Minimum Size/Weight/Price Weapon for Homestead Property (70m x 30m) Defense

This is a discussion on Minimum Size/Weight/Price Weapon for Homestead Property (70m x 30m) Defense within the Home (And Away From Home) Defense Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; What would you suggest for the minimum size/weight/price weapon for defending my homestead, which is basically a 70m by 30m rectangle with no trees? My ...

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Thread: Minimum Size/Weight/Price Weapon for Homestead Property (70m x 30m) Defense

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    Member Array pawned79's Avatar
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    Minimum Size/Weight/Price Weapon for Homestead Property (70m x 30m) Defense

    What would you suggest for the minimum size/weight/price weapon for defending my homestead, which is basically a 70m by 30m rectangle with no trees?

    My current guns:
    Kel-Tec PF-9 (Carry)
    S&W Shield 40 (Carry)
    Mossberg 500 Field & Security Combo (18.5" security or 24" field barrels)
    and
    Mossberg 500 customized with light, red dot, forward grip and AR-15 stock (buckshot w/ 18.5" barrel)

    Just to clarify, I do own two Mossberg 500s.

    I've been thinking about getting a S&W M&P 15 (SKU 811000) with a 16" barrel and carbine length gas system, but I'm afraid that might be overkill, but fun.

    Suggestions?

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    Senior Member Array Cold Shot's Avatar
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    The shotguns will easily be able to cover that area. Get the ar if you want to.
    joker1 likes this.

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    If you can't defend it with what you already have, it's indefensible.
    Retired USAF E-8. Remember: You're being watched!
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

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    Shotguns are good for the area your describe
    “You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic.”

    ― Robert A. Heinlein,

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    VIP Member Array mlr1m's Avatar
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    I've been thinking about getting a S&W M&P 15 (SKU 811000) with a 16" barrel and carbine length gas system, but I'm afraid that might be overkill, but fun.
    Nothing wrong with fun.

    Michael

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    Member Array pawned79's Avatar
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    Thank you for the quick replies! Next time I go to the range, I will take my customized Mossberg 500 over to the 100 yard range (instead of the 25 yard range), and see what I can do with my Bushnell 1x Tactical Red Dot (ACOG clone) using my 00 buckshot of choice and a few other brands plus some slugs.

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    Member Array GearmanTX's Avatar
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    I've had varying experiences with Buckshot at longer ranges but slugs are ok.

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    VIP Member Array Bad Bob's Avatar
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    The max effective range for buckshot is 15 yards. Remember, each pellet functions as 1 projectile. Buckshot loses lots of energy very quickly. I would load with slugs and be happy.
    My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon. Go big or stay on the porch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    If you can't defend it with what you already have, it's indefensible.
    Agreed. Short of adding an M60 to your armory, or a few friends with rifles, I think you have the HD angle covered.
    Smitty
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    VIP Member Array Badey's Avatar
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    I agree with the other comments, but I would go for an AK over an AR if you want a rifle (cheaper gun, more reliable, larger mag capacity with stock mags, cheaper ammo).
    "My problem with life is not that it is rational nor that it is irrational, but that it is almost rational." - G.K. Chesterton

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    Member Array pawned79's Avatar
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    Thank you for the additional replies. I have a question regarding the effective range of 00 buck as mentioned by both GearmanTX and 40Bob. Without orchestrating a series of ballistic gel tests, is there a reasonable way to know the penetration power of my chosen load at range? In my house, in doors only, the longest distance is from the hallway to the far end of the kitchen, which is 22 yards. I've been practicing 9 pellet 00 buck at the 25 yard range and calling it good. I haven't measured scientifically, but I can pepper an 8.5" x 11" sheet with a notable number of pellets. Without even considering defending the grounds, am I doing myself a disservice believing that I have stopping power at any distance within the home? If I know I can’t down an intruder across that expanse before they return fire, I need to alter my mission for that type of engagement. Thank you again.

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    Member Array sigma's Avatar
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    After reading alot of posts here discussing buckshot, its penetration, spread at different ranges, etc. I would believe you would have absolutely no problems in the ranges within your home. Moving outside to longer range defense I would throw some slugs in a side saddle for those longer range encounters. That being said Im looking at the M&P as well because having 30 rnds of 5.56 couldnt hurt

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    Member Array leecheater's Avatar
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    I say go with the ar and build a gun tower

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    Quote Originally Posted by pawned79 View Post
    Thank you for the additional replies. I have a question regarding the effective range of 00 buck as mentioned by both GearmanTX and 40Bob. Without orchestrating a series of ballistic gel tests, is there a reasonable way to know the penetration power of my chosen load at range? .

    If someone is beyond the range of 00 buck, how much of a threat are they really?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pawned79 View Post
    Thank you for the additional replies. I have a question regarding the effective range of 00 buck as mentioned by both GearmanTX and 40Bob.
    About 22 yards.

    Federal Flite-Control 00 is good to about 35 yards.

    Slugs are good to 125+ yards.


    Quote Originally Posted by pawned79 View Post
    Without orchestrating a series of ballistic gel tests, is there a reasonable way to know the penetration power of my chosen load at range?
    All the way through a human. The problem is that the pattern spreads out at about 1" per yard to the target (or a little less). The problem is that the pellets spread out so much they miss the target.

    Slugs will go all the way through a human even at 100 yards.


    Quote Originally Posted by pawned79 View Post
    In my house, in doors only, the longest distance is from the hallway to the far end of the kitchen, which is 22 yards. I've been practicing 9 pellet 00 buck at the 25 yard range and calling it good. I haven't measured scientifically, but I can pepper an 8.5" x 11" sheet with a notable number of pellets. Without even considering defending the grounds, am I doing myself a disservice believing that I have stopping power at any distance within the home?
    With either 00 buckshot or slugs you have more-than-adequate stopping power at any distance within your home.


    Quote Originally Posted by pawned79 View Post
    If I know I can’t down an intruder across that expanse before they return fire, I need to alter my mission for that type of engagement. Thank you again.
    The shotgun has earned the reputation as the best defensive firearm available for good reason; it has demonstrated its effectiveness across the centuries. Historically, very few men have been able to continue their attacks after absorbing a load of 00 buckshot or a 12-gauge slug to the torso. Statistically speaking, effectively no one keeps coming after two or more of either load.

    An AR loaded with expanding bullets is as effective as a shotgun within the shotgun's maximum range, and far beyond, up to 300+ yards. But (!) an AR poses more danger to the neighbors, as the AR's 5.56 bullet will carry for hundreds of yards if it misses the attacker you are aiming at.

    The disadvantage of the shotgun is severely limited ammunition capacity. An advantage of the AR is that it takes 30-round magazines, and you can stuff a few extra magazines into your back pockets. Another advantage of an AR is that an AR has far less recoil than a 12-gauge shotgun.

    Further, an AR reloads and cocks itself. There is no possibility of short-stroking an AR under stress. Every time I have assisted with instruction in a Tactical Shotgun class i have watched multiple students short-stroke their pump shotguns.

    The shotgun has long been favored for urban defense since the spherical 00 buckshot slows down rapidly due to air drag and falls to ground far sooner than a pointed 5.56 bullet. Slugs also have a wretched ballistic coefficient and slow down and fall to ground sooner than a 5.56 bullet fired at the same angle.


    Something else to consider is how loud a shotgun or a rifle is inside the confines of a house. You will be deaf after the first round, possibly permanently. A handgun fired inside the confines of the house makes less noise, thought the report is still extremely painful. Consider a pair of amplified stereo electronic ear muffs (e.g. Pro Ears Gold) to let you keep your hearing after the first shot.

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