EMP weapons. The most likely SHTF scenario? - Page 5

EMP weapons. The most likely SHTF scenario?

This is a discussion on EMP weapons. The most likely SHTF scenario? within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; too. In fact there are people who are trying to come up with good ways for police to use this technology to disable cars during ...

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  1. #61
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    too. In fact there are people who are trying to come up with good ways for police to use this technology to disable cars during a chase.
    Been in use for awhile. Drive over it and the car dies...which isnt good if you are doing 100 mph and you lose you power assisted steering and brakes.
    Steering and brakes will still work, but it will be very difficult.

    And btw, most vehicles built from the 90's up are succeptable to this technology whether its uses a key or not.
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  2. #62
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    Random thought and although it is the least of troubles (for some) in an EMP SHTF scenario, what will the world do without iPhones and facespace and mybook and twit updates!? Oh the humanity! Maybe people will start losing weight. Maybe we could avoid the world thats comi g upon us as shown in Pixars Wall*E. It is actualy a pleasant thought to me.

    On a serious note. As much as I cant stand anything with Kevin Costner in it, except The Untouchables of course, I really thought that The Postman had potential as a film. Aside from packages we are looking nationwide at esentialy losing the USPS and old school "snail mail." What really could happen with a 100% Total breakdown in communications, including physical mail delivery? Think about that.
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  3. #63
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    too. In fact there are people who are trying to come up with good ways for police to use this technology to disable cars during a chase.
    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Been in use for awhile. Drive over it and the car dies...which isnt good if you are doing 100 mph and you lose you power assisted steering and brakes.
    Steering and brakes will still work, but it will be very difficult.

    And btw, most vehicles built from the 90's up are succeptable to this technology whether its uses a key or not.
    True, I should have been more clear in my statement. What I meant that they were working on is a system that can disable a vehicle without it having to drive over some strip placed there ion advance. They have systems that do not require prior placement of devices you have to drive over but they can be dangerous for the officers to use. The ones I have seen involve either contact with the car being chased or launching some electronic device from the care chasing to the care being chased.
    The desire is a way to disable the car without endangering the officers. I would think that requiring manufactures to put a device in the car that will allow remote shutdown of only the car being chased is being looked at.

    Michael

  4. #64
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    Just started the book, so much to think about! Time to really start saving my pennies and put together a decent bug.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doodle View Post
    Guys being a former navy nuclear electronics tech and understanding some nuclear theory, naturally I am interested in the weapons side of the house. From what I've read if you're close enough to a nuclear blast to experience emp, you are literally going to be toast. Think about all the electronic gear that's been used to measure various blast parameters in close proximity to detonations. I think emp strikes ave been overly hyped by Hollywood. Magnetic lines of force dissipate rapidly over distance. Think about how close to high tension lines you have to be to experience any interference issues.
    Not true. The most dangerous nuclear detonation, as it pertains to EMP, is one detonated outside the atmosphere so you would not have to worry about being killed by either blast or fallout. Fallout is a product of debris and dust being thrown up into the air and then drifting back to the ground.

    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    Most cars are safe against EMP... most cars are rolling "Faraday Cage." Now, if you have one of the new fangled cars that requires no key at all... just the fob that activates the doors, which has an RFID chip in it... that might not work...
    Again, this isn't accurate. Farady cages have to be grounded to Earth Ground and a car is definitely not. Additionally, a farady cage is made up of conductive, fine mesh screen and a car has large gaps in it's metal shell that would negate any protection the metal might offer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doodle View Post
    OK I officially stand corrected. Interesting and scary. Both Pakistan and North Korea have nuclear weapons and Iran wants to join the club... Lends a bit of feasibility to this hypothetical.
    Indeed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ionracas View Post
    Random thought and although it is the least of troubles (for some) in an EMP SHTF scenario, what will the world do without iPhones and facespace and mybook and twit updates!? Oh the humanity! Maybe people will start losing weight. Maybe we could avoid the world thats comi g upon us as shown in Pixars Wall*E. It is actualy a pleasant thought to me.

    On a serious note. As much as I cant stand anything with Kevin Costner in it, except The Untouchables of course, I really thought that The Postman had potential as a film. Aside from packages we are looking nationwide at esentialy losing the USPS and old school "snail mail." What really could happen with a 100% Total breakdown in communications, including physical mail delivery? Think about that.
    I actually am one of maybe 20 people who really like "The Postman" and have it on DVD. I think it was well done and while I am not really a Kevin Costner fan, I think he did a pretty good job with this performance.
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  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by msgt/ret View Post
    Have a 1972 Datsun 240Z breaker points and condenser, the only thing electronic is the radio.

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  7. #67
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    Again, this isn't accurate. Farady cages have to be grounded to Earth Ground and a car is definitely not. Additionally, a farady cage is made up of conductive, fine mesh screen and a car has large gaps in it's metal shell that would negate any protection the metal might offer.
    There are electrical engineers that will also tell you that EMP is NOT going to be a problem at all... Now, it may knock out parts of the power grid... and it may indeed knock out some cars...

    your home computer is essentially a Faraday cage... it has perforations... it is grounded... it may not "connect" to anything after an EMP strike though.. and there may be a surge through electrical lines that knock it out... but the atmospheric EMP burst would not affect the PC directly... except through the surge through the POWER lines (not the ground)

    A Faraday cage can be made out of tinfoil over a cardboard box... no "fine mesh" there...

    Some say that the Faraday cage must have 2 layers of mesh... also not so... although for some extra precaution it wouldn't hurt...

    Oh heck with it... we're doomed... DOOMED I say!

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  8. #68
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    For those who do not know what a Faraday cage is here are a couple of links.

    Faraday cage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    HowStuffWorks "How Faraday Cages Work"

    And the namesake.

    Michael Faraday - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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  9. #69
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    So.........The proverbial "Tinfoil Hat" is merely a Faraday Cage for brains?

    I thought Faraday was the geeky guy in Lost?

    Good stuff! Thanks!

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  10. #70
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    Wow, this forum is like a high quality education but without having to spend a dime!! I don't have anything I can contribute to this thread other than asking what heck you guys are talking about but I would like to thank you guys for educating those of us without the knowledge. In particular msgt/ret, babarock, mprp, for explaining EMP, true, I could have just Googled it but it's better to hear the answer from the professors.

  11. #71
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    Almost any vehicle will be disabled by EMP. Modern car's it will take out the computer and electronic ignition modules. Older cars it will take out the ignition coil and condenser. Just thinking about life without DC.com is frightening!
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  12. #72
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    No Copyright - Inteded for public release.

    Accession Number : ADA242990
    Title : The Effects of Electromagnetic Pulse (EMP) on Cardiac Pacemakers
    Descriptive Note : Final rept. Nov 88-Oct 89,
    Corporate Author : HARRY DIAMOND LABS ADELPHI MD
    Personal Author(s) : Ellis, Vincent J.
    PDF Url : ADA242990
    Report Date : NOV 1991
    Pagination or Media Count : 74
    Abstract : The U.S. Army Harry Diamond Laboratories' (HDL's) Woodbridge Research Facility (WRF) has conducted an investigation into the effects of electromagnetic pulse (EMP) on medical electronics. This report specifically documents the findings on the effects of WRF's Army EMP Simulator Operations (AESOP) on cardiac pacemakers (CPMs). Empirical data are furnished and compared to the results of two independent analytical studies. The studies support the conclusion that damage to CPMs that might be located near the WRF boundaries is not likely. Furthermore, any upset in a CPM's operation is considered unlikely and inconsequential to the health of the CPM wearer. Cardiac pacemakers (CPMs) have experienced significant technological advancements over the last decade, evolving from simple and bulky pulse generators to the small and sophisticated computerized units implanted today. With the implementation of sensitive digital electronics in modern pacemaker designs, concerns have been expressed for the possibility of an increased sensitivity of CPMs to electromagnetic interference (EMI). To some extent these concerns have abated to the increased awareness of the EMI problem by the manufacturers, as evident in better peacemaker designs and the decline in reported malfunctions due to EMI.
    Descriptors : *DIGITAL SYSTEMS, ARMY RESEARCH, MANUFACTURING, ELECTRONIC EQUIPMENT, RESEARCH FACILITIES, PULSE GENERATORS, SENSITIVITY, ELECTROMAGNETIC INTERFERENCE, COMPUTER APPLICATIONS, ARMY OPERATIONS, MALFUNCTIONS, MEDICAL EQUIPMENT, HEART, AWARENESS, ELECTROMAGNETIC PULSES, ELECTROMAGNETIC PULSE SIMULATORS, PACEMAKERS, ELECTRONICS
    Subject Categories : MEDICINE AND MEDICAL RESEARCH
    Distribution Statement : APPROVED FOR PUBLIC RELEASE
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  13. #73
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    I have seen reports that show yes it would take out a vehicle and I have seen reports that show that the vehicle will act as a faraday cage and the electronics will be protected. For me I'm getting in and trying to start it. If it
    doesn't work then I'm hunting a pre-80's vehicle on my trip home. Sootch00 just put up a video the other day talking about his get home bag, which is exactly what you would be looking for.

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  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    No Copyright - Inteded for public release.
    Thank you for posting that, makes me feel much better.
    When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk.
    "Don't forget, incoming fire has the right of way."

  15. #75
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    Autos are not grounded absent a grounding line. Thus auto fail one requirement of a Faraday Cage.

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