December 7th, 2013 11:52 PM
In my surfing about prepping I ran across an organization called Oath Keepers which claims to be made up of like minded citizens who had taken an Oath to protect and serve the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic. It sites typical members like retired LEO, FF, EMS and Military.
Does anyone know anything about the Oath Keepers that can help me decide whether they may be a vroup I would like to join or avoid?
Any info would be helpful. Trying to determine if they are legit and accepted by LE or if the are the type of group I dont want to be associated with for legal reasons.
If you have feedback you want to keep private just PM me.
December 8th, 2013 08:43 AM
I am an "Associate Member", I strongly believe in their stated mission. As someone with no LEO or Military background, I never actually swore an oath to defend the constitution, so I have to be an Associate Member. Watch some videos of Stewart Rhodes, and feel if you agree with how he sees it.
December 8th, 2013 08:59 AM
My misgiving about their stated position is that they appear to abrogate to themselves the power of the courts to determine the constitutionality of the laws. They give the strong impression that if they disagree with a court decision they will refuse to obey it.
Of course, having taken an oath that requires them to do so, there appears to be an inherent contradiction there. I'm not familiar enough with them to have a solid opinion, but that is my misgiving right now.
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December 8th, 2013 09:30 AM
I swore my oath to the Constitution when I joined the military and I still hold that oath true today. I don't need to join an organization to keep my oath or have them tell me how to follow that oath. That is for me to decide.
December 8th, 2013 10:14 AM
+1 to this.
Originally Posted by OutWestSystems
Freedom doesn't come free. It is bought and paid for by the lives and blood of our men and women in uniform.
NRA Life Member
December 8th, 2013 10:29 AM
A person I know claims he is an "Oath Keeper". I asked him what he would do with his firearms if their was an amendment to the Constitution that voided the 2A with a new one that stated that only the Armed Services and LEO can have weapons and that the only weapons allowed for private use wold be bolt action rifles for hunting.
I think he had a brain hemmorage trying to figure out an answer. He said he would not follow it since it is not legal. I said that it would have been changed under the guidlines set forth in the Constitution.
He said he would not obey it then. I then asked if the Oath Keepers would have to change their mission statement.
Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?”
And I said, “Here am I. Send me!”
December 8th, 2013 10:35 AM
Agreed .I made good on my oath for twenty years.I think attempting to re-affirm it at this point by joining a group would be kind of silly.
Originally Posted by OutWestSystems
The easy way is always mined.
December 8th, 2013 10:57 AM
I've never heard anything good about the Oathkeepers. Sounds like a fringe organization.
Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid...
"For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield
December 8th, 2013 11:24 AM
I don't understand what you think is an inherent contradiction. The courts are not the supreme law of the land- the people are. The presumption is that orders are legal unless they are deemed not to be- that is the safeguard.
Originally Posted by chandlerusm
To the general point, individuals will be held accountable for illegally following illegal orders therefore individuals must choose for themselves if the orders they receive are illegal and should be disobeyed or if they are legal and should be obeyed. The legal defense of "I was just following orders" hasn't worked in this country since 1799, however, refusing to obey orders courts find legal comes with consequences (sometimes a death sentence).
The Oath Keepers seeks to clarify a basic list of what orders must not be followed due to their unconstitutional nature and to spread that message to everyone that took an Oath to Support and Defend the Constitution.
I am not a member but have looked at them a couple of times.
December 8th, 2013 11:40 AM
I also took an oath when I joined the military "while serving" Uncle Sam. Once out, that oath was null and void IMO. The oath was for "while you served", whether you agreed with some of current laws or not.
The mind is the limiting factor
Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor
December 8th, 2013 11:41 AM
That is not what our Constitution says. What you are talking about is a Democracy, not a Constitutional Representative Republic. The majority doesn't rule here, the Constitution does. One of the most important functions of the Constitution is not to enforce the will of the majority but to protect the minority.
Originally Posted by 19Kvet
December 8th, 2013 12:40 PM
If I'm not mistaken you are an LEO in your state. You have also taken the Oath of Office your state requires.
Originally Posted by AzQkr
So, if I am correct, you are under a current oath as follows:
OATH OF OFFICE
State of Arizona,
County of ________________
I, ____________________________________________do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution and laws of the State of Arizona, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same and defend them against all enemies, foreign and
domestic, and that I will faithfully and impartially discharge the duties of the office of
_______________________________________ according to the best of my ability, so help me God (or
so I do affirm).
SIGNATURE OF OFFICER OR EMPLOYEE
TYPE OR PRINT NAME
NAME OF OFFICE
If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
December 8th, 2013 12:50 PM
There was never a mention of an expiration date of the oath during my twenty-two years in the military. Why would I need to join a group to reaffirm it?
I carry a gun, because a Cop is too heavy.
U.S. Army, Retired
NRA Patron Life Member.
December 8th, 2013 12:53 PM
The oath keepers doesn't sound like anything i would want to be a part of,but hey whatever floats your boat i guess.
December 8th, 2013 01:22 PM
Here it is in a nutshell.
Oath Keepers » Blog Archive » Declaration Of Orders We Will Not Obey
FWIW, there a lots of people in this area that are in it. Knowing some of the members and their family's it's doesn't appear to be the "fringe" organization that many would have you believe it is. Lots of Mayors, Police Chiefs, Sheriffs, Pastors and even some Politicians. Many police officers are members as well as High Ranking Military Officers.
Or course the liberal news media hates it and liberals everywhere or scared to death of it because they think it exists to overthrow the government, without realizing that many of them are in the government.
One has to ask why this organization?
Most people fail to ask that simple question but then we know that it would require the ability to have conscious thought, so that excludes many.
Why does Oath Keepers feel the need to exist?
I think its pretty funny actually.
I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.
AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
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