The Brits Need Guns

This is a discussion on The Brits Need Guns within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Recent bomb attacks in the UK seem to signal an escalation of the terror war being waged against the Brits by Islamic terrorists. It would ...

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Thread: The Brits Need Guns

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array wmhawth's Avatar
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    The Brits Need Guns

    Recent bomb attacks in the UK seem to signal an escalation of the terror war being waged against the Brits by Islamic terrorists. It would seem to me that if ever a Brit needed his gun it would be now. Most of the times I have discussed the right to keep and bear arms with Brits I got the impression that they really think our love affair with our 2nd ammendment right is just insanity. I'm wondering if there's a chance Brittish minds might change in this regard in light of increasing dangers in the UK.

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    Ex Member Array Pete's Avatar
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    Nope, too late for Britain, they gave up their rights and don't want them back.

    All the best Brits either left or are planning to.

    /ex-subject of the Realm.

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    I'm wondering if there's a chance Brittish minds might change in this
    Speaking as another Ex Brit - very EX ........ hell is way more likely to freeze over first sad to say. There are many Brits who DO see sense but they are so outweighed by the sheeple and anti's that the "we don't want to be like U.S.A." vote will always win the day.

    The majority maxim is still IMO ''guns are bad'' - period. With little thought to anything beyond that. It means of course that the thugs are the over riding gun toting numbers these days. Apart from "armed response units" - the cops are still not carrying.

    Not much chance of a legitimate gun or three being in the right place when something goes down.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    My late father was a member of the "greatest generation" here in the US. The "greatest generation" of those Britons who asked for firearms from the U.S. during World War II has essentially passed on as well.

    "Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it."--George Santayana

    Too true!

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    Member Array Muzz's Avatar
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    What was it that turned the people against guns in Britain? I 'assume' it was a combination of things - what do you guys (Chris and Pete, particularly, but anyone in general, of course) see it as?


    I was watching the news this morning, and saw all those unarmed policmen. Such a shame. Well, I guess its sort of good, since the civilians are unarmed - maybe make them seem more approachable to the civilians? Anyway, why on earth would anyone want to become a police officer in Britain when that will mean the criminals are armed and you won't be???

    Also, on the same segment, I saw what were evidently members of an armed response unit (thanks for the term, Chris) or some kind of military security personel. What goes through civilians' minds when they see those guys on the street? Is it, "Oh thank goodness! The only people who are trained and responsible enough to carry firearms (credit to the youtube ATF agent) are finally here to protect us!", or is it more like, "Get the kids on the other side of the street, the monsters are here!"?

    I just don't understand the mindset...

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    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    The Brits seem to have their heads stuck in the sand. If their crime problems and these terrorist attacks don't wake them up, then I must conclude their heads are stuck somewhere else.

    I don't know whether it's the people or their leaders, but these are not the same people that stood the worst Hiler could throw at them and kept on fighting.
    Last edited by obxned; July 3rd, 2007 at 06:36 PM.
    "If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan

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    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muzz View Post
    What was it that turned the people against guns in Britain? I 'assume' it was a combination of things - what do you guys (Chris and Pete, particularly, but anyone in general, of course) see it as?
    They are "subjects", and it has become inherent in their social-identity. It goes back to Edward Longshanks, at least. Armed peasants may not pay their taxes or abide by laws requiring them to support the Realm, ergo, armed peasants are outlaws, and considerable time, money and energy was expended by the aristocracy to cement that perception.

    The same process applies to Asia. The Chinese Emporer and the brigand lords of the Tongs, the Japanese Samurai; the State is divine and power is a genetic right.

    The Ottoman Empire and its descendants today; paternal, tribal authority is from GOD. The man (or certainly the woman) who is unable to define their will by force of arms is insignificant. Ergo, the flow of arms is tightly controlled among those whom the headman feels he can trust, or use for the moment.

    Subjects taste the steel; citizens weild it.

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    Ex Member Array Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muzz View Post
    What was it that turned the people against guns in Britain? I 'assume' it was a combination of things - what do you guys (Chris and Pete, particularly, but anyone in general, of course) see it as?
    Michael Ryan.

    The press at the time said there was no legitimate reason to have these weapons and the masses agreed.

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    Michael Ryan was just the start and the needed excuse - in that case banning semi's - so my Mini-14 and Stirling carbine got hit.

    The general press-reported comments (all anti for most part) were ''He can have a gun? - in the HOUSE!!!" ........ "He can buy AMMUNITION??". All horror at the whole gun deal.

    Hamilton of course was the final straw that enabled handguns to be outed .... the equivalent of MMM got in on it all and the rest is history.

    Sadly the ''gun lobby'' was weak - way too few people and no real voice. Sad tho that way back it was very normal for folks to have guns.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Member Array bobernet's Avatar
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    I realize that the anti's really have no desire to see logic or reality... they just want to continue to reinforce their preconceived ideas. But, never the less, it still astounds me that as country after country bans weapons, and their crime rates rise, they refuse to see that their plan isn't working.

    The lowest crime rates seem to be in places with the highest levels of private firearms ownership, while places like Australia and the UK see big spikes when they ban guns.

    In a rational world, the anti's wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

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    Member Array austin's Avatar
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    The police at Glasgow had nothing to subdue the terrorist with so he was able to keep on keeping on.

    I have seen video of police in Ireland and the UK who are carrying handguns in condition 3. When the shooting starts you see them racking the slide on their pistols.

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    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P95Carry View Post
    Michael Ryan was just the start and the needed excuse - in that case banning semi's - so my Mini-14 and Stirling carbine got hit.

    Sadly the ''gun lobby'' was weak - way too few people and no real voice. Sad tho that way back it was very normal for folks to have guns.
    "Weak" is a bit understated. How much of the warrior ethos was present in British society in the late 80s/early 90s? How much do we have now?

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    Ex Member Array Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob72 View Post
    "Weak" is a bit understated. How much of the warrior ethos was present in British society in the late 80s/early 90s? How much do we have now?
    Hmmm, so many different levels of society to consider, but if I were to sum up it might be this.
    Britons in the 1980s were in a strange period of social upheaval, Poll-tax Riots, Miner's strikes, Cruise Missile demonstrations that ended up in long occupations outside Air Bases, drugs were taking over in society...
    The Thatcher government cracked down, one by one those 'problems' (except drugs) were corrected, the socialist elements that had reigned throughout the seventies were eliminated, people were shown that dissent would be dealt with.
    Then, when it came time to take the guns, the countries backbone was broken. Whatever public sympathy for shooters was there, and admittedly that was minimal as GB isn't a gun culture like the USA, was eradicated as nobody wanted to 'get involved'.

    To paraphrase a very famous quote;

    'First they came for the striking Miners, and I did nothing...'

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    Distinguished Member Array Chooie's Avatar
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    Pete, you just made me go dig out my copy of Brassed Off.

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    Senior Member Array Smith&Wessonfan's Avatar
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    The Brits made their bed and they best learn to like lying in it.

    They do not have guns, but they sure do have CCTV. The average Briton is watched by the security apparatus like no other on earth.

    I think the Red Chinese may not even be as closely monitored.

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