Dallas Police Chief

This is a discussion on Dallas Police Chief within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by Redneck Repairs Ok Jt I recognise your points tho i personaly think you are mistaken in perspective on this issue , I ...

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Thread: Dallas Police Chief

  1. #16
    JT [OP]
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redneck Repairs
    Ok Jt I recognise your points tho i personaly think you are mistaken in perspective on this issue , I will drop it here with a gentlemans agreement that we disagree on this fella , tho i do admit to side with you that ALL LE desperately needs more training . IMHO this begins with " earmarked " budget items that cannot be spent on other things . ... anyway shake hands and go on to the next topic LOL .
    If you mean by "mistaken in perspective" that we just see things differently, than that's fine. If you mean that you think I don't have insight into the matter due to lack of related or relevant experience, that is incorrect.

    But I agree, we can call this discussion done, and get on with the next one.

    Unless of course someone else draws me back in. It's easy to draw me into an argument.
    Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

    Si vis pacem, para bellum

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  3. #17
    JT [OP]
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redneck Repairs
    LOL Jt good enough , maby someday we will invade a " dennys " for coffee and really argue it up ... till then see ya on the next thread .. be well be safe
    I don't get up to Colorodo much, but I'll take you up on it if I ever do. As long as we can find a range to do a littel shooting at afterwards.
    Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

    Si vis pacem, para bellum

  4. #18
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    It's easy to draw me into an argument.
    Jt damm say it aint so lol Now being the gentile sort of feller i am i seldom to never argue with anyone LOL

    Edited to add , its over mods dont lock the thread LOL
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
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  5. #19
    Senior Member Array hsuCowboy98's Avatar
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    I talked with a detective in Dallas tonight (father of a former roomate), and heard yet another story of the chief responding to yet another call, this time an armed robbery about 3 months ago...and this time the press was blind to all this.

    Ill agree, he may not be right in speaking out about gun control, but if youve ever been in South Oak Cliff, or D-bellum at night and seen the preponderance of illegal arms in those neighborhoods, you might have something to say too. Much less, his statements came on the heels of an Dallas Officer being gunned down with a .357 in a front yard in one of these "hoods".

    Police Chiefs in general tend to be glorified paper pushers, but in this particular case, and having met the guy at a conference my college held on LE and public policy, I was rather impressed by the presence this man had.

    I for one would not want to call him a coward or a liar to his face. And I dont think it is fair to call an individual these names based on a web-forum statement....seriously, who among us hasnt tweaked our attitude to align with some peers at some point in life? Does that make each and every one of us a liar or a coward?

    I just dont think it is really justifiable to pass judgement based on a couple of tidbits of info. What are we becoming if we do...a Clinton?

    Not trying to reignite this thread, rather just trying to call for some rationelle in passing judgement.

    But seriously...all departments need more training, Dallas is no differant that anywhere else. Then again..are you willing to pay more taxes to fund this additional training? Are you willing to pay more taxes so that departments can hire better trained and educated individuals instead of losing them to other sectors? I doubt that the initial response to both these questions by 90% of people would be a big no. Put yourself in those shoes, making the decisions to balance a budget with training, equipment, insurance, ammo, weapons, investigations etc.

    The yearly qualification is mainly a baseline, a legal measure to help insure against lawsuits, every officer I know shoots regulary using his own money, which is hard enough to come by. Is it often enough?...probably not, but how often is? How many hours do you want to pay for an officer to be Qualifying? 2500 officers x 2500 hours OT x how many ever times you want them to qualify a year... It can get exponetionally expensive.

    I just urge everyone to be cautious to persecute someone without first considering the postion they are in, sometimes it is more complicated than you think.
    Fear No Evil.

  6. #20
    Member Array enidpd804's Avatar
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    My chief shoots 95-100 on a regular basis. We shoot our HG qual course twice a month for four months yearly. Additionally, each of those four months we shoot a 10 round tactical course. I guess we're lucky in that regard.

  7. #21
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    (Dallas Police Chief David Kunkle) He then admitted that he got “drawn in” to the CHL debate because the “chiefs took a stand against it” ...
    Police cannot be everywhere: it's acknowledged. Police aren't our nannies: it's the truth. We're each responsible for our security when the police aren't there, which is 99% of all waking hours. In the time it takes police to come on over, the event is over an done with, if they can be called at all in the heat of it. That's reality.

    Amazing that any LEO, especially a chief, could take a stand like this. I've never understood the thinking ... or, lack of it. Precincts ***** about lack of funds and inability to put a few tens of thousands of police on the streets, while there could be five million civilians on "the street" in a year, trained sufficiently to carry, if the legals woke up and swallowed whatever it is they are smoking. Dumb. Truly dumb.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
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  8. #22
    JT [OP]
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    Quote Originally Posted by hsuCowboy98
    I talked with a detective in Dallas tonight (father of a former roomate), and heard yet another story of the chief responding to yet another call, this time an armed robbery about 3 months ago...and this time the press was blind to all this.

    Ill agree, he may not be right in speaking out about gun control, but if youve ever been in South Oak Cliff, or D-bellum at night and seen the preponderance of illegal arms in those neighborhoods, you might have something to say too. Much less, his statements came on the heels of an Dallas Officer being gunned down with a .357 in a front yard in one of these "hoods".

    Police Chiefs in general tend to be glorified paper pushers, but in this particular case, and having met the guy at a conference my college held on LE and public policy, I was rather impressed by the presence this man had.

    I for one would not want to call him a coward or a liar to his face. And I dont think it is fair to call an individual these names based on a web-forum statement....seriously, who among us hasnt tweaked our attitude to align with some peers at some point in life? Does that make each and every one of us a liar or a coward? .
    To clarify…because I started the thread and was involved in the majority of it….I was not the one who called him a coward and a liar. Nor did I call him any other names. I want to make that clear for anyone who did not read the whole thread.

    I’m going to respectfully disagree with hsuCowboy98 in that I will not make any excuses for any anti-gun sentienmts he has. I have been to all the seedy areas of Dallas, yes even at night. A practice I now try to avoid. What this did for me, was make me more pro-gun rights. On this forum, I don’t think I need to go into how gun control laws only hurt the good guys. We all know that.

    Quote Originally Posted by hsuCowboy98
    I just dont think it is really justifiable to pass judgement based on a couple of tidbits of info. What are we becoming if we do...a Clinton?

    Not trying to reignite this thread, rather just trying to call for some rationelle in passing judgement. .
    All I did was pass on the info I heard broadcast on public airwaves from his own mouth. I stated my opinion that it was irresponsible to not train more. I make no apologies for my “judgment” that someone in the line of duty (or anyone who caries a gun) should fire their weapon more than once a year.
    Quote Originally Posted by hsuCowboy98
    But seriously...all departments need more training, Dallas is no differant that anywhere else. Then again..are you willing to pay more taxes to fund this additional training? Are you willing to pay more taxes so that departments can hire better trained and educated individuals instead of losing them to other sectors? I doubt that the initial response to both these questions by 90% of people would be a big no. Put yourself in those shoes, making the decisions to balance a budget with training, equipment, insurance, ammo, weapons, investigations etc. .
    I am more than willing to allocate some of the millions of $ that Dallas wastes every year to more training for the Dallas Police Department. In addition, I think anyone who carries a gun for living should devote some of their own time to training. I devote my own time and expense to my gun training. And while I no longer get paid to carry a weapon, I also devote my own time and money to enhancing critical skills that I use in my current career.
    Quote Originally Posted by hsuCowboy98
    I just urge everyone to be cautious to persecute someone without first considering the postion they are in, sometimes it is more complicated than you think.
    I “persecuted” no one. If someone cannot take criticism, they do not belong in public office. In addition, despite the Chief’s years of experience in law enforcement, from his statements it is clear that he could learn from some people that know more about weapons than he does. That is not a slam against him. Like I said, I have heard many positive things about him as a Chief. But, it is obvious from his statements that he could learn some more about weapons. With no disrespect meant at all, I would love to see him spend a little range time with some of the guys I have met from Dallas SWAT.
    Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

    Si vis pacem, para bellum

  9. #23
    Senior Member Array hsuCowboy98's Avatar
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    I would love to see him spend a little range time with some of the guys I have met from Dallas SWAT.

    That is true, we can agree on that. Johnnie, and many other SWAT guys I have met are all great examples of Police Officers in their prime. The Dallas SWAT team itself is a great asset to Dallas.

    I am more than willing to allocate some of the millions of $ that Dallas wastes every year to more training for the Dallas Police Department.

    Too bad more people like me and you arent making those decisions.

    On this forum, I don’t think I need to go into how gun control laws only hurt the good guys.

    That is very true, I have spent the last 4 years arguing against gun control in any form, I know all the arguments of both sides by heart at this point.

    It is sad to say, but I dont think you will find many urban police chiefs in favor of gun proliferation in any form. It is just the nature of their environment.

    While many chiefs do need to educate themselves more on weapons and their uses, the focus of thier job is not to shoot or be shot at, theirs is to do the planning and orgainization of the forces on the streets. I wouldnt ask an accountant to go study up on how they manufacture dollar bills, or how checks are made. I would much rather have someone focus on their speciality than trying to be a jack of all trades and fail at all.

    And I just generally have a disdain for anyone who is willing to call a sworn active and legal LEO a coward... A traitor or someone who turned from the badge maybe...but a current active LEO, that is completely out of line IMO.
    Fear No Evil.

  10. #24
    Senior Member Array hsuCowboy98's Avatar
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    My chief shoots 95-100 on a regular basis. We shoot our HG qual course twice a month for four months yearly. Additionally, each of those four months we shoot a 10 round tactical course. I guess we're lucky in that regard.

    Yes you are very lucky, how big is your dept.?
    Fear No Evil.

  11. #25
    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
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    I agree with JT that shooting once a year is not enough to maintain proficiency. I would hope that anyone who carries a deadly weapon would take it upon themselves to be more current. Maybe he just meant he shot once a year for police department qualification? He might shoot on his own, not as part of the training regimen.

    We recently got a new police chief here in San Antonio. I need to do a little checking to see where he stands on 2nd Amendment issues. I haven't seen any statements one way or the other.
    Cheers,
    Rod
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