Idiot shot after aiming a BB gun at a Guardsman after Katrina. Merge

Idiot shot after aiming a BB gun at a Guardsman after Katrina. Merge

This is a discussion on Idiot shot after aiming a BB gun at a Guardsman after Katrina. Merge within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I don't get why there would be any question whether or not a guardsman acted properly when an idiot aims a BB gun at someone ...

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Thread: Idiot shot after aiming a BB gun at a Guardsman after Katrina. Merge

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Dakotaranger's Avatar
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    Idiot shot after aiming a BB gun at a Guardsman after Katrina. Merge

    I don't get why there would be any question whether or not a guardsman acted properly when an idiot aims a BB gun at someone that has a firearm. What ever happened to the automatic assumption where the PD or someone that is defending themselves is innocent, instead of having to prove that everything was done by a book that was written by someone that doesn't have the stomach to pick up a rifle to protect their fellow man.
    "[T]he people are not to be disarmed of their weapons.
    They are left in full possession of them."

    Zacharia Johnson (speech in the Virginia Ratifying Convention,25 June 1778)"The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed." ~Alexander Hamilton


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    I don't get why there would be any question ...
    I do. Many do, thankfully.

    There has always been a legal presumption of innocence, but that hardly means that any inquest into a death constitutes a presumption of guilt. IMO, it's simply the rational and honorable thing to do, given that a death has occurred. The day we fail to even questioning deaths is the day we're no longer human.

    Given a number of questionable shootings over the years, citizen outrage finally resulted in many procedures being changed, one of which being serious and sober questioning of all homicides, as required procedure by many (?) departments. That's as it should be, because not all shootings are "clean shoots," despite the fact that presumably honorable authority figures were involved. In reality, a halo and stripes on a sleeve are hardly the same thing.

    If history has proved anything, it's this: that everyone's human; that debased, immoral and criminal actions are not relegated merely to the common criminal; and that given the "right" time, place and situation, anything is possible.

    I, for one, am glad for an automatic review policy for any public organization that holds as its goal the keeping of civil peace, where firearms are a primary tool and where the killing of civilians is part of the job (when they're found to be criminals who are provoking and engaging in lethal-force situations, as appears to be the case with these National Guardsmen).

    As we all know, there are instances of shootings by officers or soldiers where characterizing the incident as a "clean" or justifiable shooting should be the furthest thing from anyone's mind. In one example I know of personally, a close friend of my family was gunned down in his own home by a police officers while cleaning his rifle at a table in his home, with his wife in the next room. It was unprovoked; it was unjustified; it was murder. The "Blue Wall of Silence" and related death threats killed all attempts by my friends to find out the perpetrators and obtain justice, let alone any answers. To-date, the D.A. and police have never done a thing. It was quickly judged "clean" by the police and then shelved, permanently. A bit like the fox watching the hen house.

    In simple point of fact, situations like this have resulted in policy changes across this country in order to guard against exactly this sort of unfettered criminal behavior on the part of supposedly-honorable public officers of law and justice. IMO, the National Guard should be no different.
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  3. #3
    Distinguished Member Array Dakotaranger's Avatar
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    There's not much way to counter-act my original idiot post, other than to say I know your right and I unfortunately found my soapbox to quick and had a knee jerk reaction to having too many armchair QB ask stupid questions like why didn't he just shoot him in the leg.
    "[T]he people are not to be disarmed of their weapons.
    They are left in full possession of them."

    Zacharia Johnson (speech in the Virginia Ratifying Convention,25 June 1778)"The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed." ~Alexander Hamilton

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    VIP Member Array paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Nat Guard armed in NO (but not on the border)

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070308/...ard_shooting_1

    NEW ORLEANS - A National Guardsman shot and killed a man who threw a piece of broken glass at a group on patrol and later pointed a BB gun that officers mistook for a rifle, police said.

    Homicide detectives are investigating the shooting, but the guardsman, whose name was not released, appears to have acted appropriately, said Sgt. Joe Narcisse, a police spokesman.

    The dead man did not carry identification, Narcisse said.

    The National Guard members saw the man at about 1 a.m. holding a hacksaw while riding a bicycle through an area that remains largely vacant since Hurricane Katrina. The Guard has been patrolling less populated areas of the city since June to allow the depleted police force to concentrate on areas where people have returned since the hurricane.

    "As the guardsmen approached the man, he produced a knife, threatening the military men and then threw a piece of broken glass at them, cutting a sergeant's arm," Narcisse said in a news release.

    The man ran into a rundown house, he said. When police and guardsmen entered the house and approached the man, he pointed a BB gun that looked like a rifle at them. A Guardsman shot the man several times, police said.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------
    Just out of curiosity, who actually has criminal/investigative jurisdiction when a NG soldier kills someone like this?
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  5. #5
    Distinguished Member Array Dakotaranger's Avatar
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    I would think it would be determined if they were activated by the governor or were federalized. If the Gov. it would be the state police, if federalized it seams like it would fall under CID or the FBI
    "[T]he people are not to be disarmed of their weapons.
    They are left in full possession of them."

    Zacharia Johnson (speech in the Virginia Ratifying Convention,25 June 1778)"The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed." ~Alexander Hamilton

  6. #6
    Distinguished Member Array lowflyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    The "Blue Wall of Silence" and related death threats killed all attempts by my friends to find out the perpetrators and obtain justice, let alone any answers. To-date, the D.A. and police have never done a thing. It was quickly judged "clean" by the police and then shelved, permanently. A bit like the fox watching the hen house.
    How about a wrongful death suit???
    Whatever doesn't kill you postpones the inevitable.

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