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In Reality- Long guns for home defense

17K views 73 replies 55 participants last post by  Cold Warrior 
#1 ·
This installment of “In Reality” will focus on long guns for home defense.

In my opinion, home defense comes down to three types of situations:

* Break in during hours of darkness, while you are in bed.
* Break in during hours of light, while you are awake.
* The end of the world as we know it and you are trying to protect your family and property.

Even in states that allow for liberal concealed carry, most residents will tell you that even though they carry a concealed pistol, they have a shotgun or rifle for home defense. Most people will never carry a long gun outside of their home or the range.

Over the last few months, I have done a few polls on different forums, some of you reading this may have participated. Basically the question was “If at 3 AM this morning you heard someone breaking into your house, what would be the first firearm that you would be able to access”. Between all the forums, the average hovered around 75%-80% handgun. The response did not surprise me. Here are some reasons why-

* Handguns are easier to store in a safe manner to prevent access by minors and other unauthorized people.
* Being small and unobtrusive in nature, it is easy to move a handgun around or station several in the house so as to always have access to one.
* You realize that you will have to navigate hallways, open and close doors, flip light switches, etc and this is easier to do with a free hand.
* A handgun is easier to hide if for some reason a night time investigation leads you outside.
* And the biggest one is what I call the slipper effect. In most cases that you go to investigate something, experience tells you that it is more likely that someone forgot to close a door, or the cat knocked something off the counter, instead of a team of highly trained professionals coming to kidnap you for ransom. I liken this to forgetting to put the trash out and you hear the trash truck early in the morning. Even if it is raining or there is snow on the ground, you chance it by putting on your slippers as you dash out to drag your cans to the curb. You know it is gonna be kinda uncomfortable, and maybe you should put on some proper shoes, but you are only gonna be outside for a minute anyway.

The same thing goes for the “bump” in the night. If you knew for sure it was an all out home invasion, you would be more likely to break out a rifle or shotgun. But the truth is that this is seldom the case, but you never know, so more often than not it will be the pistol you grab to investigate.

Few courses are as popular these days as those for carbines. But going back to my comment about most people never carrying a rifle outside of their house or the range, ask yourself these questions about the courses or your own planning.

* Have you ever fired a long gun barefooted in your bed clothes?
* Have you ever tried to clear your home in the dark with a long gun?

These question, although not high speed, are realistic and are training problems, not equipment problems.

For the majority who answered that they would have a pistol in hand first, I think it comes down to two things to think about.

The need to be realistic about the reality of how they would likely deal with a “bump” in the night by making a long gun more readily available. And how to better use the handgun I will actually grab to better defend myself and my family
 
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#2 ·
I keep my CCW on bed side stand and plan to use it first for home defense.

If events give me time I will use 870 with buck shot and CCW as back up.

If it is TEOWAWKI then God help us all, and fight to win for yourself and love ones and others.
 
#52 ·
this is my approach as well.

my shotgun is locked in a cabinet. i have a carbine and i am considering keeping it by the bed at night and putting it away in the morning.

pulling out a long gun sorta gives me the feeling that i am overreacting to the situation and makes me feel stupid. i should get over that. in the moment when i hear the noise and go to investigate, the pistol seems like the more reasonable response, but in reality, i really should be using a long gun like the shotgun or carbine.
 
#10 ·
Why? Because of how awesome birdshot is? Or how cool it would be to have an oversized .45 Colt? :icon_neutral:


-B
 
#4 ·
Lets go extreme and say your pinned in the house by an armed group set up outside or something of that nature. Hand guns and shotties might not be your best option in that scenario.
 
#8 ·
Good article. I must say, that my 357 is my first choice though my shotgun would probably be the more useful weapon to be honest, that pistol is just a easier grab.
 
#9 ·
My take

Great topic for the "In Reality" series.

I'm sure it goes without saying, every home and every homeowner/renter is going to have very specific scenarios when it comes down to the 'what if?' question: floor plan, who and how many live in the home, ages, neighbors, domicile location, etc. There are way to many variables to generalize a one-size-fits-all answer.

And I certainly realize this is not what you're doing.

That said, my response to the question, “If at 3 AM this morning you heard someone breaking into your house, what would be the first firearm that you would be able to access,” my answer would be my short-barrel 12-gauge.

If, on the other hand, my doorbell rang at 10:pm and I wasn't expecting visitors, my handgun would be in my hand when I looked out the window or peephole before I opened the door.

A bump in the night? Okay, we have an alarm system that is ALWAYS armed whether we are home or not, but at 3:am I would still have my Mossberg 590 (with mounted flashlight/ laser) in hand because I have no pets and no kids who might trigger the alarm system. ( FWIW, shells #1 & #2 are 7.5 birdshot; shells #3-#8 are 12-pellet 00 buckshot).

I cannot imagine being awakened at 3:am and being terribly accurate with my .357, even with a laser grip.

"* Have you ever fired a long gun barefooted in your bed clothes?:" No, but I've practiced.
"* Have you ever tried to clear your home in the dark with a long gun?:" Not exactly, but after clearing the immediate area I'd probably hunker down and let the cops clear my house whenever they show up.

One thing I still plan to do is get a single-point sling so the shotgun stays with me and I can use both hands to open the fridge after it's all over.
 
#11 ·
Thanks for the research and post. I agree with most everything

I prefer a handgun for several reasons,

Speed- as you mentioned pistol safes are generally quicker and easier to operate than my big dial-a-rifle. (I keep all my firearms locked up unless they are attached to my body)

I considered how center-fire rifles are significantly louder than handguns and without hearing protection, in an enclosed space, I believe a handgun will cause less permanent damage.

I know you were concentrating specifically on handgun/long gun, but I think the typical home defense deficiencies are in lighting, and common sense...

:)
 
#13 ·
Few courses are as popular these days as those for carbines. But going back to my comment about most people never carrying a rifle outside of their house or the range, ask yourself these questions about the courses or your own planning.

* Have you ever fired a long gun barefooted in your bed clothes?
* Have you ever tried to clear your home in the dark with a long gun?

These question, although not high speed, are realistic and are training problems, not equipment problems.

For the majority who answered that they would have a pistol in hand first, I think it comes down to two things to think about.

The need to be realistic about the reality of how they would likely deal with a “bump” in the night by making a long gun more readily available. And how to better use the handgun I will actually grab to better defend myself and my family
Yes, I have fired a "long gun" as well as a handgun in my PJ's an slippers, more than once. Coyote and raccoon are nocturnal and I have been awoke more than once by them.

That said;
I keep my CCW in the night stand for easy access and to buy time to get to the shotgun. From there my response will depend on what the situation is and how it develops.
For human threats;
I am not very apt to "clear" my house. While I have had some training in clearing a building, it is not something I recommend doing alone. My designated "safe room" is the 4 yr old's bedroom right next to the master bedroom. Generally, my first response is to grab the wife and head for the daughters room. From her doorway I can cover the only entrance without exposing myself unnecessarily. There I can await LE and any BG will be forced into a funnel directly in my sights.
 
#14 ·
Guys, I am no debating the effectiveness of a pistol vs long gun, or shotgun vs rifle. I am talking about in reality when you are in your night clothes and hear a bump in the night. As has been stated every noise you hear may not result into the family barricading into the safe room and calling 911.

The point was that even people who may have access to long guns will generally grab a pistol to investigate a bump in the night. It seems the best of both worlds would be to draw a line in your mind that if it is not to the point where you know you need to call 911 you would be more comfortable investigating with a pistol and a light. If the situation requires you calling 911 then taking the family into a secure room and defending with a long gun would be prudent.

If you decide to investigate using a long gun, understand that loosing your balance on a steps or another obstacle when you have both hands on a the gun can be tragic.- George
 
#16 ·
* Have you ever fired a long gun barefooted in your bed clothes?
No jeans and barefoot see post below
* Have you ever tried to clear your home in the dark with a long gun?
Yes, In our home we have SOP for all SD scenarios. We practice them.

Good points I think that we all may need to do things differently based upon our environment.

I do not have any hallways, doors to open or lights to turn on in our home. From my bedroom I can see the entire length of my home. But not every nook and cranny. So I practice pieing the house for a security check. John Conner suggested a night grab bag in an article awhile back, to hold cell phone gun flashlight etc. I considered it and passed because the first thing I do is put on my pants even if there is screaming my pants go on first thing. I can tell you from personal experience that few things make you feel more vulnerable than engaging anyone or thing with your johnson swinging free. So for the past 20 plus years pants go on on first thing. With my pants on go my carry weapon, a hi lumen multi function flashlight, cell phone and spare mag.
I do not turn a light on. Out of the unlocked safe by the door comes the shotgun loaded chambered and ready to go. The wife prefers the AR. She gets it and stays if she bothers to get up at all. A 2 inch crack in the bedroom door gives me a 26 yard view of the length of my home. The 30in computer monitor in the family room at the opposite end of the house provides me with adequate illumination. I move through the house with the flashlight on strobe I know where the reflective surfaces are I use them. I clear the house in fives sections. I start with my shot gun as I have no doors except the bedroom to open no lights to turn on. While I trust my XD45 to do its job it is a handgun by definition an ineffective man stopper.

Still even though a 12 gauge is an effective right now one shot man stopper. I still practice double taps, boom rack a boom observe repeat as needed. Remembering one is none two is one.

Anyone invading my sanctuary is a lethal threat and MUST be stopped now. I rely on my 12 gauge to do that for me.

I do practice transitioning from my shot gun to my XD and from the XD to the AR. I think the key is practice in your home. Do you have doors to open? Lights to turn on? Kids? Dogs? Toys on the floor? IMO all of that and much that I have missed play a factor in what weapon you should carry and how you proceed when something goes bump in the night.
 
#17 ·
My P95 comes out if i hear something.

But!

If i hear a breach into the house the AK comes out to play.


I will not go quietly into the night, literally!


If there is a breach the game plan is to push forward down the hall while the wife goes into the daughters bedroom then retreats back to the master bedroom and pulls the mattress over them on the far side of the bed. Then i pull back into the master bedroom which has a direct line of site down the hall which turns into the funnel of death for any BG that comes into the hallway.
 
#19 ·
How would being barefoot in pajamas change my ability to fire a long gun (or a handgun for that matter)?

Also, what's this "If you fall down with a long gun there'll be tragic consequences" nonsense? There is no more likelihood of an AD/ND with a long gun than a handgun.

That being said, I have "cleared" my house with a lot of different weapons: shotgun, rifle, pistol, revolver, and a short hafted pick-axe. Being proficient with your chosen weapon is more important than what it is.
 
#20 ·
Because sometimes during a break in there is broken glass etc. Do you think that stepping on a shard of glass would take your mind off the problem at hand? Your right, it is a preparedness problem, not a gun problem. Lack of mindset and training cannot be overcome with any amount of equipment.- George
 
#23 ·
Do you think that stepping on a shard of glass would take your mind off the problem at hand?
Now that I say it won't. It will probably hurt like the dickens next time but based on past experience with the adrenalin dump that situation brings on I would not even notice until the wife told me to clean up my bloody foot prints before coming back to bed.

Your right, it is a preparedness problem, not a gun problem. Lack of mindset and training cannot be overcome with any amount of equipment.- George
Second that one as well. The best thing any of us can do is practice clearing the house. With the weapon of choice. Repeat after taking any training classes even if they are unrelated. Often times we pick up stuff in a class that changes our perspective, Opens new points of view to old problems.

One good way is to have the wife pick a random time and set the alarm. Even though you will not have the afore mentioned adrenalin dump it will help put a better perspective on things than just walking through it at your leisure.

BE SURE the weapon you use is unloaded. Check it before you start out
 
#21 ·
If environmental concerns are the issue, I think asking specifically about firing while barefoot is a bit of a distraction from the point.

Now, I just realized I came off as rather critical, but that was not my intention. I think you have a good basic point, but I think the presentation is not clearly and effectively making it.

I seem to recall in years past reading a Boston T. Party book where he opined that one should keep a kevlar vest, electronic ear muffs, and NOD's redy to go by the bed. While this is admittedly the best way to respond to actual organized home invasion, I think most people would not be comfortable with nor need to be that thoroughly prepared.
 
#22 ·
My revolver with speed loader would be the first thing I grab, total of 14 shots. If things got really ugly I keep a 20 round box magazine full of Hornady .223 flex-tip hollowpoints ready to go into the Colt rifle. I think the chances of actually needing the rifle are remote to say the least.
 
#24 ·
I only own a shotgun, but my pistol permit app will be handed in tomorrow. I've thought about the answer to this:

Now, I've practiced clearing the top floor with my 870. What corners are tough, how to move room to room, what corners are blind. My 870 sits in the closet with 4 00 buck in the mag, and the backup shells in boxes in the first room I'd step to. It sits tucked away out of sight, but not locked, no key on the trigger - no kids. Disengage the safety and give a pump - pull the trigger and gun goes bang. I've practiced grabbing it from my bed, in pj's, and clearing the first 3 rooms, which results in a hallway that acts as a funnel from both exterior doors, and a reasonable distance from over penetration. Crouch just behind a corner where I have the advantage and pick em off 1x1 till the cops show up.

When I get my handgun, it'll sit next to me, at least with a full mag, safety on. Debating on how ok i am with one in the chamber. Should need be, that'll get me to the shottie in the closet, then passed to the girlfriend. Clear with shottie, tell her to shoot anything that moves that's not me or the dog. Everyone has their own opinion, but the likelihood of the shottie stopping some dipshit trying to get in my house in 1 or 2 shots is a lot greater than the pistol, especially under stress. Shottie wins. I like shooting trap..under the lights at night is fun. I have some experience hitting a moving target - even though it's a way away and small, I have some lower light practice shooting a moving target. In my small house - if I center the sight on the hallway and shoot, I'm almost guaranteed to hit my target with the modified choke on my gun and 00 buck.

As for early warning..my dog has only let me down 2 times so far. My girl snuck in one time - dunno how the hell that got past him. Got a bell tied to the door handle. Not too loud to us - he hears it and goes crazy. He's pretty good. Only a beagle, so he won't scare anyone, but he hears and smells a lot. Gets treats and praise for barking - person or not. Doorbell on tv and barks, praise. Noise out back but not a person and barks, praise. Person, still praise. Best early warning you can have. He barks, I look. If it happens at night, I look while holding my 870. The dogs ears plus my practice equals a win for my 870 - stopping power and pattern/spread to me trumps a handgun any day of the week.
 
#25 ·
Like everyone else depends on the situation. When I had a guy trying to open my front door a few months back, I had time to go to the safe, grab the double barrel shottie, confirm the 45 had one in the tube, and get in position before I needed to.

Dog was barking her head off and wife was on with 911.

In that case the guy was drunk and convinced he had the right house and that his wife wouldnt let him in.

When the dog went off the other night I grabbed the 45 and my slippers to see what was up. Turns out the cat knocked a remote off the TV cabinet and that set off the dog. Reason I didnt go to the long gun is I have to have those locked up because fo the kids. I'd really like a pistol caliber carbine, or a better HD shotgun that I can secure in the closet away from the kiddies, but its not in the budget at the moment
 
#28 ·
Seeing as I sleep naked most ranges won't let me practice in my bedclothes.

If I hear a bump sure I'll grab the pistol and take a peek.

If I hear a window break, footsteps, whispering, crashing banging etc I'll take the shotgun.

If I encounter someone while investigating a bump my pistol is there to get me back to my shotgun.

Zombie noises and flash-bangs warrant pulling the AR out of the closet
 
#30 ·
Clearing the house naked with either a pistol or a shotgun and you're not the only one taking a peek. That could be a tactical advantage....distraction. The BG would be so shocked to see a naked guy with any number of weapons pointed at him that he may just scream and run.

I'm grabbing my CCW on the night stand. Once I get my mossy 12ga pistol grip pump, maybe it will get the nod. Not sure yet.
 
#29 ·
I don't know about you, but my eyes take a few blinks if I have been sleeping in order to focus properly. That might be long enough to reach for my Kimber 5" 1911. Chambered, it has only a 3 lb. trigger pull. It can be dangerous in the dark if you do not know exactly where it is.

If there is more time, I go to the Remington 870 or the Mossberg 500 shotgun (many variations).

I would probably not try to clear the house with any rifle, especially in the dark.
 
#32 ·
It sounds like home defense is on everyone's mind and it should be. However, home defense is personal, just like what you carry. For me, my initial response will be to draw attention to the home, home alarm will already be blaring, set vehicle alarm off (lights and sounds), ensure family secure, and calmly as possible go to work, get the job done while I wait on Leo...Pistol, shot gun, use what you are comfortable with, but keep it simple....nuff said.
 
#33 ·
I'm not really into the concept of "Clearing" the house.

As I see it there are two scenarios.

1. I hear a bump in the night and go to investigate (low probability anyone is IN the house yet). In such a case I would take the Glock and a flashlight.

2. I hear a bump in the house and am pretty sure that there is someone in the house. In that case I have the wife call 911 while I cover the bedroom door with a shotgun.
 
#36 ·
I use a mod MP-5 A-2 with semi auto only (hince the mod) with a surefire forearm light attached to it. If I can't defend myself with 30 rounds of 9mm hollow points, I have real issues and the twice a month I spend at the range plus the countless hours on the Fort Bragg ranges have gone to waste. And if all else fails I have my Glock 23 with taclight and lasermax. My livin girlfriend uses my 12 ga 870 with a mod M-4 style stock.

Sorry no catch quotes.
 
#37 ·
Both. I grab the pistol to go investigate and protect the boy upstairs. I hand the Mossberg 12-ga to the wife. A pistol is better for clearing the house, the shotgun is probably the best weapon to have if you are hiding and waiting for someone to come through the door.
 
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