if you use 00 buckshot, you have to be able to control all of the buckshots, and the ones that do miss will over penetrate a lot. And if you use buckshot, there are a lot of pellets that you have to control, plus they may not penetrate enough. Just wondering because I have a daughter and her room is across from mine. Is all if this true? How do you all feel with the rifle in 5.56 in a home defense rifle. Again I ALREADY HAVE A 12 GAUGE AND WILL GET THE AR RATHER I USE IT FOR HD OR NOT. thanks a lot, you guys are very helpful to a novice like myself.
    The first thing to remember is that there is no "free lunch". Anything that will penetrate deeply enough to reach the vital organs of a human assailant will easily penetrate an interior household wall. There is no way around this fact.

    Every round you listed will "overpenetrate" on a miss. However, if you are using the proper ammunition, the 5.56 will be less of a threat in adjacent rooms than 00 buck or the .40 round.
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  2. #32
    Distinguished Member Array sid1's Avatar
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    A shotgun with birdshot loads, the projectiles have less chances of whizzing through a criminal, or the wall behind him. Shotgun slug loads involve the same risk of over penetration as a centerfire rifle, and should be reserved for use outdoors. Birdshot loads considerably reduce that risk. However, shot loads will do substantial and often unacceptable damage to the home in which they are fired.
    A handgun is handy indoors and can be conveniently concealed almost anywhere in the home, ready for use.
    As for long guns, I wish I could find an article I read about a 9mm FMJ actu­ally had more wall pen­e­tra­tion then the Rem­ing­ton .223 hol­low point rounds. Which also went on in stating that A short bar­reled rifle with .223 hol­low points is a much bet­ter option then any handgun or shot gun

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by billstaf View Post
    Nightstand gun is the GP100. I keep five rounds in that, hammer down on the empty cylinder.
    Why would download a modern double action revolver?
    My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon.

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  4. #34
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    Invest in a good alarm system, or a dog, so you have advance warning in the middle of the night, my kids know the drill if they hear the alarm at night, is on the floor and on far side of bed, and stay there till i come get you.....house alarm is a total different than fire alarms, but i keep a glock 23 / laser light combo, with quality hollowpoints, that is my first go to, because it is fastest, easier to maneuver through the house, and the strobe light is very disorenting to whoever is looking your way, the red dot leaves not a doubt where the bullet is going, just hope I never have to use it....there is also a 12 gauge, ready to rock, if it is an outside threat, that goes with me with glock in pants or holster....all depends on situation....prepare for many, in case you have to use one.
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by JerryMac View Post
    Invest in a good alarm system, or a dog, so you have advance warning in the middle of the night, my kids know the drill if they hear the alarm at night, is on the floor and on far side of bed, and stay there till i come get you.....house alarm is a total different than fire alarms, but i keep a glock 23 / laser light combo, with quality hollowpoints, that is my first go to, because it is fastest, easier to maneuver through the house, and the strobe light is very disorenting to whoever is looking your way, the red dot leaves not a doubt where the bullet is going, just hope I never have to use it....there is also a 12 gauge, ready to rock, if it is an outside threat, that goes with me with glock in pants or holster....all depends on situation....prepare for many, in case you have to use one.
    Thanx,I have a pit bull, ADT, glock 23, and Remington 870....my daughter is only 2 though

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  6. #36
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    You can never have enough options. Great job on the alarm. I only like it for alerting me or letting whatever criminal is entering that everyone will know something is going on. Next on the list is a dog. Joking aside i vote shotgun, wife gets the xd and I take the Mossberg.
    BigJon


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  7. #37
    Senior Member Array RubenZ's Avatar
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    I wouldn't want to maneuver around house with a shotgun. Especially if you don't know if intruder is already in. He can grab the barrel easily.
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by RubenZ View Post
    I wouldn't want to maneuver around house with a shotgun. Especially if you don't know if intruder is already in. He can grab the barrel easily.
    I wouldn't be maneuvering at all... I'd be lying in wait at the top of the stairs with a 12 gauge surprise party.
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  9. #39
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    ***** surprise party exactly.

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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by 40Bob View Post
    Why would download a modern double action revolver?
    You are right, of course. There is no longer a need for keeping the hammer down on an empty cylinder in any of today's DA pistols.

    Some old safety habits are hard to overcome.
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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigJon10125 View Post
    I wouldnt use an AR because it is possible to miss, but impossible to miss with a shotgun, right everyone???
    My experience says it is easy to miss with a shotgun. Check out these patterns from DocGKR on M4carbine.net:

    Fed_1_buck_7_yds.jpgFed_1_buck_25yds.jpg
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  12. #42
    Member Array cltyus1's Avatar
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    You can miss with anything

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  13. #43
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    Great thing about the 870: the sound of a pump shotgun is unmistakable. They know you mean business, and that they will lose. Likely they will leave quickly after they hear that sound, and that ends the threat. #6 or smaller will not over penetrate, but will certainly do a lot of damage to an intruder.

    Hopefully the racking of the pumpgun will do the trick: I don't want to shoot anyone, and blood is hard to get out of carpet!

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  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ctownbmxr View Post
    Great thing about the 870: the sound of a pump shotgun is unmistakable. They know you mean business, and that they will lose. Likely they will leave quickly after they hear that sound, and that ends the threat. #6 or smaller will not over penetrate, but will certainly do a lot of damage to an intruder.

    Hopefully the racking of the pumpgun will do the trick: I don't want to shoot anyone, and blood is hard to get out of carpet!

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    Really?????
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  15. #45
    Senior Member Array Dennis1209's Avatar
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    I had the same questions until I thought it happened to me. I think I posted this here before? Which weapon you choose would depend on your training, practice, configuration and layout of your home, and occupants location. With the above mentioned, my capabilities are best served with a pistol in general, and a 7 shot revolver in particular fitted with laser sights. Long read below.


    Talk about a reality check? The wife and I were deep asleep when this piercing sound woke me up. Coming out of such a deep sleep, it took me a moment to realize it was the burglar alarm. If any of you have an ADT system with that ear piercing whistling siren, you know what I’m talking about.

    We have had this system for about a year and a half and have never had any false alarms. I was thinking of that and many other things as I grabbed my S&W 686+, .357 magnum pistol sitting on top of my nightstand next to me. I also have a Remington 870 shotgun loaded with 00 buckshot next to the bed. I realize now the shotgun is just too unwieldy for the configuration of my home.

    Shaking and somewhat confused on what to do next, not being able to hear anything because of the ear-piercing siren, I decided the siren had to be turned off because it could not be tolerated for any length of time. The single control panel is located in the kitchen at the opposite end of the house. The siren is located on the hallway wall half way between the bedroom and kitchen control panel.

    As I slowly and carefully made my way down the hall while checking for intruders, the siren was actually hurting my ears, and my hands were shaking. We always keep a living room lamp light on. After checking the living room, dining room and kitchen and seeing it was clear, I disabled the siren. What a head relief!

    Fortunately having a pair of reading glasses near the alarm control panel I checked the code on the read out. Code 02, basement motion detector. This is where I always suspected to be the most logical place for a BG to enter. The motion detector immediately activates the alarm, not the 45 second count down for the windows and doors.

    At that moment the telephone in the living room rings, we don’t have a phone in the bedrooms. I’m certain it’s ADT calling about the alarm. The wife had followed me down a few moments later.

    The door leading to the basement has the standard doorknob lock, a dead bolt and one of those useless chain things with the tiny screws securing it. I tell the wife to answer the phone as I am covering the basement door hoping no one will come barging through. The ADT person tells my wife, “we have received an alarm from your address, Code 02 basement motion detector, what is your password?” The wife is relaying this information to me as my eyes are trained on the basement door.

    The ADP person asked my wife, “are you going to check the basement or do you want us to send the police?” With hands still shaking I thought for a moment… To me, the best course of action was to get the police here, quick. She informed my wife they are calling. It was probably 3-4 minutes from the time the alarm went off until ADT called, assuming I immediately awoke when the alarm went off.

    I have a police scanner sitting close to the alarm panel I seldom use and thought this was an opportune time to turn it on to monitor the Sheriffs progress. I live in EBFE and sure enough, the deputy sheriff called dispatch for directions.

    The dispatcher called and informed my wife that the deputy was here and unchaining my driveway gate. The deputy later informed me it was policy to call the homeowner before arrival for safety reasons (home owner with gun). It took roughly 20 minutes for the deputy to arrive.

    While waiting for the police to arrive I happened to look at the clock, a few minutes after 3 A.M. Thinking to myself, from what I’ve read, two to three o’clock seems to be the prime time for home invasions.

    Seeing the police car driving up my 200+ yard driveway, I pondered what to do with my handgun. Put it away or keep it near and cover it with a towel or something. Since he was on scene I felt comfortable enough to take it back where it came from.

    I didn’t know if he would come to the front or back door so I turned on the front and backlights and opened the doors. He cautiously approached the back door and announced sheriffs department and I made myself visible and told him to come in.

    I gave him a brief description of what happened and the alarm code. He told me the first bit of good news was my gate was closed and chained when he arrived (no pad lock, just a clip).

    He then cautiously opened the basement door with flashlight in hand, turned the basement light on and slowly started down the stairs. I’m thinking, dude, you need to have your handgun drawn? I’m reasonably certain someone broke in and might still be there. But, I’m not about to say anything as he is a professional and is trained, it’s my over active imagination probably.

    After what seemed to be an hour, but probably only 4-5 minutes, I hear the officer coming up the steps. He was down there for quite some time. Now I’m really wondering where they broke in from and how much damage was done. He asks me a couple questions about my garage door, something about if it locks? The single car garage is separated from the basement with a flimsy hollow door and dead bolt.

    With great anticipation, he finally tells me everything looks secure and there was no break in. I can’t tell you the relief my wife and I experienced at that news. It still took us a couple of hours to calm down before we could attempt to go back to bed.

    Before departing, the deputy complemented me on my Liberty safe in the basement and we talked a good ten minutes on what could have caused a motion detector false alarm and crime statistics in my county, etc. before he left. A good guy!

    Lessons learned: While I am fortunate this was a false alarm and grateful for such, what if it was the real thing?

    After the deputy departed, one of my first thoughts was, I need to get me a good alert / guard dog. But in retrospect that might not be a good thing. I had a good alert dog at my previous residence but has since passed away from old age. We had the same ADP alarm system and my wife burnt something in the oven and set off the smoke alarm. The dog went crazy yelping and running around from the high pitch loud noise. Seems to me that would be one more distraction to deal with in an emergency?

    The shotgun is too unwieldy for me to use indoors with the configuration of my home. Guess I’ll put it back in the safe as it is a better outdoor defense gun, and I don’t “plan” on checking out or confronting anyone outdoors at night.

    I have a phone jack in the bedroom. I need to get a hard line phone for it today because that’s the number the police will call upon arrival, the telephone number of your alarm system the ADP people give the police.

    I have a set of electronic earmuffs in my range bag. I’m going to put them next to my home defense pistol. I wonder if they will muffle the ear piercing alarm? With the alarm off they do enhance your hearing significantly, which is an advantage.

    Most importantly, I need to get some training and work on my mind set. Instead of trembling hands, I should have been pissed someone has the balls to break into my home.

    For me anyway, seems my best laid plans went out the window when that alarm went off! It also a different story when it’s daytime and you’re prepared, alert and condition yellow compared to at your most vulnerable, asleep in bed.

    Sorry about being long winded.
    I think, therefore I am...

    <the Menace>

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