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World War 3 ?

This is a discussion on World War 3 ? within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Well, there was a lesson learned in both Vietnam and Afghanistan, The bad news is we (the "Free World") were not the ones that learned ...

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  1. #16
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    Well, there was a lesson learned in both Vietnam and Afghanistan, The bad news is we (the "Free World") were not the ones that learned it. We are still trying to go into unconventional situations with semi-conventional tactics.

    Sooner of later our leadership will have to realize that high tech isn't the end all to everything. While that 500 pound bomb will kill that insurgent, the over blast may create 2 more....... Not a way to win!
    Agreed.
    We need better on the ground intelligence. I understand that at this time we are somewhat understaffed in that area.We need a quick reaction force with quick reaction leaders and the ability to move unhindered. If we are going to fight an unconventional battle, we've got to be unconventional about it in every way, shape and form.

    The first thing we need to do is know the enemy and his intent and purpose. It seems to me like precious few in authority seem to know what that is because if they did, they would be more effective.
    The Israelis seem to understand this concept as well as anyone. If they have some terrorists causing problems, they all of a sudden "disappear" never to be heard of again. Its simple and effective.

    We need to be proactive,not reactive and leave the touchy feely good methods and political correctness and the U.N. mandates to the Europeans.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  2. #17
    Distinguished Member Array dimmak's Avatar
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    well said Hotguns....
    We must know our enemy..... It seems that no matter how clear the picture is, some will never see the truth.... There are conspiracy theorists on every corner convinced of their own elevated intelligence who deny the images not produced by some clandestine orginization, but by the Islamics themselves.... This is not some "Zionist Conspiracy" for world domination, but rather a determined, single minded effort to wipe non-believing "Infidels" from the very face of the Earth... They will not rest until they are either victorious or decimated...
    Just my .02...
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  3. #18
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    They will not rest until they are either victorious or decimated...
    There ya have it...
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  4. #19
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixBravo
    Remember, single-source intelligence is thrown away.
    True. So combine it with other known facts:

    1)China is the major Com-bloc arms supplier, followed closely by the ex-USSR conglomerate. China has empirical ideas, and is a major holder of US T-bills. China also needs oil, and the tech to increase their domestic production.(Socio-Economic warfighting)

    2)Russia (and much of the rest of the old USSR) is agressively pursuing closer relations with China, as is Chavez, in Venezuela. The Communist utilitarian mindset is by no means dead- they are perfectly happy using "little boomers" to curb the ability of the US to spread the "Democratic ideal", ie, Capitalism that is responsive to the Common Market-you and me- and not a directed State economy. (Alliance of combined interests)

    3) Our wonderful globalist politicians-from the city level, up- receive substantial PAC contributions from all of the above........hence, things are looking rough, for the "proletariat", aka, "us'ns". (Socio-Political Warfare)

    WWIII does not necessarily mean "Armagaeddon", but it can easily mean the end of the Constitutional Republic, and its SES closest ally, Isreal.

  5. #20
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    I think we do "know our enemy".
    The problem is choosing the appropriate actions in the "politically correct" western world.
    If the Islamic Jihadists had the military might that we posess, we'd all be dead.
    However, since they don't have the military mnight, they jab at us and annoy us and terrorize us.
    The Jihadist's attitude is that all infidels/non-believers should be killed. As a matter of fact, they believe it is their duty to kill them.
    They are merciless warriors.

    The west, on the other hand, must fight fair.
    I'm done with that.
    I think we should destroy them with all our might.

    As bad as Sadaam was, he knew this and governed his country accordingly.

  6. #21
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    I think we should destroy them with all our might.
    Dont worry. It'll happen someday.

    It may be 10,20 or 50 years from now, but it will come to a head eventually.Its just a matter of time...
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  7. #22
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    1} This is World War IV...Ronald Wilson Reagan lead us to victory in WWIII

    2} The lack of human intel can be laid directly at the feet of the most incompetent president of modern America.......Jimmy Crater

    3} Islam is the rectal cancer of the world and the only cure is the total removal of the tumor

  8. #23
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    This is a long one. Kudos to those who finish reading it.

    In Re to Rob72 and others:

    I understand what you are saying but there are some fundamental dificiencies. First of all, there was zero comraderie between the Soviet Union and the People's Republic (China, not California). There was a severe falling out between Mao and Stalin in terms of how communism should be utilized. This falling-out was so severe that the United States actually signed a mutual-aggression treaty (in the late 60's??? Early 70's?) with China that said that the PRC would launch against the USSR if the balloon ever went up between the US and USSR. To this day, the Chinese and the Russians still don't like each other. The only reason they do business is because the PRC LOVES to buy Russian weaponry and the Russians are struggling to hold back the old-school communists - and the only way to do that is with $$$ and a working economy.

    As far as the PRC being a major arms supplier - the United States is actually suspected of being the largest (legal & illeagal) arms supplier - followed by Russia then the PRC. The PRC just likes to reverse-engineer much of Russia's toys and then produce their own at cheaper prices (and some say quality). This is incredibly dangerous because of how advanced the Russian defense industry is. They are producing 5th generation fighters and are fielding 5th generation missiles while the US Congress is still squabbling over our 4th Gen fighters (F-22 & JSF). The only reason the US is maintaining the numero uno slot is because of how successful they and Israel have been with US technology in its wars. (If I'm not mistaken, the IAF has never lost an F-15 or F-16 in combat.... I could easily be wrong by this point.) Nothing sells weapons like battle-tested stats.

    I won't argue the campaign contributions and all that jazz. Despite the fact that China likes to rattle its sabre and its human rights violations, its still holds the US's "Most Favored Nation" trade status. Gee.... I wonder why? But, as far as saying those reasons listed are tantamount to WW3 - it doesn't really fly. The comment about single-source intelligence applies directly to small-scale items and single actions. No one can make solid intel estimates based one three broad.... generalizations? Assumptions? I dunno what to call it. The only people surely qualified to make those calls are people who have numerous Masters degrees and Doctorates - the SERIOUS students of history.

    But I digress. My point is this: We will face a major war sometime in the next 20 years. It will probably be with China (North Korea is a distant 2nd place). We should focus on that threat, too. Terrorism will always be there. It always has been. It was just shoved into our faces with 9/11. Some of you will call me callous for saying that - but what I'm saying is a fact. The primary difference between the pre and post-9/11 worlds is that now Anti-Terrorism is international policy for the United States. All the hijacked airliners, Pan Am Flight 103, the Marine barracks in Beruit, the Israeli Rescue @ Entebbe and everything else that happened prior to that solemn Tuesday just didn't make as big an impact because it wasn't HERE. It will continue to get worse until the US and terrorism reach a tipping point, and I don't even want to venture to guess whats going to happen at that time.

    Don't ever forget the people who have lost their lives in attacks or in response to them. Ever. I'm not saying that anyone here has, but also don't forget that long after we have won or lost the war against terrorism (if its even possible for either to happen), there will still be wars. All the United States can do is hold its head high and HOPE we are making the right choices. Just because the Cold War is over, doesn't mean we can crap out our intelligence community. Jimmy Carter and Clinton already tried that and look what happened. We should dump more funding into the NSA and FBI, and then give the CIA its *ahem*s back. Once that's done, work with every friendly country to share intel and funding (Interpol could use some more finances, too) and then see what happens to terrorism. I swear, some people don't understand that to prepare for peace - is to prepare for war.

    One thing to keep in mind is a lesson in history....
    Rome was the greatest empire that ever existed. And who/what brought it down? And how? To answer this question is to understand a lot of current US foreign and domestic policy (and in same cases the lack of common sense in it).

    ***********
    (EDIT) - I don't want this post to have it come across that I think I'm some sort of expert. I've taken some foreign policy, intel analysis, and anti-terrorism classes. I've written a few intel assessments, too (all unclassified stuff). But, I am by no means a pro with this. This post is just my opinion based on what I understand about how things have been happening. I am sure as heck not the last word on this topic. I actually love to hear differing opinions on this kind of stuff.
    Last edited by SixBravo; August 1st, 2006 at 11:29 PM.
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  9. #24
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    Great post...


    Rome was the greatest empire that ever existed. And who/what brought it down? And how? To answer this question is to understand a lot of current US foreign and domestic policy (and in same cases the lack of common sense in it).
    Rome fell from within...and IMMORALITY in many different ways caused their demise.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  10. #25
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    Just remember, it can't be a World War until France surrenders.

    But seriously, letting the world know that any Weapons of Mass Destruction used on the US, its friends or allies will be considered an act of war by Iran, North Korea and whoever else is behind this **** (Syria), and will be retaliated by the most powerful nukes we can drop on them without ruining the oil fields or frying our allies. There will be no apologies about innocents. Do we think every dead Italian, German and Japanese were guilty of war crimes in WWII? Including the women and children?? Of course not.

    And build the missile defense systems. It can be done. But it won't be perfect. Live with it.

    Covertly, we should be having teams following Al-jazeera employees everywhere, back tracking and killing with prejudice the leaders of these terrorist organizations. Sure, new leaders will pop up, but if every one that is halfway competent gets his head blown off, eventually the organization will collapse.

    As for Red China, sure it is developing, including its military, but it isn't perfect - the Three Rivers Dam is one hell of a target, and Taiwan probably has nukes.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixBravo
    [I] First of all, there was zero comraderie between the Soviet Union and the People's Republic (China, not California). There was a severe falling out between Mao and Stalin in terms of how communism should be utilized. This falling-out was so severe that the United States actually signed a mutual-aggression treaty (in the late 60's??? Early 70's?) with China that said that the PRC would launch against the USSR if the balloon ever went up between the US and USSR. To this day, the Chinese and the Russians still don't like each other. The only reason they do business is because the PRC LOVES to buy Russian weaponry and the Russians are struggling to hold back the old-school communists - and the only way to do that is with $$$ and a working economy.
    In roughly 2001/2002, the Russian White Papers (Statement of Military/Political orientation for the next 1-5 years), Putin (by proxy) stated that, barring a distinct turn in relations with the West (US) it would be necessary to puruse closer relations with the PRC. Several reasons were cited, including the rise of Islamic fundamentalism, the decay/dissolution of the military facilities in the ex-Soviet bloc, and the need for economic revival.

    Regarding the PRA, currently, they are the most viable counter-force to the US Armed Forces. However, the PRC is in serious deficit, in female births, leaving them in a radical population decline within the next 20-30 years, barring a major social change-none too likely. In otherwords they will have a 20 million man army of 60 year olds. The PRC clearly recognizes this threat to their direction, and the threat of the Indians/Pakistanis, should Islam get on a roll, to the south. Hence, their need for an ally- Russia.

    Lastly, whatever is "suspected", Haliburton is not putting out 10million M16 units on the world market, each year. Norinco/China Sports aka, the PRA is. Who are they supplying? Good little communists and radical moslems. Why the radical moslems? If you want to do away with a religion that encourages armed opposition to subjugation, how would one go about it? Perhaps by assisting in making that sect so virulently violent that the whole world could be made to see the dangers of "Religion", and getting the West to expend its economy and military in global conflict, while the PRC builds and trains.

    This does not even touch the economic possiblities open to the PRC, with a dump of Treasury bills, on the world markets.

    Sound far-fetched? Read Mao, Lenin, and Sun Tzu........

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by SixBravo
    Terrorism will always be there. It always has been. It was just shoved into our faces with 9/11. Some of you will call me callous for saying that - but what I'm saying is a fact. The primary difference between the pre and post-9/11 worlds is that now Anti-Terrorism is international policy for the United States.
    I think you are close on this point. The BIG difference is that it WAS HERE!

    Many of the other incidents should have been enough to "shove it into our faces" if they hadn't been buried in the sand! Say what you will, we have been missing lessons and ignoring signs for years. Now we better learn new tactics and catch up quick. But, that's just my opinion.
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

  13. #28
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    Let's get it on then. We should have learned from the past that waiting sure doesn't make it get any better.

    Jihad? Crusaders/Infidels kicked their butts before.

    China? Should have let McArtur go when he wanted to attack them, too much longer and we'll have a major battle on our hands.

  14. #29
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    hey with one good nuke we can get in the hall of fame for making the worlds largest glass bowl =o)

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by .45acp
    Jihad? Crusaders/Infidels kicked their butts before.
    I wouldn't call that a good example, Crusaders won some battles but lost the war!
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

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