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Beyond worst case scenario... Civic and social decay.

9K views 85 replies 52 participants last post by  latentcarry 
#1 ·
I am going to post this even at the risk of it sounding like a dooms day scenario. Over the weekend, I was talking with a friend who lived in an area of New Orleans during Katrina that did not flood. They were able to get out in time, however their home was looted and anything value that they left behind was trashed or stolen. He took his guns with him when they packed up the SUV and camper trailer.

He wonders what if he was not able to get out before the storm. They did have jugs of fresh water and some food, but other that that, they would have had serious issues. To top it off, even though they had boarded up the windows and doors, looters still were able to get in.

How prepared are you to deal with a week or two total chaos without some utilities like power and dealing with looters trying to break into your home. Weather is just one thing that can cause chaos.
 
#10 ·
This isn't true Sir, and being as you say you're from MS, I'd think you would know truth from fiction. Yes, some gun owners had their guns illegally taken from them, but by no means was the entire city of New Orleans disarmed. It's just NRA sponsored fiction plain and simple.

I worked for the Department of Homeland Security in 2005, in New Orleans, but since I live in MS, I was responsible for the DHS employees in MS initially, and I also worked in New Orleans immediately afterwards. We trucked supplies (food, fuel, water, toiletries) into the city every other day, for our agents that were on the ground there, until FEMA got their act together, with the tent cities, food service, etc... At one time we had over 800 Special Agents working in New Orleans, supporting the NOPD, while they reorganized, including two SRT Teams (Special Response Teams or SWAT) at any one time.

I live in MS, about 20 miles from the water as the crow flies, and because I do, I am prepared for hurricane season, at all times. During Katrina, I had 12 people and six dogs sheltering in my home, some of the people I met for the first time that day. We take our preparedness seriously, and I could have fed them all for a month, without a problem. We know that water sustains life, and gasoline sustains everything else. Have to have fuel for vehicles and generators, or life will get ugly fast.

We live in the country, thus bands of marauding looters wouldn't reach us for many weeks after a natural disaster, and I doubt very seriously that they'd get very far up my 400 foot driveway. We don't evacuate; we hunker down. Once the storm has blown over, we assess the damage, and set out to help people less fortunate than us.
 
#3 ·
Most looters are non-violent. What I would be more concerned about is a hate-based campaign where adherents to a certain ideology are looking to physically punish "the rich," rape women and all that. Who I'd be most concerned about are not ******** and suburbanites because they usually live far enough away from cities to be hard to get to in case of a civil collapse. The ones in real danger will be the yuppies who thought it was cool to live in an renovated apartment in Baltimore or Atlanta, and one day find out they are surrounded by people who hate them, the police have packed their families into their cruisers and have headed to the hills, and that they have no way to defend themselves.
 
#42 ·
Hello Beyla... and welcome to the forum.

A couple of points I must disagree with you. Looting is not non violent. Scavenging is mostly nonviolent. Looting is by definition stealing property, and has no defense. Scavenging is taking what you need to survive.

The longer the crisis lasts the further the unprepared will range from their home ground. Many people have a false impression that living in a rural, or sub-urban setting will protect them frome most harm. There will be prepared, and unprepared in every setting. Again many of those unprepared will go feral sooner than later. I believe that hunger trumps hate any day of the week. Hate focus is more likely IMO in a comfortable society. A society in crisis is more likely to focus on survival.
 
#4 ·
I stock up at the first hint of a hurricane: food, water, 2-3 days of gas for the generator. If I have to go out for more, the wife can stand guard. Picture an angry momma griz who's packing heat--do you really want to try to take what's hers?
 
#56 ·
I stock up at the first hint of a hurricane: food, water, 2-3 days of gas for the generator. If I have to go out for more, the wife can stand guard. Picture an angry momma griz who's packing heat--do you really want to try to take what's hers?
You're supposed to be stocked up ahead of time!:rolleyes:
 
#5 ·
During Ike, we stocked up and bugged in. Being well prepared for any emergency is just good thinking. Lost power for a couple of days, ut no big deal. Had ammo, food and water. I stayed up at night and slept very little during the day knowing my wife was up and about. Did have some cars driving the neighborhood with their lights off. Once I flashed their car with my flash light, they quickly drove away. However, I do live in the suburban parts of Houston, so the frequency of people cruising the neighborhood that did not belong there was very little.
 
#6 ·
Well we dont have hurricanes much in ky. But as far as being without power etc thats old hat here. Every big snow storm usually means a couple of weeks without power or going much of anywhere unless you have a 4 by 4.
Tornados have wrecked havoc here in last few years though and couple of big floods.

We heat with wood anyway so heat and cooking is not big deal. Water usually stays on or just melt snow or get it out of a nearby spring. Food I can get pretty easy just by walking up on the hill and shooting a deer or rabbit or turkey or something if I have too. It got to that point once when the stores all sold out of food and snow blocked deliveries but we stayed fed.
Candles, camp stove the old wood burner the guns and ammo we can do ok for a good while here.
 
#85 ·
Same here.
 
#8 ·
ive been stocking up on freeze dried food, and alot of water we could live off that for atleast two months. bullets for my glock 23 and rem 870. going to find another glock this week either another 40 or 45. i do want to get an indoor propane heater badly though. don't consider my self a survivalist but i do like being prepared because i couldn't imagine my 3 year old daughter crying because she is hungry.
 
#15 ·
My husband's family survived Hurricane Andrew - it ruined their home, but they survived in a closet. No electricity, standing in lines for hours for water, roads blocked and it took family members hours to get from them from just across the county. They were shot at by looters almost 2 weeks after the storm, my fil fired back killing one and making the others flee. It was before I met them, but I have heard their first hand stories and seen their pictures and newspaper articles and learned many lessons by their experiences.
 
#16 ·
In some areas the people will turn animal--more so than they already are. Others will extend a helping hand. You never know until it happens. Be prepared for either.
 
#17 ·
I live in a very urban area so bugging out is a must for me and mine, we run drills and are decently prepared, however being forced to bug out is a huge disadvantage, being prepared is not paranoia in my opinion. My parents were directly affected by the tornadoes that ripped through alabama and were taken aback by the mayhem that ensued. There only means of communication was me (for some reason they could dial out to my area code but none in theirs) I had to coach them through surviving with no supplies. It worked out fine for them (thank god I told them to fill the bathtubs before they lost running water). When a natural disaster breaks out I will be making fun of the people who made fun of me for my tin foil wrapped house.
 
#18 ·
I would take anything of value, passports, papers, money, guns, etc and leave the rest. The stuff can be replaced if destroyed or stolen. I pay high insurance rates so I am protected for such things. More worried about who and what can't be replaced easily. Not worth sitting thru a Cat 5 to save my TV set. My safe would be filled to the top. They aren't gonna be able to carry that away. Thankfully, SC passed a law making it illegal for police to take weapons during such events.
 
#19 ·
I have the Weather Channel - I'm going to leave, deal with my stuff when I get back!
 
#20 ·
When I was in NH we were very prepared. Generators with a lot of fuel, 500 galon propane tank, wood burning stoves. Plenty of food stored. Plus money in case we had to leave and get a place to stay. Now in TX we are not as prepared but working on it. We have property in central TX where we can go with well water, generator, food. And of course we always have cash on hand in case we need to go to a hotel or get to family.

IMO 98 percent of the folks in NOLA during Katrina were morons and idiots. Folks that had to get rescued and said they did not have the time to leave were just plain deserving of what they got. The governments plan to put the in the Superdome was the height of idiocy. If you had two legs and could walk you had no reason to be left behind. If you chose to stay behind then you had adequate time to prepare. The hurricane did not just happen upon them. I have zero sympathy for those 98 percent.

I do understand you have folks that could not get our for many reasons, eldery, disabled, people with the IQ of a gnat.......

Putting five or 10 bucks a month away for prepardeness will get you through a lot in life. How many times would you really need it? Once, twice, three times? Over 50 yesrs that is not much to ask for to be prepared.
 
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#24 ·
I think that getting a house off the grid is a smart idea. One of the things that they are reviewing to prevent a terrorist attack is making sure that the energy infrastructure is protected. However, there are still the risk. We are looking at geo-thermal for heat and solar panels for electricity. Part of it is to be prepared, part of it is that I don't like paying other companies for these utilities. I am not sure about how we would do water since we live in a dense urban area. We are also looking at increasing a supply of canned, dried, and frozen foods.

We are also looking at increasing our security system with better locks and other preventative measures.

A mentor once commented that it is a good idea for people to invest in gold, silver, and lead backed by gun powder.
 
#26 ·
I guess the law abiding looters in Ct. are different then the non law abiding looters in Florida, looting starts as the people evacuate and the looting continues, and in many cases with violence, until it is evident that the property owners have returned after the storm passes. The Florida Castle Doctrine is of benefit and does allow the property owners to defend themselves.
 
#30 ·
Having lived through it personally, I can tell you this. The producers of the world... you know the people who have jobs, raise families and pay their taxes were just fine.
They fired up their chainsaws, cut the trees off their homes, patched their roofs, fired up their generators, helped their neighbors, fed their families and protected themselves and each other. It was hot, and very unpleasant but they buckled down and did what had to be done.

On the other hand, the consumers of the world... you know the people who don't contibute anything to society, live off the government and suck up resources? Well, they also did what they always do, sit back and wait for the government to take care of them. Problem was, the government was overwhelmed dealing with a disaster that they were not ready for. Every resource was strained to the breaking point and the local "leaders" crumbled under the pressure. When the government wasn't there Johnny on the Spot with the handouts, the consumers just took matters into their own hands and took what they wanted by any means. It was amazing to watch how quickly order disolved into chaos and lawlesness in some areas.

This is the reason I keep a few boxes of ammo for a rainy day. I'm not so much worried about a crackhead kicking my door in. I'm worried about what happens if the bubble ever pops and Uncle Sam is no longer able to hand out the goodies and we get post-K on a national level. Scary.
 
#33 ·
I personally believe hat everyone should be prepared to live at least 3 weeks without outside support. No utilities, no grocery stores etc....
 
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