New military rifle: XM25 - Page 3

New military rifle: XM25

This is a discussion on New military rifle: XM25 within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Lance, the SAW is a "squad" weapon (heck, "squad" is in the name) and it weighs half again as much as the XM25 - and ...

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Thread: New military rifle: XM25

  1. #31
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    Lance, the SAW is a "squad" weapon (heck, "squad" is in the name) and it weighs half again as much as the XM25 - and that doesn't include a spare barrel kit (though, admittedly, most SAW gunners don't carry this). An M4 w/ M203, including optics and other goodies, is going to weigh about as much. Both of these are carried and operated by one person. When I was on a machine gun team, each member of the team carried SIGNIFICANTLY more than 12 pounds in weapon/tripod/spare barrel/T&E/ammo/etc. For what it is, it's just not THAT heavy (and remember, this is spoken as a career light/airborne/ranger infantryman).

    The SCAR is nice, but it's just a rifle. We've got plenty of those. This is designed to do things that no rifle - or any other weapon at the squad/platoon level - can do. If the cost of that capability is 5 LESS pounds than an M249, I'm ok with that.
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.


  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by LanceORYGUN View Post
    But why is it that the Army almost always gets the new stuff first???

    I've never understood that.
    It is all a money issue. Actually the MC times has been saying that we are going to be getting a replacement to the M-249 soon, you can look it up.

    My M-16A4 with M-203, RCO, sling, full mag, and laser unit was right around 12 pounds, it certainly is doable. I was actually quite content with this set up in the Helmand River Valley.

    I've been a SAW gunner before, and the weight on that system depends on your barrel and stock set up, but it is heavier than this new rifle, and add in 800-1000 rounds of belted 5.56 makes for some painful humps.
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  3. #33
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    Hm - so it's more of a grenade or missile launcher than a rifle. I'd think that makes the weight and the cost more justifiable.
    "Be justified. Blood may be easily wiped from the sword.
    It cannot, however, be put back from where it came." --Quicksabre

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by LanceORYGUN View Post
    It is not a rifle, though. It is a squad weapon. ...
    Fixed that.

    Quote Originally Posted by LanceORYGUN View Post
    If I was fighting in Afghanistan, I would want a FN SCAR Mk 17.





    8 lbs is a lot more manageable than 12 lbs.
    But the SCAR doesn't sneak up behind the enemy and tap on his shoulder!
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    Lance, the SAW is a "squad" weapon (heck, "squad" is in the name) and it weighs half again as much as the XM25 - and that doesn't include a spare barrel kit (though, admittedly, most SAW gunners don't carry this). An M4 w/ M203, including optics and other goodies, is going to weigh about as much. Both of these are carried and operated by one person. When I was on a machine gun team, each member of the team carried SIGNIFICANTLY more than 12 pounds in weapon/tripod/spare barrel/T&E/ammo/etc. For what it is, it's just not THAT heavy (and remember, this is spoken as a career light/airborne/ranger infantryman).

    The SCAR is nice, but it's just a rifle. We've got plenty of those. This is designed to do things that no rifle - or any other weapon at the squad/platoon level - can do. If the cost of that capability is 5 LESS pounds than an M249, I'm ok with that.
    Not wanting to sound too ancient but in my "Old Corps" days I carried a BAR (19 lbs+) and ran fireteam tactics. I will admit that the body armor of those days didn't weight as much as the body armor does today and was not as good. But with ammo ( basic load= 240 rds of 30-06 in magazines) Etc we were still in the 60-80 lb range.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    The SCAR is nice, but it's just a rifle. We've got plenty of those.
    Well, I specifically meant the SCAR 17. I'm 59 and have no military background, but I do hunt small game with the .223 I just cannot imagine wanting to tangle with the Taliban at long range with the 5.56x45mm

    But again, I have no combat experience. My own experience is only with hunting animals that don't shoot back at you when it comes to caliber selection. My Dad and my uncles all served in WWII, but that was a different age regarding weaponry.

    I still don't understand why the Army does not go with a .270 caliber rifle round, as they had initially planned with the M1 Garand. Or maybe even a 6.5mm .264 caliber

  7. #37
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    Know what the bad guys are going to do? Drag some women and kids behind the wall with them, then scream about atrocities.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillep Harding View Post
    Know what the bad guys are going to do? Drag some women and kids behind the wall with them, then scream about atrocities.
    They do that now.
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Saw this on Discovery or History Channel. Pretty impressive round. I'd hate to be the one luging the 12 lb weapon along with the 80-100 lbs of other stuff they can't seem to get along without. Always wondered what was in those packs anyhow.
    I'll take it if I can turn in my 17-lb SAW.
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  10. #40
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    [QUOTE=rson63;1816320]Impressive weapon system, How hard is it to learn to laze targets with this weapon ? Hate to see this weapon fall into the wrong hands, or does the weapon have safe guards built in so only the soldier can fire it ?

    You have to insert your CAC card into the reciever, and create a password (between 7-14 characters) WITH Two uppercase letters, two lower case letters, 2 numbers and 2 Special Characters. :-)

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by paaiyan View Post
    No no, I meant it has to be updated with the range whilst in the magazine/chamber, which will likely be done via RFID. Of course it's not done while it's hurtling through the air, but unless you have a large box of ammunition with pre-programmed ranges, the projectile needs to be sent that information at some point.
    It stated in the video. The round is programed once the range and detonation point is set before it is fired, and counts revolutions on it's way downrange. Rifled barrel - 1-12 LH twist for example. Every revolution the round makes, it has traveled 1 foot. 500 yards = 1500 feet = 1500 revolutions. Detonate at 501 yards = detonate at 1501 revolutions.
    Last edited by Sticks; December 18th, 2010 at 08:12 AM. Reason: basic math
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  12. #42
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    If the batteries go dead and the soldier has no fresh ones, I would hope the thing could still fire its grenades in the direct-fire, point detonation mode.

    It's interesting that we're going back to dedicated grenadiers...from the M79 to the M16/M203 combo to this XM25.

    Air burst is deadly business. If it works like it's supposed to, this will be excellent for our guys!
    The more good folks carry guns, the fewer shots the crazies can get off.
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  13. #43
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    It is designated as a "rifle". If the barrel is "rifled" I guess you could accurately call it a "rifle".
    But it actually seems to be a rifled, long-range, smart grenade launcher, and not a rifle in the traditional sense.
    If you continue this logic, a shotgun with a rifled slug barrel becomes a rifle, and is no longer a shotgun.
    Heck, most artillary pieces are rifled. Does that make them rifles?

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  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob O View Post
    It is designated as a "rifle". If the barrel is "rifled" I guess you could accurately call it a "rifle".
    But it actually seems to be a rifled, long-range, smart grenade launcher, and not a rifle in the traditional sense.
    If you continue this logic, a shotgun with a rifled slug barrel becomes a rifle, and is no longer a shotgun.
    Heck, most artillary pieces are rifled. Does that make them rifles?

    Bobo
    During my time in the USMC we had the 106 recoiless rifle mounted on "mules" and Onto's

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