People not trusting cops

This is a discussion on People not trusting cops within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by SIXTO I've also noticed that it typically has a direct reflection on pay rates. The areas that are willing to pay for ...

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  1. #61
    Senior Member Array IAm_Not_Lost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    I've also noticed that it typically has a direct reflection on pay rates. The areas that are willing to pay for a professional get them. Those who don't get what they get.
    Excellent point. Why bother with a job that makes you have an education requirement if the pay stinks. Although you could play the devils advocate as well....why risk your LIFE for poor pay...
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  3. #62
    Member Array thephanatik's Avatar
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    I've never been pulled over, never had a collision, etc., so I personally have not had any negative police officer interactions. My particular city was dealing with a lot of corruption a few years back that resulted in most of the great officers retiring early or getting fired/quitting. For a while there wasn't many good officers left (My mom used to be a dispatcher, so she knew most off the officers and knew which were genuinely good people and which weren't). During this time, my brother-in-law, who is bi-polar, made a comment about killing himself. My sister was a little worried and called the police. One officer came, verified who he was, then proceeded to grab his wrists, throw him to the ground, which broke his glasses and cut up his face, and handcuffed him. They filed a complaint but nothing was done about it. They don't trust the police anymore. We have since got a new COP (Chief of Police - a cool acronym ) that seems to be turning the department around for the better. I've seen more patrol and unmarked cars out in the last couple years than I did in probably 15 years before that.
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    Good post by hot guns, but he made a pretty large leap from not trusting cops to hating cops. Big difference in my opinion. As for me, trust but verify. I'll give the police the benefit of the doubt every time, but I also wasn't born yesterday.
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  5. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    I dont go around saying that I hate carpenters because I had a couple of bad experiences with one many moons ago.

    I dont go around slandering bankers because one closed the bank early one day and I didnt get the money I needed.

    I dont go around bad mouthing preachers because a rotten one got caught in the sack with his secretary.
    Fortunately, carpenters, bankers, and preachers don't have the power to arrest someone and ruin their lives. You can fire the carpenter, withdraw your money from the banker, and tell the preacher to go to hell--but that arrest record is with you for life.
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  6. #65
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    An arrest record doesn't follow you. A criminal one does. You have to be convicted for that.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    VIP Member Array 357and40's Avatar
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    Sixto an arrest record may not show up on the typical commercial background check but it does on an FBI check if you ever need clearance. I contract with a local PD and had 9 people go through their system & only 3 passed due to prior arrests. No convictions, just arrests.

    We did learn a lot about our staff and their ability to get good lawyers from this experience.

    As for Bankers, Carpenters & Preachers:

    Bankers can FUBAR your finances with the slip of a digit. Through no fault of your own they can devastate you financially (at least in the short term.

    Carpenters can do lousy work & cause your home to be structurally unstable & when it collapses on you & kills your family it can be rather upsetting.

    Preachers can cause a little damage too... ask the followers of David Koresh or Jim Jones....
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  8. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by 357and40 View Post
    Sixto an arrest record may not show up on the typical commercial background check but it does on an FBI check if you ever need clearance. I contract with a local PD and had 9 people go through their system & only 3 passed due to prior arrests. No convictions, just arrests.
    Yeah, I know. But who's fault is that? The police? The applicant? The potential employer?

    Most of the time applicants are bounced from employment process for not being honest about arrests. Employers should be looking at big pictures, and use the arrest record for what they are worth. For example, lets say a applicant comes in for a truck driving job today. He has an arrest (no conviction) for marijuana possession in 1991. Thats it. He is honest about it. Now lets say another guy comes in. He has no convictions but arrests for the same in 1993, 2001 and 2010. See the value there? I'd say there is something up with guy #2, and no hire. I'd be willing to give guy one a shot.

    OK, now lets say guy number one has the same record, but lies about it. Do I hire him? Nope. I can't trust him.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  9. #68
    Senior Member Array Chevy-SS's Avatar
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    I could gripe about some LEO encounters, and I could also hand out compliments to some LEO's.

    Bottom line - LEO's are people, just like all of us - some good, some not so good - which is why I'm such an advocate of all LEO/civilian encounters being recorded with audio/video.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagleks View Post
    I think you "assume" too much. I'll leave it at that, I don't think it's just people how have had a bad experience with 1 or 2 all of the time.

    IF I had a bad carpenter, I sure wouldn't hire him a 2nd time either ... and I sure would check the next one out even more carefully.
    As an follow-up to that comment, the carpenter can only affect the work you ask them to do; the banker can only do so much in your financial dealings; a preacher can only affect you spiritually - but the LEO can affect your freedom & your future. That's why this subject can be so polarized.

    It comes down to how reasonable a person is in relation to their life experiences. Whether they associate the behavior of someone acting in their vocational capacity with all people in that vocation, or that they realize that the people they've interacted with were acting of their own accord.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 357and40 View Post
    Bankers can FUBAR your finances with the slip of a digit. Through no fault of your own they can devastate you financially (at least in the short term.
    Like the guy at my credit union that misplaced a decimal point while I was on vacation. Nothing like being a thousand miles from home and only having one tenth of your pay check credited to your account. So I guess I am supposed to not trust anyone that works in the financial field. They are all either incompetent or crooks just like Bernie Madoff and Allen Stanford.
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  12. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    An arrest record doesn't follow you. A criminal one does. You have to be convicted for that.
    No? I think it's called a "record" for a reason. If it shows up on any background check--it's a record. Unless one goes through the procedures for have it deleted (expunged?) it remains for eternity.

    The fair thing would be for all "arrests" to be erased when charges are not pressed or are dropped. No trial/conviction-no "arrest" record.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce130 View Post
    Good post by hot guns, but he made a pretty large leap from not trusting cops to hating cops. Big difference in my opinion. As for me, trust but verify. I'll give the police the benefit of the doubt every time, but I also wasn't born yesterday.
    100% agree... It takes all kinds of personalities to make the world go around, never take any for granted, and or at face value. Once the mouth opens up and the head starts talking, that's when you know whatcha got.
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  14. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    No? I think it's called a "record" for a reason. If it shows up on any background check--it's a record. Unless one goes through the procedures for have it deleted (expunged?) it remains for eternity.

    The fair thing would be for all "arrests" to be erased when charges are not pressed or are dropped. No trial/conviction-no "arrest" record.
    See my followup post
    "Just blame Sixto"

  15. #74
    Member Array beni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Yeah, I know. But who's fault is that? The police? The applicant? The potential employer?

    Most of the time applicants are bounced from employment process for not being honest about arrests. Employers should be looking at big pictures, and use the arrest record for what they are worth. For example, lets say a applicant comes in for a truck driving job today. He has an arrest (no conviction) for marijuana possession in 1991. Thats it. He is honest about it. Now lets say another guy comes in. He has no convictions but arrests for the same in 1993, 2001 and 2010. See the value there? I'd say there is something up with guy #2, and no hire. I'd be willing to give guy one a shot.

    OK, now lets say guy number one has the same record, but lies about it. Do I hire him? Nope. I can't trust him.
    this is also how it works with security clearances. As long as you are truthful on the application having an arrest does not automatically disqualify a person from obtaining a clearance.

  16. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    I had an incident one time at McDonald's with two Ohio State Troopers. I bought them each a sunday and they let my son wear one of their hats. It was really terrible and I was really really shaken up. I should have called a lawyer.
    Nicely done all around.
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