Wish I could have been ther but I was there in Spirit all day. The videos do my heart good. Thanks to all that made it there.
You gotta be frigging kidding me! Colombian Narcoterrorists????Quote:
FMLN (Farabundo Marti National Liberation Front)
Well, so much for my theory...
A protest on the fourth anniversary of the Iraq war Monday evening featured smoke bombs and vandalism of an Army recruiting station in Milwaukee. The vandalism, in turn, featured shattered glass, paint and what appeared to be human waste.
If the goals were to mobilize popular vocal opposition to the war and to find a reasonable way to end U.S. military involvement there, this group might have just set back the effort considerably in this region.
There are several words for that. Counterproductive comes to mind. Cross purposes is another. But just not very smart might sum it all up.
It's easy to understand the frustration. It's plain that most Americans are weary from the manipulation and bungling that have been part and parcel of this administration's war efforts. Ultimately, they want what these protesters want. The debate now is only how to extricate ourselves from Iraq.
Just do it now is apparently the protesters' answer. It's a slogan, not an answer. A morass that took more than four years to create will take a bit more time than "now" to smooth over, at least enough to withdraw U.S. troops without further inflaming Mideast passions and making the world an even more dangerous place than the president already has made it.
If the protesters want a decision "now," that, too, will take time. There is significant congressional and presidential opposition.
Which makes all the more puzzling who the protesters - 21 of whom were arrested for disorderly conduct - targeted. That would be a military recruiting station on N. Oakland Ave. near the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee campus.
The Army doesn't make policy. It executes policy. Those who oppose even a flexible timetable for withdrawal have been trying very hard to label those who favor it as anti-troops. You'd think this might prompt anti-war activists to eschew even hinting at soldiers as the root of the problem here. Monday's protest was anything but subtle.
If the aim was to discourage enlistments, the protesters might consider that the war itself is accomplishing that.
Protests like Monday's and stunts like secretly videotaping and posting online a hallway confrontation with Wisconsin Democratic Rep. David Obey, chairman of the House Appropriations Committee (and a vocal opponent of the war), don't well serve the cause of U.S. withdrawal from Iraq.
No. 1, wrong targets. No. 2, juvenile and, in Monday's case, criminal. Add this up, and we get a mob that has truly forgotten a big lesson of Vietnam. It was a peace movement that helped end it.
As a one of the forum's token liberals I must jump in here. Please note that ALL liberals, or demos, or conservatives or repubs do not think exactly in lockstep with one another.
I agree with the opinion it is past time to plan our exit from Iraq. We have been there longer than we fought in WWII. Severe mission creep has been a part of the operation from the beginning. First it was to capture the WMD's and break up the support Iraq gave Osoma Bin Laden. When no such weapons existed and such support was nonexistint or tiny the mission became to topple Saddam. Attention, he's DEAD. THen the mission continued to expand to prevention of a civil war (probably too late for tHat) and nation building. Somehow after 3+ years of USA blood, billions and billions of $$$, providing years of training and giving them equipment the Iraqi military can at best field 2 or 3 brigades which are 'mostly loyal' and 'ready to go with USA help". Something is NOT WORKING, and our young men and women are bearing the brunt of the incompetence of our old (or middle aged as I'm no kid)government leaders. We as citizens are the only ones who can support our troops and push our 'leaders' off center to develop a plan to get out.
As to specifics re protesting: nobody would be more agry than me at the defacing of veterans monuments. Fortunately, such has not happened. I do believe the majority of protesters have it right this time and are blaming the government and not the soldiers, sailors, marines and pilots. Making that mistake was the most ridiculous thing done by Vietnam era protesters. I do deplore the indicent in Minnesotata with theArmy recruiting office vandalized and I believe there was one similar incident aabout a montah ago which only involved spray paint but was still vandalism. Obviously as others said above, such tactics are conterproductive, stupid, and show the protesters have not thought their ideas through. I only hope these remain isolated incidents. WHen they occur, arrests for vandalism are appropriate.
As for Jane Fonda, I agree with the members here who think she went too far. I will stand up for the rights of ANY citizen who protests ANYTHING peacefully here on USA soil. Those things are absolute guarantees in the Constitution. Now, when Jane went to Hanoi and posed for pictures at the trigger of an anti-aircraft gun, that was NOT protesting, that was giving aid to the enemy.
To show my thinking is even further diverse, I am totally behind the USA policy in Afghanistan. A clear mission, with slear goals. It has only began to have probblems the past year when we have become so preoccupied with Iraq.
So for everyone, whatever political views, speak your mind, question the government and keep it up. What a great country that we can debate like this.
Frankly you guys should send Fonda to go negoiate with the Taliban and AQ, or teach her basic demining and send her to Afghanistan so she can be a useful citizen.
Why she was never charged with Treason during the Vietnam war I just don't get.