American Hiroshima?

This is a discussion on American Hiroshima? within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; (ExSoldier762's note: Thought I'd share my paranoia!) Ramadan and American Hiroshima Is terrorist 'nuclear hell storm set for October? 2005 G2 Bulletin Publishing date: 29.09.2005 ...

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    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    Exclamation American Hiroshima?

    (ExSoldier762's note: Thought I'd share my paranoia!)

    Ramadan and American Hiroshima
    Is terrorist 'nuclear hell storm set for October?

    2005 G2 Bulletin
    Publishing date: 29.09.2005 10:34

    By Paul L. Williams

    The next terrorist attack on the United States -- a "nuclear hell storm" planned for seven major cities – is set to occur in October.

    That’s the word from al-Qaida.

    Osama bin Laden

    In a communiqué to Osama bin Laden, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the top al-Qaida lieutenant in Iraq, mentions the "Great Ramadan Offensive" that will create a "fateful confrontation" with the United States and Israel.

    "I think that the plans for the next stage of the jihad has reached you or will reach you in a few days," Zarqawi writes in the letter. "O God, make the plans of Osama come to fruition!"

    The communiqué, dated May 30, was intercepted by CIA officials and remains on the Global Information System database that is accessible only to government officials with high-security clearance.

    Most U. S. intelligence officials dismissed Zarqawi's letter as wishful thinking until Ayman al-Zawahiri, bin Laden’s second in command, appeared on al-Jazeera, the official television network of Saudi Arabia, to deliver a message to the American people.

    In the message, which was broadcast Aug. 8, al-Zawahiri said: "What you have seen, O Americans, in New York and Washington and the losses you are having in Afghanistan and Iraq, in spite of the blackouts by your media, are only the losses of the initial clashes. ... You will soon experience horrors that will make you forget the horrors you have encountered in Vietnam."

    The al-Qaida chieftain went on to say: "Jihadist forces have been established in all of Western Europe to defend the powerless within the nation. For the crimes that the Crusaders have committed against the Muslims will be reaped by Christians and Jews throughout the Western world."

    Zawahiri’s video messages are viewed by intelligence officials as telling signs that a terrorist attack is imminent. His televised message Sept. 6, 2004, took place before the December 6, 2004, bombing of the U.S. consulate in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, while his message of June 17, 2005, preceded the London bombings.

    Concerns about an October attack were heightened even more by reports that the radical Islamic community viewed the ravages of hurricanes Katrina and Rita as signs that Allah was pleased with the plans for "the American Hiroshima."

    "Allah has punished America with winds and water," one imam is quoted in the GIS report as saying. Another imam reportedly quipped that America, as evidenced by the natural disasters, is "under the curse of the Jews."

    Christopher Brown, research associate with the Hudson Institute's Transitions to Democracy project, maintains that the hurricanes have presented al-Qaida with a unique strategic opportunity.

    "If this attack is launched soon," Brown said, "the devastation to the American economy alone could easily far exceed that of the September 11 attacks and could be equivalent to the detonation of a small nuclear device on American soil."
    Ramadan represents the ninth month of the Islamic year, the month in which the Koran was revealed to the Prophet Mohammed. According to Muslim tradition, the actual revelation occurred on the night between the 26th and 27th days of the month. On this "Night of Determination," Allah determines the fate of the world for the coming year.

    The fate of the world for the next Islamic year, if bin Laden has his way, will include the nuclear destruction of the United States.

    Bin Laden has been amassing nuclear weapons and materials since 1992, when he was in the Sudan. This was substantiated by the testimony of al-Qaida officials in federal court during the hearings of "The U.S. v. Osama bin Laden."

    When he returned to Afghanistan, bin Laden purchased tactical nuclear weapons from the Chechen Mafia. News of the sale was confirmed by Saudi, Israeli, British, Saudi and Russian intelligence and reported in The Times of London, the Jerusalem Report, Al Watan al-Arabi, Muslim Magazine, Al-Majallah (London’s Saudi weekly) and by the BBC.

    In 1997, bin Laden made additional small nuclear weapons from materials bought not only from the Chechens but also black market sources in Russia, China, Kazakhstan and the Ukraine.

    In 1998, he purchased large quantities of highly enriched uranium from Simeon Mogilevich, a Ukrainian arms dealer. For one delivery of fifteen kilos of uranium-236, Mogilevich was paid $70 million. Bin Laden also purchased several bars of enriched uranium-138 from Ibrahim Abd, an Egyptian arms dealer and several Congolese opposition soldiers.

    From 1999 to 2001, bin Laden hired scientists and technicians from the A.Q. Khan Research Facility in Pakistan not only to build new nukes from the highly enriched uranium and plutonium but also to maintain, upgrade, reconfigure, and redesign his "off-the shelf" nukes, including nuclear mines, so that they could be packed into lightweight (less than eight pounds) suitcases and backpacks or molded into warheads that could be launched from 120 or 155 millimeter recoilless rifles.

    Upon the arrests of Dr. Sultan Bashiruddin Mahmood and Dr. Chaudry Abdul Majid, two top officials from the Khan facility, the CIA discovered that several of bin Laden’s tactical nukes had been forward-deployed to the United States from Karachi.

    More information concerning al-Qaida’s nukes came with the arrest in Pakistan of Sharif al-Masri, a key al-Qaida operative. Al Masri, an Egyptian national with close ties to al-Zawahiri, operative, informed CIA and ISI (Pakistani intelligence) officials that several tactical nukes for use in the American Hiroshima had been forward deployed to Mexico for transportation across the border by members of Mara Salvatrucha ("MS-13"), a Salvadoran street gang.

    These developments caused both President Bush and Sen. John Kerry to speak of nuclear terrorism in the 2004 presidential campaign as "the single greatest danger facing the American people," and for Vice President Cheney to say that a nuclear attack from al-Qaeda appears "imminent."

    The seven cities targeted by al-Qaida for nuclear destruction are New York, Washington DC, Miami, Houston, Los Angeles, Las Vegas, and Chicago.

    Several Islamic scholars say that Ramadan is an unlikely time for al-Qaida to strike since it is the holiest month of the year, a time in which Muslims traditionally refrain from warfare to spend time in fasting, meditation, and prayer. But many Islamic battles throughout history took place during Ramadan, including the following:

    - 624 - The Battle of Badr occurred on 17 Ramadan when the Prophet Mohammed led his forces to victory over the Arabian tribes who opposed him.
    - 627 - The Muslims trained for the Battle of Ditch during Ramadan
    - 630 - The soldiers of Islam, under Mohammed, established a training camp in Tabouk during the month of fasting and attacked the Byzantine army.
    - 653 - During Ramadan, the Muslim army conquered Rhodes and melted the Colossus of Rhodes, one of the seven wonders of the ancient world, into weapons for the soldiers.
    - 1187 – The Battle of Hattin in which a combined force of Sunnis and Shiites destroyed the Christian army occurred the morning after the "Night of Determination."
    - 1973 – On October 6, Egyptian and Syrian forces launched a surprise offensive against Israel to launch the Yom Kippur or the 10th of Ramadan War.
    - 2000 – Al-Qaida launches the suicide bombing of the USS Cole in Aden harbor Yemen. The attack of Oct. 5 kills 17 and wounds 39 American sailors.

    In 2001, Dr. Fuad Mukheimar, secretary-general of the Egyptian Sharia Association, published an article in which he encouraged bin Laden to launch an attack against the U.S. during the holy month.

    "During the month of Ramadan," Mukheimar wrote, "a great Muslim victory was won over the Crusaders under the leadership of Saladin. His advisers counseled him to rest from the jihad during the month of fasting, but Saladin insisted on continuing the jihad during Ramadan because he knew ... that fasting helps to [achieve] victory, because during Ramadan the Muslims overcome themselves through fasting, and thus their victory over their enemies is certain."
    Bin Laden, who views himself as Saladin’s successor, could opt to heed this advice.

    Ramadan begins Tuesday, Oct. 4, and ends on Nov. 2. The Night of Determination will occur Oct. 29

    ExSoldier762's NOTE:
    I have a buddy who lives near DC and he says that there are PSA's running on all the TV stations now 24/7 urging folks to develop emergency evacuation plans and have supplies available at home, work and in the car. Though not firearms, of course.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

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    I'll not discount anything as possible.

    Imagine the scariest thing you can - it could happen. These times we live in are not stable and to pass such threats off as idle or a joke is crazy.

    We can but live in hopes of course that sense will prevail - but where has that got us before!
    Chris - P95
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    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


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    It's quite a complicated manufacturing process to create a viable nuclear bomb.
    I have my doubts that a terrorist group could pull that off.
    Anything is possible though...I guess.
    A "Dirty Bomb" using conventional explosives to spread radioactive material would (for sure) create lots of general panic & hysteria but, would not be as destructive as a Hiroshima type atomic bomb.
    Of course by setting off a radioactive "Dirty Bomb" here in the U.S. they leave themselves wide open for a full scale retaliatory thermonuclear war with the USA.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

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    Unhappy The BIG KaBOOM!

    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter
    It's quite a complicated manufacturing process to create a viable nuclear bomb.
    I have my doubts that a terrorist group could pull that off.
    Anything is possible though...I guess.
    A "Dirty Bomb" using conventional explosives to spread radioactive material would (for sure) create lots of general panic & hysteria but, would not be as destructive as a Hiroshima type atomic bomb.
    Of course by setting off a radioactive "Dirty Bomb" here in the U.S. they leave themselves wide open for a full scale retaliatory thermonuclear war with the USA.
    I don't think OBL's little cadre built anything themselves. But they certainly have the $$$ to buy anything, including materials and talent. Although this article seems to indicate weapons have been purchased from the Russian mafia which makes total sense. Given the open borders policy we seem to be pursuing, it'd probably be easy to smuggle them inside the country. OBL has been working on this for over 10 years. I think to say that a true nuke detonation is unlikely is a little bit of denial, although I can't blame you. It would make us a third world nation instantly. I live in Miami, which is obviously a major target for so many reasons, with some of the largest Jewish populations and gay populations for example. I'm a little more nervous than somebody living outside one of those seven named cities.

    BTW, just who are we going to attack with our nuclear arsenal? Sure I'd like to turn Mecca into Oil Under Glass but realistically, it ain't gonna happen.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

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    BTW, just who are we going to attack with our nuclear arsenal? Sure I'd like to turn Mecca into Oil Under Glass but realistically, it ain't gonna happen.
    True we probaly wouldn't use nukes but we could use those MOAB's. We have lots of goodies in our arsenal.

    Overall not a fun situation to consider but I am not going to stick my head in the sand and play ostrich. Just gonna kept preparing for bad things and hope our goverment can protect us. Don't understand why after 9/11, Katrina and other events so many choose to play ostrich. I isn't that difficult or expensive to prepare for the things that we really need. Not gonna take a chance personally.
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    It would be so unfair for them to hit Las Vegas, the town is just now understanding the value of good food and excellent restaurants.
    I don't know I have thought of their plan woukd be hitting us with short range missles from Mexico and Canada. Even conventional warheads would generate panic. Sure we have technology to fend them off but by the time you get authorization to use it and someone with the balls to do it the deed is done. A few more investigations, lunches and postering by politicians will be on the schedule.
    Last edited by FortyFive; October 1st, 2005 at 08:17 PM. Reason: spelling
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    BTW, just who are we going to attack with our nuclear arsenal?
    Sure I'd like to turn Mecca into Oil Under Glass but realistically, it ain't gonna happen.

    good question...I don't know.

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    All I can say is I hope they don't try this. I'm traveling 3 out of four weeks in October. DC, Norfolk and Seattle.

    -Scott-

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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter
    A "Dirty Bomb" using conventional explosives to spread radioactive material would (for sure) create lots of general panic & hysteria but, would not be as destructive as a Hiroshima type atomic bomb.
    Of course by setting off a radioactive "Dirty Bomb" here in the U.S. they leave themselves wide open for a full scale retaliatory thermonuclear war with the USA.
    While the use of a dirty bomb wouldn't cause the distruction of a Hiroshima type bomb it would possibally leave parts of our cities and surrounding areas useless for decades. All that is needed is the right isotope and wind conditions. I think I'm more afraid of the probability of the dirty bomb than the "real" nuc!

    I guess it depends on your idea of distruction.
    Rick

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    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by rstickle
    While the use of a dirty bomb wouldn't cause the distruction of a Hiroshima type bomb it would possibally leave parts of our cities and surrounding areas useless for decades. All that is needed is the right isotope and wind conditions. I think I'm more afraid of the probability of the dirty bomb than the "real" nuc!

    I guess it depends on your idea of distruction.
    Not me. But being school trained on the topic courtesy of Uncle Sam give me a different perspective, I guess. The stuff you'll get with hospital grade isotopes wrapped around conventional H.E. isn't going to come close to the EMP damage or the blast damage of even a tiny nuke, say .2 KT on up to a 10KT. And there certainly isn't the problem with gamma radiation which is the worst and is only caused in the process of a nuclear reaction....

    I'm not sure the generalized alpha particles that a so called "dirty bomb" might generate wouldn't be largely negated in the first heavy down pour after the event. It is going to be a major hassle to DECON vehicles, personnel, etc but the military can do that pretty well. After all they practice on C17 cargo planes and M1 Tanks, etc. The big problem is going to be keeping the runoff product from seeping into the soil and contaminating the aquifier and drinking water. At least in MY area.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

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    Ex Soldier is right. From a technical standpoint I would much rather have a dirty bomb vs a thermonuclear explosion. The EMP of a nuke would be capable of doing more serious damage to our economy. I know from other reports that Osama wants a nuke in NYC to EMP the NYSE and NASDAQ sites as well as major banks. However, most of that is backed up elsewhere. Where is not for public consumption, so it is unlikely that all the sites could be hit.

    The end result to the nation will be the same however. Terrorism is about fear and such an attack would create a lot of it. This would in turn cripple our economy and leave our currency vunerable. Not good for us.

    -Scott-

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExSoldier762
    Not me. But being school trained on the topic courtesy of Uncle Sam give me a different perspective, I guess. The stuff you'll get with hospital grade isotopes wrapped around conventional H.E. isn't going to come close to the EMP damage or the blast damage of even a tiny nuke, say .2 KT on up to a 10KT. And there certainly isn't the problem with gamma radiation which is the worst and is only caused in the process of a nuclear reaction....
    Yea, I also took may "classes" provided by our rich uncle! I guess I'm making the assumption that the bad guys are going to use something more than "hospital grade" if they're going to all that trouble.

    And of course the media keeps telling me this stuff is missing all over the world, and we know they wouldn't lie.
    Last edited by rstickle; October 2nd, 2005 at 01:11 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott
    Ex Soldier is right. From a technical standpoint I would much rather have a dirty bomb vs a thermonuclear explosion. The EMP of a nuke would be capable of doing more serious damage to our economy. I know from other reports that Osama wants a nuke in NYC to EMP the NYSE and NASDAQ sites as well as major banks. However, most of that is backed up elsewhere. Where is not for public consumption, so it is unlikely that all the sites could be hit.
    Oh, don't get me wrong, I agree the damage and loss of life both immediate and long term would me magnitutides less with a dirty bomb. What I'm saying is depending on where they were the disruption could be massive, and the long term loss of (replaceable) facilities wouldn't be fun. Given the "right" weather conditions the fallout patterns overlaid in heavily populated areas are flat out scary.
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

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    Distinguished Member Array RSSZ's Avatar
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    Try this on for size. The terrorists produce a bomb. However big or small is not a factor. They tell/leak to the media(with very hard PROOF) that they have placed this device in one of the above named cities. The media airs this proof to the general public. IMO they would not have to detonate the device. The people would panic and I mean PANIC. The citizens in the cities would try to evacuate by any means available. It would be utter turmoil. How many people would die? How much property would be damaged? How much looting would their be? IMO it would make the aftermath of Rita look like a church social. This is just one more terrible scanerio. Im sure that ya'll can think of others. What happens if the above scanerio is of the biological nature. Say ---water supply? As I said,the shear panic would be devistating. Good luck to us all.---------

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    You Guys can come habg out with me we should be Safe Cant kill the money since we have the Highest Amount of Arab's in the Usa just down the road ..

    Course something like a Huge Bomb etc could make it unsafe for them After the celebration when 9/11 happened they found out there people wont kill um but we might

    Nothing disgustes me more than seeing the Vid's of those people out dancing in the streets after we were attacked still cant believe the Feds havent emptyed the 3 citys out for all the terrorist connections

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