The tragedy of PTSD

The tragedy of PTSD

This is a discussion on The tragedy of PTSD within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Son, forced by circumstances to shoot his own father. Terribly sad story here: Prosecutor: Shooting of dad, a veteran, justified - The Washington Post...

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Thread: The tragedy of PTSD

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    The tragedy of PTSD

    Son, forced by circumstances to shoot his own father.

    Terribly sad story here: Prosecutor: Shooting of dad, a veteran, justified - The Washington Post
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    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose


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    Senior Member Array XD40SCiinNC's Avatar
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    How our troops have been treated by the government after 4, 5, 6 or more deployments to a war zone is a national disgrace, and it started with the pin headed moron that started these wars.

    Our government and military is responsible for the tragedy.
    "The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing." - Adolf Hitler

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by From the article
    Miner had threatened to kill his four children, physically assaulted his wife and threw a loaded handgun to the teen who came to her aid.

    “Do you want to play the gun game?” Miner — who served in the 82nd Airborne Division and was sniper qualified — asked the teen, according to authorities. The teen said no, but fired six shots when Miner pulled another gun from a bag. Miner was hit five times.

    “The teenager reasonably believed the siblings and mother were all in imminent danger of being killed or suffering great bodily harm,” Chittenden County State’s Attorney T.J. Donovan said. Miner was armed, pointed the gun at his wife and child and “acting with an extreme indifference to the value of human life,” he said.
    If that's how it went down, then that's pretty clear justification.

    Erase the threat, when it's so clear. Bummer, that it was his own father. The damage of that day is going to be hitting that family for awhile; for the kid, the rest of his life, no doubt.
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    I can't imagine what that teen is going through, poor kid.

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    Deliberate suicide by son would require one to be damaged beyond all capacity to comprehend. Best thoughts to all who have been touched by these tragedies.
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    I just don't know what to say other than what a shame for this soldier & his family that will be affected for the rest of their lives. Active duty vets deserve the best that we, as a nation, can offer them. Instead, the gub'nant uses & discards them. How bout we start giving them the same benefits that retired politicians get, instead, This family will probably just get some impersonal form letter from potus for all the lives that have been affected by an extremely tragic ending for a great Patriot.
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    My primary duty with our department is to deal with suicidal persons and mental/psychosis patients. Quite a few of these are vets and we have been getting great coordinated training between LE, local hospitals, and our VA.
    I am nowhere near saying this guy didn't have issues, nor am I saying all is just great with the VA, but this guy knew there were services available since he helped speak for and promote them. I believe there were ongoing domestic issues that played a larger role in this than is being eluded to in the article and discussions.

    Quote Originally Posted by XD40SCiinNC View Post
    How our troops have been treated by the government after 4, 5, 6 or more deployments to a war zone is a national disgrace, and it started with the pin headed moron that started these wars.

    Our government and military is responsible for the tragedy.
    I'd argue it started decades ago when we would send people to fight and not consider the aftermath. Back then it was recognized by different names. Shell shock being the most prominent, but others were simply diagnosed as losing their mind, going bezerk, or crazy. It got really bad during Vietnam and has continued. Only until the Iraq war did the military begin changing its tune for dealing with mental issues. It's taken awhile, but changes are taking place. They still have a way to go and it needs to be embraced all the way through the ranks up to the joint chiefs so it has support from all involved.
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    Senior Member Array XD40SCiinNC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 64zebra View Post

    I'd argue it started decades ago when we would send people to fight and not consider the aftermath. Back then it was recognized by different names. Shell shock being the most prominent, but others were simply diagnosed as losing their mind, going bezerk, or crazy. It got really bad during Vietnam and has continued. Only until the Iraq war did the military begin changing its tune for dealing with mental issues. It's taken awhile, but changes are taking place. They still have a way to go and it needs to be embraced all the way through the ranks up to the joint chiefs so it has support from all involved.
    Last time American troops were actually defending America was WWII. Viet Nam was also a hell hole, and FUBARed a good many of our servicemen. But at least if you were sent to Nam, you went once, and you came home.

    Sure some 'volunteered' to go back, but any serviceman only had to do one tour in the Nam. We now have reservists that have 3, 4, 5 or more tours, often extended to 18 - 20 month tours in a war zone.
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    Quote Originally Posted by XD40SCiinNC View Post
    Last time American troops were actually defending America was WWII. Viet Nam was also a hell hole, and FUBARed a good many of our servicemen. But at least if you were sent to Nam, you went once, and you came home.

    Sure some 'volunteered' to go back, but any serviceman only had to do one tour in the Nam. We now have reservists that have 3, 4, 5 or more tours, often extended to 18 - 20 month tours in a war zone.
    I understand what you're saying, but that is debatable and has been for years. It is also outside the scope of this topic and is easily turned into a discussion on political philosophy which doesn't need to happen.

    I'm referring to military personnel, no matter where or why they were sent, for years being subjected to mental anguish. They were not given proper training to deal with it, and superiors, started with their non-coms and going up, not recognizing the issue and not giving enough support to the changes needed until the last decade. That I think we can all agree on.
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  10. #10
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    My heart goes out to this family...
    It seems the war in Afghanistan has claimed another victim.

    SMH...
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    I apologize to all Vets. I do not understand PTSD... I am a Vet who got shot at and returned fire.......................... Marine.

    I just do not get the fact that the VA and the US Gov wants to overclassify every Vet as having PTSD. We all do not, however some do, and I respect that.

    My opinion only, after I served 26 years................. through 2009 = I am young.

    Now I have my Sister's Son, another Marine, who was sniped through-n-trough his thighs in Affy-Land. He has PTSD. I get that. Thank you USAF Para-Rescue Squadron for saving his life. God bless you you 'all.

    However, I do not get this broad generaliztion that all Vets have PTSD. I saw as much crap as I wanted to, and when the big one happens, I will unleash the same amount of wrath on my block............ But, I am normal.

    Semper Fi,
    Last edited by ANGLICO; May 9th, 2014 at 01:56 PM.
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    I'm no expert, but I wonder if this may have been more the result of the TBI he suffered than PTSD. It's also possible it had nothing to do with his conditions. Not that I'd dismiss the effects of PTSD, but it's a big assumption to blame this on that.

    Regardless, a horribly sad story.
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    Distinguished Member Array Recon1342's Avatar
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    It's well within the realm of possibilities that this final episode was a result of both PTSD and TBI... Both include anger and combativeness in their list of symptoms. OT: the part about all of this that irritates me to no end is the media's use of PTSD... Every time a veteran does something wrong, it's automatically PTSD, whether they served in combat or not. This takes away from those who truly suffer, and cheapens the sacrifice they have made.
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    Senior Member Array oldranger53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Recon1342 View Post
    It's well within the realm of possibilities that this final episode was a result of both PTSD and TBI... Both include anger and combativeness in their list of symptoms. OT: the part about all of this that irritates me to no end is the media's use of PTSD... Every time a veteran does something wrong, it's automatically PTSD, whether they served in combat or not. This takes away from those who truly suffer, and cheapens the sacrifice they have made.
    I'm sure brain injury plays a role.
    I too am uneasy (understatement) about the liberal use of the term "PTSD".
    It's become a "catch-all" for otherwise hard to explain behavior.
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxwell97 View Post
    I'm no expert, but I wonder if this may have been more the result of the TBI he suffered than PTSD.
    Hm. He seemed lucid enough to know exactly what he was doing, to know he was playing a dangerous 'game', enough to deliberately rope in his own son, and certainly he knew enough professionally to appreciate the ramifications of a gunfight. His depression, certainly, would be affected by such things; but his deliberate planning, murderous threats, the 'game' with his son ... IMO for folks to blame it on stress is short-sighted. Lucid as he strongly appeared to be, doesn't seem that injuries drove those actions either. Short of proof to the contrary, I would think the simplest reason is most likely to have been the case: he'd just had enough, hurt enough, that he was prepared to do anything to escape the pain.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

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