"Tasered" twice = cardiac arrest?

"Tasered" twice = cardiac arrest?

This is a discussion on "Tasered" twice = cardiac arrest? within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; This is not about whether tasers are safe... This is the first time I've heard of being "tasered" twice (I mean with 2 tasers).. Or ...

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Thread: "Tasered" twice = cardiac arrest?

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    "Tasered" twice = cardiac arrest?

    This is not about whether tasers are safe... This is the first time I've heard of being "tasered" twice (I mean with 2 tasers).. Or whether it was necessary... The guy was still "active" after the first taser shot... so, short of killing him with a gun, what else could have been done?

    Lousy short reporting here
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose


  2. #2
    Distinguished Member Array kapnketel's Avatar
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    6'3" 276 pounds, big dude on a rampage. I have read examples of police using multiple tasers on people, especially when under the influence of meth. Seems like they did hat they had to do.
    I'd rather be lucky than good any day

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    Member Array lordofwyr's Avatar
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    The news media always tries to make it out that the suspect died because they were Tased by the evil police who should have just left the nice, law abiding person alone, without any understanding of how the Taser actually works or how the human body reacts.

    I promise you that I would rather be Tased than pepper sprayed or hit with batons, or in many cases shot. As soon as the trigger is released, the incident is over. Pepper spray takes a long time to wash off and baton and bullet wounds take even longer to heal.

    Here is a nice article on why the Taser is safe:

    How Tasers Work

    If you ever read the medical reports after there is a death in police custody, which most people do not because it is weeks or months in coming out, you find that in the majority of the cases where a person died after a struggle with police or after being Tased, the following conditions existed in the deceased at the time of death:

    Obesity
    Prior medical heart conditions
    Use of powerful uppers, pain pills or psychotropics.
    The suspect was fighting madly, causing the heart to be overtaxed to a point that it simply could not sustain the body any longer.

    They train us to watch for these conditions and get the suspect treated by EMS or taken to a hospital if we fear they may suddenly collapse and die, which is caused when the heart simply gives up after all of those conditions take their toll. It does not take a Taser to do this, just the extreme over exertion. The heart was going to stop anyway from the exertion.

    What I was told by an ambulance paramedic was that the person was probably going to die from their exertion whether or not they had the run in with police, and that the Taser had nothing to do with it, no matter what the media hype says (or even some courts), because if you take an obese person and run them in a marathon, if they are hyped on drugs, they will definitely keep going until they die, and that is basically what happens. Once the suspect is subdued and starts to come down, the heart just cannot handle the stress and strain.
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  4. #4
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lordofwyr View Post
    The news media always tries to make it out that the suspect died because they were Tased by the evil police who should have just left the nice, law abiding person alone, without any understanding of how the Taser actually works or how the human body reacts.

    I promise you that I would rather be Tased than pepper sprayed or hit with batons, or in many cases shot. As soon as the trigger is released, the incident is over. Pepper spray takes a long time to wash off and baton and bullet wounds take even longer to heal.

    Here is a nice article on why the Taser is safe:

    How Tasers Work

    If you ever read the medical reports after there is a death in police custody, which most people do not because it is weeks or months in coming out, you find that in the majority of the cases where a person died after a struggle with police or after being Tased, the following conditions existed in the deceased at the time of death:

    Obesity
    Prior medical heart conditions
    Use of powerful uppers, pain pills or psychotropics.
    The suspect was fighting madly, causing the heart to be overtaxed to a point that it simply could not sustain the body any longer.

    They train us to watch for these conditions and get the suspect treated by EMS or taken to a hospital if we fear they may suddenly collapse and die, which is caused when the heart simply gives up after all of those conditions take their toll. It does not take a Taser to do this, just the extreme over exertion. The heart was going to stop anyway from the exertion.

    What I was told by an ambulance paramedic was that the person was probably going to die from their exertion whether or not they had the run in with police, and that the Taser had nothing to do with it, no matter what the media hype says (or even some courts), because if you take an obese person and run them in a marathon, if they are hyped on drugs, they will definitely keep going until they die, and that is basically what happens. Once the suspect is subdued and starts to come down, the heart just cannot handle the stress and strain.
    I am not questioning the safety of the taser. I am not questioning whether this guy needed two tasers. I am just passing on an article showing that 2 tasers were used, and that the person who was tasered died. 6'3" 276 pounds.. .might not be obese... might be mostly muscle.. The average offensive tackle in the NFL went from an average of ~280 # like ten years ago to about 315 nowadays.

    He was in a mental facility... perhaps he should have been under restraints.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

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    Senior Member Array TheShadow's Avatar
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    "I'm going to meet my maker," he said. "And I'm not going alone."
    Prior Mug Shot for Domestic Battery



    After Dillard was subdued and handcuffed, Kelly said, a staffer at the facility injected him with drugs. Dillard went into cardiac arrest and died soon after.
    More Information HERE

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    Member Array lordofwyr's Avatar
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    I wasn't questioning any of the facts in the report.

    From what I read, the first Taser missed, or only one prong secured, which means there was probably not an electrical discharge, or if any, not nearly enough. The second Taser apparently made contact and dropped him like it should have.

    All I was doing was passing along information to any readers who might have heard the lopsided news reports on persons dying in police custody after being Tased or even just fighting with the police so that they had information to make up their own minds with.

    If a sedentary person shoots their heart rate up to extreme levels, nothing good can be expected, and mental patients with overloading chemicals from their own bodies will "burn themselves up" physically too.

    No offense was meant, just information.
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  7. #7
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheShadow View Post
    Prior Mug Shot for Domestic Battery





    More Information HERE
    Well, now we have more story, thanks for that... big guy too... not necessarily obese... but you can't tell from the mug.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  8. #8
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    But he had a nice message on his answering machine, so that means he was a nice law-abiding citizen.

    I really wouldn't mind if LEO's went back to shooting people. Less complaints, less litigation, and no question in what their intent was.
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    Member Array NCMedic8617's Avatar
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    Most of the deaths that have come from Tasers or any other in custody death are more likely attributed to agitated delirium than anything else, they were going to die regardless of how the threat was stopped.
    Two quick articles I found
    http://www.npr.org/templates/text/s.php?sId=7608386&m=1
    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excited_delirium

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    Personally, my opinion only, I think "agitated delirium" is too glib and facile an answer.
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  11. #11
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    I see no problem with tasering until the threat is stopped.
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    oakchas, it happens more often than people think, sometimes the wires get broken and second taser is applied, sometimes the spread isn't good enough to achieve the desired effect=only pain compliance instead of stopping their swinging/kicking/etc, sometimes they are the 1 in a 1000 that don't react to the taser as most do and another taser is needed to achieve desired effect

    now some add on.........
    its physically impossible for a taser to cause a heart attack because of the dc amperage being so low its not enough to interrupt the heart's rythms (AED/hospital defibulators use 70-300 milliamps, tasers use .4 of one millliamp)
    if it did, then literally thousands of officers all across the country would be having heart attacks

    the people that die after being tased always, ALWAYS have some sort of other issue, most of the time being narcotics, but also heart condition, and as mentioned excited delirium which is a separate physical condition from what happens when you're tased,
    Hopyard it is a known factual medical condition, I've had a mentally disturbed person go into excited delirium and SHE fought 3 of us, had to hold her on the pavement until ambulance could get there to drug her up and get her to the hospital, we are trained to see someone showing symptoms on calls or if in the course of subduing someone they go into it we gotta act fast and get medical help

    last year we had a guy die after being tased after he pulled a knife on his own dad, officer stopped cycle when 2nd officer wrestled the knife away during the cycle, guy stopped breathing, our officers were dragged through the mud in the media and a lot of folks .....then the autopsy came back and he was on meth, crack, marijuana, alcohol, and 3 other kinds of narcotic pills, they said he would have died in the next few minutes from all the crap in his system no matter if he was tased or not
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  13. #13
    Senior Member Array justherenow's Avatar
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    Tasers are over used. All to often when they are not needed they are used. They have their place but like any other use of force, it should only be used when totally necessary.
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    thank god he didn't have a hoodie on... the fall out would have been bad

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    Tasers have their place...you become aggressive or fail to follow specific directions from LEO...Bingo! Instant respect!
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