Police can confiscate issued gear in my car?

This is a discussion on Police can confiscate issued gear in my car? within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Keep it where the sun can't damage it and it's a non-issue....

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Thread: Police can confiscate issued gear in my car?

  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    Keep it where the sun can't damage it and it's a non-issue.
    I don't always have nothing to say, but when I do, I post it on Facebook.

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  3. #32
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    Mall cop/ninja does not have the authority to confiscate your property (or property under your control) at their whim...like the others said, keep it out of plain sight (to deter thieves)....go about your business.
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  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    1. No, it is not generally illegal for civilians to posses armor.

    2. Yes, it is illegal everywhere to have issued military "sensitive items" without authorization.

    Solution: Keep your orders handy. A memo from your commander wouldn't hurt, either. Our commander gives a switch-blade knife as a reward once in a while, and when he does, it comes with a memo, and with that memo we can even board aircraft with said knife while in uniform.

    If a mall cop wanted to try and take it, I wish him good luck in his attempt. I am under orders to keep all such items in my possession secure, and that means using force to prevent a mall cop from taking it. *I* can be in legal trouble if I allow the mall cop to take it.

    If it's a cop, no problem: while the cop is inventorying the items I'll be calling my chain-of-command, MPs, and my lawyer to file a civil suit against the precinct and the individual cop. I'll also want the cop's supervisor to show up and weigh in.
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  5. #34
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    To the OP. Unless it is unlawful in your state for you to possess body armor the officer would have no reason to give it a second look unless as stated there were other factors involved. If you were asked about it showing your military ID would end the issue however if this is not military issued equipment and mere possession of body armor is illegal your military status may not be a defense if this is not what Uncle Sam gave you.

    In regards to the constitutional issue quoted about unreasonable searches and so on. The vehicle exception to the 4th amendment would cover this. You do not have the same expectation of privacy in a vehicle that you do in your home. You leave it laying on the seat it now falls under the plain view doctrine and an immediate warrant is not required.

    It has been said here many times LEOs can & will do anything they want at the time. If it isn't legal so what nothing will happen to them but you will have to defend yourself no matter if the seizure is legal or not.
    Seizing private property, cash etc has become a business that even has a name Policing for Profit. If you don't get your gear back they will sell it or use it in many cases. We are not Innocent until proven Guilty anymore but instead we are Guilty until we prove we are not Guilty then we still have to fight for our seized property.

    LOL well as you stated you have your opinion and I have mine. You have not offended me but you have some real issues.

    Our commander gives a switch-blade knife as a reward once in a while, and when he does, it comes with a memo, and with that memo we can even board aircraft with said knife while in uniform.

    Armyman, hello again. Please explain and justify the above statement. How does a memo from your commander bypass or otherwise allow you to violate and bypass Federal Law on a commercial airliner? A military commander has jurisdiction on his base or command not in a civilian enviroment he cannot authorize you to carry a knife on a plane being in uniform or not.

    If you have something to back this up it would be greatly appreciated as I will certainly obtain a memo to carry a knife or firearm on a plane. Also please note that if your commander gives you a "switchblade" knife as a reward and said knife is not lawful in your state his "memo" will mean nothing off post and you will be arrested, charged and convicted. If your defense is "but my commander gave me a memo" he more than likely would be in hot water for providing an unlawful weapon.

    If it's a cop, no problem: while the cop is inventorying the items I'll be calling my chain-of-command, MPs, and my lawyer to file a civil suit against the precinct and the individual cop. I'll also want the cop's supervisor to show up and weigh in.

    In regards to this statement. Calling your chain of command, good idea. Calling the MP's? Why? Unless they have an agreement with the local PD they have no jurisdiction off base even though you are a military member. If I remember correctly you are in the Guard/Reserve so unless you are in a duty weekend status the MP's would not/could not help you anyways.

    You are going to file a civil suit for.............? The officer sees this stuff in plain view which gives him probable cause (if mere possession is unlawful or other circumstances exist), approaches you/you walk up whatever and begins his investigation. Again unless there are other factors involved like mere possession being illegal, you proving you are in the military will probably end the situation. Should he want to contact your commander to confirm you are supposed to have it great but there are no damages so there is nothing to sue for. Oh and by all means record and video so we can all see it on youtube.
    NotMallNinja and Secret Spuk like this.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  6. #35
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    ArmyMan: I eagerly await your response to TacMan605's well thought out and reasoned response to your post. Please take the time to do more than a shotgun blast response in which largely irrelevant responses are given in the hopes that one of the might stick.

  7. #36
    VIP Member Array Secret Spuk's Avatar
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    Actually the police may seize and inventory (voucher) property to determine true ownership.

  8. #37
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Spuk View Post
    Actually the police may seize and inventory (voucher) property to determine true ownership.
    Not without, at a minimum, reasonable and articulable suspicion that the property in question was stolen.

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    Something about this info from the OP's commander's doesn't pass the smell test to me....sound like a load of crap to me, no mall security guard (not counting actual sworn LEOs in the state where this is taking place) can confiscate anything, and LEO have to have legal grounds to do so, just because its in the car doesn't meet these requirements, exception being if its against the law to have the particular items

    and just FYI....
    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    I don't see how they could... any civilian can own body armor..
    Quote Originally Posted by bllitzburgh
    Didn't know a felon couldn't possess body armor.
    I don't know about any other states....but in Texas:
    Sec. 46.041. UNLAWFUL POSSESSION OF METAL OR BODY ARMOR BY FELON. (a) In this section, "metal or body armor" means any body covering manifestly designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of protecting a person against gunfire.
    (b) A person who has been convicted of a felony commits an offense if after the conviction the person possesses metal or body armor.
    (c) An offense under this section is a felony of the third degree.
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  10. #39
    VIP Member Array Secret Spuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotMallNinja View Post
    Not without, at a minimum, reasonable and articulable suspicion that the property in question was stolen.
    Of course... but not just when suspicious. Once in a while there may be a dispute over property. The police may seize, and account, and safeguard that property to determine true ownership. In such a case there is no intent to permenantly deny it to the rightful owner. It is simply safeguarded.

    An example would be like... ohhh lets say a tool was borrowed from you. A torque wrench. You discover it in your neighbors possesion. He refuse to return it claiming it as his. One of you call the police... he claims the wrench... you say that you have a reciept for it somewhere. The police safeguard the wrench for 30 days giving you time to find the reciept. You present the reciept, and prove it yours... and get your wrench back.

  11. #40
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Spuk View Post
    Of course... but not just when suspicious. Once in a while there may be a dispute over property. The police may seize, and account, and safeguard that property to determine true ownership. In such a case there is no intent to permenantly deny it to the rightful owner. It is simply safeguarded.

    An example would be like... ohhh lets say a tool was borrowed from you. A torque wrench. You discover it in your neighbors possesion. He refuse to return it claiming it as his. One of you call the police... he claims the wrench... you say that you have a reciept for it somewhere. The police safeguard the wrench for 30 days giving you time to find the reciept. You present the reciept, and prove it yours... and get your wrench back.
    Yes...but the example above deviates quite a bit from the topic at hand (and by the way, your example seems more like something out of Judge Judy rather than a typical police matter.

  12. #41
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    Arkansas gets rather specific. It does not prohibit all persons or all felons.

    5-79-101. Criminal possession of body armor.

    (a) No person may possess body armor if that person has been found guilty of or has pleaded guilty or nolo contendere to any of the following offenses:

    (1) Capital murder, 5-10-101;

    (2) Murder in the first degree, 5-10-102;

    (3) Murder in the second degree, 5-10-103;

    (4) Manslaughter, 5-10-104;

    (5) Aggravated robbery, 5-12-103;

    (6) Battery in the first degree, 5-13-201; or

    (7) Aggravated assault, 5-13-204.

    (b) As used in this section, "body armor" means any material designed to be worn on the body and to provide bullet penetration resistance.

    (c) A violation of this section constitutes a Class A misdemeanor
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  13. #42
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    I did not know they could write comprehensible laws in Arkansas.

  14. #43
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    LOL yep we got's indoor plumbin, and lectric lights to.

    Still waiting on Armyman's response. He must still be on patrol.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  15. #44
    Ex Member Array NotMallNinja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    LOL yep we got's indoor plumbin, and lectric lights to.

    Still waiting on Armyman's response. He must still be on patrol.
    Fobbits avoid patrols where they might encounter hostiles. Thus, such patrols are normally limited to the MWR facility and Subway.

    **** all in good fun ArmyMan ****

    We seriously await your response as it is most certainly related to the topic at hand.

  16. #45
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    Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.......Subway
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

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