Mexican Gangs.. have permanent bases in Arizona: Merged

[azchevy]

back when we were men in this country who were not hamstrung by political correctness

: Co B 1st Kentucky Regiment Ft Thomas 14 Jul 1916 by Royal Photo Company, Louisville, KY #3. The Kentucky Brigade was mobilized for the Mexican Punitive Expedition in June of 1916 and trained at Fort Thomas, Kentucky. In August 1916 the Brigade moved to Fort Bliss, near El Paso, Texas. They were stationed at Camp Owen Bierne, some two miles from Fort Bliss. They were attached to the 10th U.S. Provisional Division under command of Brigadier General Charles G. Morton. Their mission was to conduct patrols along a sixty-mile-stretch of the Rio Grande River to Fort Hancock, Texas.

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[i10casual]

ahaha I wonder what the did to deserve this patrol.
Ft Bliss is El Paso. It's the only reason we are still a viable city.

[steyrsdad]

SatCong you ask? Fight back or give up? I am AMERICAN. I dont give up.

[Hopyard]

Comment on Ft Bliss photo posted above by AZchevy.

To understand the full context and meaning of this group being posted to patrol
60 miles of border in 1916 requires some recollection of the history of WWI.

There was very real cause for concern at the time, even after we entered the war later, that Mexico would side with Germany against us.

For those anxious for armed conflict with Mexico, consider this from WWI history:

"Of course we all know about the infamous sinking of the Lusitania (May 1915) that nearly brought the US and Germany to blows, but was warded off through some fancy diplomacy when the Germans agreed to abandon their policy of unrestricted submarine warfare after killing some 128 Americans (1,198 total civilians) in this incident. The Germans stayed true to their word and obeyed cruiser rules for over 1.5 years. "

I put that one up because it raises the issue of where the lines for tolerance are to be drawn. We are presently no where near 2000 US civilians having been killed by governmental directed action of a foreign military.

Even if we take the posting and claims earlier in this thread as actual truth, historically incidents of this minor magnitude are insufficient to trigger the kind of hot war some here seem to be itching for.

[azchevy]

Comment on Ft Bliss photo posted above by AZchevy.

To understand the full context and meaning of this group being posted to patrol
60 miles of border in 1916 requires some recollection of the history of WWI.

There was very real cause for concern at the time, even after we entered the war later, that Mexico would side with Germany against us.

For those anxious for armed conflict with Mexico, consider this from WWI history:

"Of course we all know about the infamous sinking of the Lusitania (May 1915) that nearly brought the US and Germany to blows, but was warded off through some fancy diplomacy when the Germans agreed to abandon their policy of unrestricted submarine warfare after killing some 128 Americans (1,198 total civilians) in this incident. The Germans stayed true to their word and obeyed cruiser rules for over 1.5 years. "

I put that one up because it raises the issue of where the lines for tolerance are to be drawn. We are presently no where near 2000 US civilians having been killed by governmental directed action of a foreign military.

Even if we take the posting and claims earlier in this thread as actual truth, historically incidents of this minor magnitude are insufficient to trigger the kind of hot war some here seem to be itching for.

So I take it the fact that middle eastern terrorists are crossing the border that we should wait for another sept 11th attack in which thousands of Americans die before we take action.

Gotcha.


I am sure you are going to say there is no proof of that as well. Like Hamas and Drug cartels, DHS alerts

FOXNews.com - Feds Issue Terror Watch for the Texas/Mexico Border

FOXNews.com - Congresswoman Raises Red Flag on Hezbollah-Cartel Nexus on U.S. Border

Fox new lies though right?

[azchevy]

I put that one up because it raises the issue of where the lines for tolerance are to be drawn. We are presently no where near 2000 US civilians having been killed by governmental directed action of a foreign military.

Your logic is interesting

Twelve Americans are murdered every day by illegal aliens, according to statistics released by Rep. Steve King, R-Iowa. If those numbers are correct, it translates to 4,380 Americans murdered annually by illegal aliens. That's 21,900 since Sept. 11, 2001.

Based on a one-year in-depth study, Deborah Schurman-Kauflin of the Violent Crimes Institute of Atlanta estimates there are about 240,000 illegal immigrant sex offenders in the United States who have had an average of four victims each. She analyzed 1,500 cases from January 1999 through April 2006 that included serial rapes, serial murders, sexual homicides and child molestation committed by illegal immigrants.

[azchevy]

If that is not government sponsored, I do not know what is.... when will enough be enough?

Mexico Provides Guide to Illegal Immigration - U.S. & World - FOXNews.com

LOS ANGELES — Mexican immigrants hoping to cross the Mexico-U.S. border can use an illustrated guide to help them break U.S. immigration laws (search) and live in the United States illegally.

The 32-page booklet, free with popular comic books and advertised at bus stations and government offices south of the border, comes courtesy of the Mexican government.

The book's main focus seems to be instructing people on how to cross the border safely. For example, it warns Mexicans that when crossing the border, "thick clothing increases your weight when wet and makes it difficult to swim or float" and "if you cross in the desert, try to walk when the heat is not as intense."

The guide also gives advice on how to live unobtrusively in the United States, advising illegals not to beat their wives or go to loud parties because either action may attract the attention of police.

More info:

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServe...enters_defense

[azchevy]

Here is the comic book:

Mexican Government Sanctions Illegal Border Crossing With Comic Book Instructions [ pics and links ] : Diggers Realm

[Hopyard]

AZchevy; fortunately most people don't want to take emotionally driven stances that will drive our collective decision making toward another war.

We've been there and done that. Two or three or four times depending on what you count and who does the counting.

There certainly is a time for everything under the sun, but this isn't the time for another hot war, with our immediate neighbor yet.

And with that, I'm going to leave this thread because my posts seem to be a magnet pulling you and others in to bang the war drums.

[BikerRN]

AZchevy; fortunately most people don't want to take emotionally driven stances that will drive our collective decision making toward another war.

We've been there and done that. Two or three or four times depending on what you count and who does the counting.

There certainly is a time for everything under the sun, but this isn't the time for another hot war, with our immediate neighbor yet.

And with that, I'm going to leave this thread because my posts seem to be a magnet pulling you and others in to bang the war drums.

Who said anything about declaring another war?

I just said that American citizens, if they so choose, should be allowed to shoot illegal aliens as they attempt to enter this country. The prohibition against using lethal force against illegal entrants needs to be waived, the bodies left to rot where they lie.

If that is too drastic for the American populace then perhaps the military should be placed on the border, along with the Border Patrol, with the removal of said prohibitions. Look at it like a video game. If you want to enter this country, at least make it worth something, where you have a chance of losing something valuable to you, like your life.

Now I realize that may cause a bunch of bleeding heart panty wearing effeminate males to get their knickers in a twist. They may even go so far as to walk along the border dressed like an illegal. My answer to that is, If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it must be a duck. Hence, it's duck season, don't be suprised if you get shot. There should be no legal recourse for someone doing duck impersonations during duck season.

Biker

[ksholder]

And with that, I'm going to leave this thread because my posts seem to be a magnet pulling you and others in to bang the war drums.

Hopyard - I rather guess that you are including me in the war drums statement. I am open to other ways to close the border and stop the various forms of illegals from coming into the US. So far, I have not heard any plausible solutions that don't involve weapons. I am all ears.

I am open to any ideas on how to close the border down to only allow legal activity. I am not interested in solutions that leave it open to illegal activity. I would love to hear a non-violent solution that accomplishes this objective.

Please don't leave the thread. Discussions between citizens that have different opinions is healthy. I don't expect everybody to agree with me, nor do I anticipate I will agree with everybody else. This thread is kind of like the founding fathers, we have Hamiltons, Adams, Monroes, Madisons, Jeffersons etc. They did not agree with each other on everything and they certainly had public conversations at times. Without each adding to the mix, the solution would be neither representative nor as well thought out as it could be.

[azchevy]

AZchevy; fortunately most people don't want to take emotionally driven stances that will drive our collective decision making toward another war.

We've been there and done that. Two or three or four times depending on what you count and who does the counting.

There certainly is a time for everything under the sun, but this isn't the time for another hot war, with our immediate neighbor yet.

And with that, I'm going to leave this thread because my posts seem to be a magnet pulling you and others in to bang the war drums.

Who said war? All I want is the government to secure the porous border by all means necessary if that means putting active duty troops down there and stopping the flow, then so be it. It is actually one of the jobs outlined in the Constitution for the government, they seem to too busy socializing everything and taking our rights away to do that though. If we put troops on the border and mexico starts a war with us, then REMEMBER THE ALAMO! But if not, then problem solved eh? mexico don't want to go to war with us, we would push them so far back their heads would spin.

[Shadowsbane]

If you can't keep control of your dog and it bites somebody, you are held accountable. If it bites repeatedly, you have an even bigger issue to deal with.

If the Mexican government feels it must pay to arm an army, then it is equally responsible for controlling it. If there is corruption in the army as you suggest, then that must be rooted out by the Mexican government.

Just like your failure to control your dog leaves you responsible for the results, the failure of a government to control it's armed forces leaves it open to the results of its inattention to the situation. In other words, the Mexican government is responsible for the actions of those it commissions to lead its military. It is not up to the victim to figure out if the army representing a country is acting on orders from the chain of command, the victim can assume that the chain of command is being followed and respond accordingly.

Ok. What I am saying. (And you have absolutly no idea how much it pains me to say it.) Is that I agree with Hopyard on the subject of going to war with Mexico proper over this border issue.


Right now the Zetas, the cartels and what is left of the real Mexican military are all fighting each other. Which is a good thing. You start fighting Mexico as a whole, they will unite, and it will not be pretty for the US. Could we win a military fight? Definately. But you ain't fighting a military, and the Zetas in particular are quite vicious in their dealings. (Also quite highly trained, by the US and Israel actually)

They will attack civilians and only civilians. Primarily drug rehab clinics, hospitals, homes for the elderly, and schools.

Picture any Israeli city, but in Texas, Arizona, Alabama, or California.

It would be much wiser to just seal the border as best we can, and start taking them out on our side. Hopefully cutting off enough of their market where they start turning on each other more than they are now. Allowing the real military to start taking action again.

But, to do that we need a Federal government that actually cares enough to do so. Which is a pipe dream at this point in time really.

[SatCong]

It would be the same type of fighting that that we done in sand land.
We have not fought a declared war since WWII.
But it has to be stop. I don't want war, but we have to do something to stop this cr%*.Put troops on the border with the right engagement rules and a real wall to start with.
One more thing enforce the laws that we have.

[Guns and more]

It seems to me that the Fedl Govt should be working "with" Arizona instead of against it.

The president and his followers have their marching orders. No border closure. The puppet masters have spoken. The sooner you understand this, the sooner you won't wonder why nothing is being done.