What if drugs went away? - Page 7

What if drugs went away?

This is a discussion on What if drugs went away? within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by suntzu Well, I was questiniong the statement the poster made which said the CIA funds "itself". He did not say others. As ...

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  1. #91
    Member Array gobbly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    Well, I was questiniong the statement the poster made which said the CIA funds "itself". He did not say others. As far as rebel groups the traffiking of drugs was so the rebels could fund themselves. Or put a better way..so overt tax dollars were not used to fund a covert operation which may or may not have had any oversight by the Senate Intelligence committee. But theCIA did not fund "itself" with drug money.

    And like you said, it isn't just the CIA, all governemtns and intelligence agencies have done 'bad things' too justify an end.
    I dunno, seems like pedantics. It was a CIA operation, funded by drug money. Of course that money never made it into the general account, and of course it didn't go down into the accounting shown to those with oversight. You'll certainly never convince me that money spent on a CIA operation isn't funding the CIA, whether it hits their general accounts, or the accountants put it in a report or not.

    I guess I just don't really understand the difference you are trying to impart. To me, money spent on CIA operations is money spent on CIA operations, regardless of where it comes from, or what sort of accounting tricks they might use to to hide it. Does it have to go out through payroll to technically be 'funding itself'?

    I don't think anyone said tax dollars were spent on that particular endeavor. If they had been there would have been no need to fund it through illicit channels.


  2. #92
    Member Array garwha's Avatar
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    All illegal drugs kill, therefore all sellers of illegal drugs are killers, all killers importing, manufacturing, or selling illegal drugs must be executed for thier crime within 30 day of a guilty prosecution. This law would make distribution very unpopular very quickly in this country, and put a bigger hamper on drugs than anything else has ever done. Punisment just need to match the crime.

  3. #93
    Senior Member Array Chevy-SS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garwha View Post
    All illegal drugs kill, therefore all sellers of illegal drugs are killers, all killers importing, manufacturing, or selling illegal drugs must be executed for thier crime within 30 day of a guilty prosecution. This law would make distribution very unpopular very quickly in this country, and put a bigger hamper on drugs than anything else has ever done. Punisment just need to match the crime.

    Jeesh, lighten up a little. What happens when your 15-year old son buys a $20 bag of pot and then sells half the bag (with no profit involved) to a friend? You gonna execute him too?


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  4. #94
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gobbly View Post
    I dunno, seems like pedantics. It was a CIA operation, funded by drug money. Of course that money never made it into the general account, and of course it didn't go down into the accounting shown to those with oversight. You'll certainly never convince me that money spent on a CIA operation isn't funding the CIA, whether it hits their general accounts, or the accountants put it in a report or not.

    I guess I just don't really understand the difference you are trying to impart. To me, money spent on CIA operations is money spent on CIA operations, regardless of where it comes from, or what sort of accounting tricks they might use to to hide it. Does it have to go out through payroll to technically be 'funding itself'?

    I don't think anyone said tax dollars were spent on that particular endeavor. If they had been there would have been no need to fund it through illicit channels.
    Pedantics! What is this a word game LOL! I was actually trying to articulate something else but it did not come out right. But instead of clarifying I will bow out since I don't want to have to thread go of course...not that it hasn;t already!

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by garwha View Post
    All illegal drugs kill, therefore all sellers of illegal drugs are killers, all killers importing, manufacturing, or selling illegal drugs must be executed for thier crime within 30 day of a guilty prosecution. This law would make distribution very unpopular very quickly in this country, and put a bigger hamper on drugs than anything else has ever done. Punisment just need to match the crime.
    First part in bold--- absolutely false.

    Your solution, unworkable and doesn't solve the problem. They use draconian punishments in Indonesia
    and in China, and in other countries. They still have the problem. There's just more profit in the trade
    because the risk is higher.

    There are also fairly well established frame-ups of foreign nationals who end up with life sentences in jails
    where they won't survive for very long.

    I think you need to rethink both your solution and your assessment of the dangers of "all drugs."
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  6. #96
    Member Array gobbly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garwha View Post
    All illegal drugs kill, therefore all sellers of illegal drugs are killers, all killers importing, manufacturing, or selling illegal drugs must be executed for thier crime within 30 day of a guilty prosecution. This law would make distribution very unpopular very quickly in this country, and put a bigger hamper on drugs than anything else has ever done. Punisment just need to match the crime.
    Not only is your opening statement incorrect, but you could use the same logic to justify the death penalty for anyone who operates a combustion engine...

    Plus, I've visited multiple countries that impose the death penalty for smuggling drugs, and yet they still have drugs. Some of them are major exporters to the US in fact...

  7. #97
    Member Array l1a1's Avatar
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    Let's start with RJ Reynolds, Merck, Lilli, Anheuser Busch, Ford, GM, Chrysler, Crazy Daves disount fireworks.
    Let the executions begin!

    Who's with me? Every one of these corporations sells products that kill. Products that kill every single day. We will only be safe when someone steps in and puts a stop to these greedy, dealers in death. Domestic terrorists I say.

    Rant off!
    It's kind of like how some people have a sudden and insatiable desire to talk about vampires after the Twilight series became popular, except zombies are much less gay and more likely to exist one day

  8. #98
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    What about the maker of those deadly Lawn Darts we played with! Death!!!!
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  9. #99
    Member Array garwha's Avatar
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    My point was no penalty, no foul. We will never control drugs with our legal system. I would legalize it all, like Alcohol, and Tobacco, and a least have profit, employment, tax income, cut that government wasted control efforts, portion part of the income from it to take care of the addiction problems, legalization could be so much better than what we have.
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  10. #100
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    Everything is toxic..it is the dose that matters....making something against the law does not stop it...severe punishment does not deter, if it did, there would be no murder....the only thing you would accomplish is to make drugs more expensive and increase the crime rate with the rising cost of drugs....as long as drugs make people have a sense of well being you will never stop them.

    Quote Originally Posted by garwha View Post
    All illegal drugs kill, therefore all sellers of illegal drugs are killers, all killers importing, manufacturing, or selling illegal drugs must be executed for thier crime within 30 day of a guilty prosecution. This law would make distribution very unpopular very quickly in this country, and put a bigger hamper on drugs than anything else has ever done. Punisment just need to match the crime.

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by mascariot View Post
    Not to mention coffeem, energy drinks and tea...stimulant drugs by any definition.

    OMG! Not my coffee!
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  12. #102
    Ex Member Array mascariot's Avatar
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    Isn't it obvious??? remember when laundered money was being used to fund the contra's??? The CIA's budget does not begin to cover it's operations....In Southeast Asia heroin was being dumped in the US via the CIA......these ass holes are so rotten that they are not allowed to have operations in the US...

    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    Wow. The CIA funds itself by distributing drugs. News to me. I am not saying that our gvt has not done some stupid things but to imply that is how the CIA funds itself? You seem to have a major problem with the CIA.Just curious if you ever worked with them or for them? Just asking.

  13. #103
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garwha View Post
    My point was no penalty, no foul. We will never control drugs with our legal system. I would legalize it all, like Alcohol, and Tobacco, and a least have profit, employment, tax income, cut that government wasted control efforts, portion part of the income from it to take care of the addiction problems, legalization could be so much better than what we have.
    Yes, I can see how we all missed your point. This post is sooooooooo similiar to the original post you made:

    All illegal drugs kill, therefore all sellers of illegal drugs are killers, all killers importing, manufacturing, or selling illegal drugs must be executed for thier crime within 30 day of a guilty prosecution. This law would make distribution very unpopular very quickly in this country, and put a bigger hamper on drugs than anything else has ever done. Punisment just need to match the crime.
    Boy do I feel like an idiot for not following your train of thought LOL
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  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lotus222 View Post
    The ATF wouldn't know what to do if they couldn't spend all of their resources busting distributors of pot, let alone other illicit substances. The police force in this country wouldn't have probable cause to search and arrest anyone without criminalization of drugs - therefore hates the idea of legalizing them. Pharmaceutical companies hate marijuana because it is so cheap to produce - they lose big bucks because of its alternate treatment effects.

    There is a ton of federal/state money and jobs that revolve around illegal substances. There is also a lot of power over the people by having illicit substances. These entities don't want to change the laws; people be damned.

    On another note, now the media is claiming accidental death by prescription pain killers have topped annual automobile accidental deaths in the US. I do realize that that is a big problem in this country, but I'm not so sure that I buy into those statistics... I'm assuming the agenda behind that one is calling for even tighter restrictions and more drug control measures.
    Nor do I. Not "accidental deaths." FASTSTATS - Accidents or Unintentional Injuries

    A few things have to be factored out from unintentional poisoning deaths before you can focus on prescription
    drugs. Factor out alcohol related deaths; hard drug related death; hospital administered medications (wrong ones and wrong doses), poisonous plants which some folk eat unwittingly, young kids getting under the kitchen counter. There's lots of things that have to be cut out of the big
    picture, the universe of 31,000 unintentional poisonings. When you do that, " accidental death by prescription pain killers " can come nowhere near automobile related deaths.

    Someone or some group is telling another whopper, and I can guess who it probably is, the
    drug testing industry and the hysterical zealots in that camp. Claims that prescription drug abuse
    cause more deaths than automobile accidents besides being obviously bogus, serve to make a market
    for expansion of their services and profits.
    Last edited by Hopyard; June 23rd, 2012 at 09:14 PM. Reason: spelling
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  15. #105
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PB2 View Post
    The anti-gunners are constantly screaming about how wonderful the world would be if all guns would somehow magically go away. They believe people would stop hurting each other and live together in peace and harmony.

    My thought is how wonderful would it be if we were to somehow, magically, stop the flow of drugs into the US? How would all of those drug dealers make money? Would they quit crime and get legit jobs, suddenly becoming contributing members of society? Or would they simply turn to another type of crime? Something more violent perhaps?
    Criminals are about as likely to stop trying to make things the easy way, as drug addicts are likely to go out and get/hold down jobs just because the price of drugs went down.
    "People who take an Internet handle of a great warrior, are usually the first to go fetal when crunch time comes." - Me

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