Equipment Problem or Training Problem -- Boston PD Melts Down Pepper-pellet Guns

[SIGguy229]

The Boston Police Department is getting rid of the pepper-pellet guns blamed for the death of a college student during Red Sox celebrations more than two years ago.

"Never. They'll never again be used in the city of Boston," police Commissioner Edward Davis told the Boston Herald for Thursday's editions.

The department's 13 pellet guns, bought before the 2004 Democratic National Convention, will be melted down and recycled into sewer caps.

The weapons, designed to deliver non-lethal force, have not been used Oct. 21, 2004 when Emerson College student Victoria Snelgrove died hours after being struck in the left eye with a pellet fired by police.

Snelgrove's death, which occurred as thousands of people celebrated the Red Sox baseball team's American League Championship Series Game Seven victory over the New York Yankees, was the only time the weapons were used by Boston police. Two other revelers were struck in the head and survived.

Davis decided they were not fit for the department. The weapons were "much more powerful than what they were perceived to be," he said.

The department will use horse patrols or pepper spray foggers for future crowd control issues, Davis said.

Boston paid a $5.1 million settlement to Snelgrove's parents. The Snelgroves also reached an undisclosed settlement with the gun's manufacturer.

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[buckeye .45]

So, someone correct me if I am wrong, but aren't the pepper-pellet guns just paintball markers that fire plastic balls filled with OC or something insetad of paint? That is what they looked like on the History Channel at least. Looked like Tippmans actually.

And those you can adjust the velocity on. Besides isn't the new term for such technology "less lethal" instead of "non-lethal"? Because a freak shot or hit with just about any of them can kill somebody.

If an air weapon that can kill someone in several hours with a shot to the eye (some stopping power, huh?) is too powerful for the police, what do they carry in their belt holsters?

[jednp]

Personally, I'm against firing any sort of gun into a crowd like that. In a crowd that gets out of hand, not every single person there is causing trouble. some just happened to get caught in the middle of it. Firing into a crowd like that means anyone could get hit. A gun, regardless of what type it is.. even the paintball guns like they use for the pepper balls.. should only be fired at a person who has been specifically determined a threat. Crowd control, by using force against non-combatant people... isn't the answer.

pepper spray, tear gas.. that's one thing.. but shooting randomly at a crowd with any sort of gun isn't the way to go. I can see how this caused a death. In high school, back when paintball guns hadn't even really taken off yet.. me and my friends use to play wars with them. We used all the safety gear. I got struck in the knuckle from about 50 yards away. it busted the skin on my knuckle open and I began bleeding. These guns are more "toys"and I say toys in the sense, that they are to be used on a paintball gun field, where people wear the protective gear needed to keep them safe. They shouldn't be used as weapons for crowd control. They are best left for playing games on the battle field.

[Nate]

This is crap. The last person I want in charge of the police forces charged with protecting the populace of ANY city is someone who's going soft on things, or can't recognize an isolated incident.

Even worse, both.

Thumbs down to Commissioner Edward Davis.

[BIG E]

I think these devices work well and have their place. What if person has extreme Asthma and dies due to OC being used? Isolated incident.

[packinnova]

A person can be killed with a PEA SHOOTER.

[Mtbiker]

"The department's 13 pellet guns, bought before the 2004 Democratic National Convention, will be melted down and recycled into sewer caps."

What does this say about the Democrats?

[jualdeaux]

Wasn't the "gun" in question one of the FN 303 Less Lethal systems?

http://www.fnhusa.com/products/firea...03&mid=FNM0020

[OPFOR]

I believe it was an FN 303. We used them in Afghanistan on "tower" duty to keep people from messing with the wire, throwing rocks at the guards, and otherwise getting squirrelly. They pack a stronger punch than a typical paint ball marker, especially with some of the special purpose rounds.

I agree that firing into a crowd (especially at HEAD LEVEL) is a very bad idea, but these things absolutely have their place along the force continuum. This was much more a problem with training and employment, not with the equipment itself. How much better would the Boston PD be if that $5 million had been spent on training, and not on paying off the results of a lack of training?

Their commissioner is a coward, and the worst type of sniveling apologist. He should be ashamed of himself for passing the blame for his poor training policies off on to an inanimate object that worked exactly as advertised. Of course, as a politician, he is undoubtedly lacking in any sense of personal responsibility....

[lowflyer]

I don't see how a pepper pellet gun would be more effective for crowd control than a hand-thrown cannister-type dispenser.

[OPFOR]

Pain compliance against individual targets, i.e. ring leaders and instigators. Beware of the "I don't see any need for that type of thing," as that's the same argument the antis (and Zumbo) use against us... :)

[lowflyer]

Pain compliance against individual targets, i.e. ring leaders and instigators. Beware of the "I don't see any need for that type of thing," as that's the same argument the antis (and Zumbo) use against us... :)

I am wary of that argument. My question addressed the effectiveness of the tool; not the need for it. So, shoot one guy in the eye, and others will say, "Whoa, they just shot that guy in the eye! Let's get outta here!" I like it.