Officer Suspended After Taser Use Causes Death - Charlotte, NC

This is a discussion on Officer Suspended After Taser Use Causes Death - Charlotte, NC within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; It is really hard to say what is what on this incident. The video isn't really helpful at all from what I can see. Store ...

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Thread: Officer Suspended After Taser Use Causes Death - Charlotte, NC

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    It is really hard to say what is what on this incident.

    The video isn't really helpful at all from what I can see.

    Store surveillance video

    I guess the investigation and the witnesses will tell more than the news article or the video.

    Turner did come into the store, shove some stuff off the counter, and was being beligerent. The woman close to him did not hesitate to get herself in and the child out of the way. Turner did not seem to be threated by the 2 employees nor the other concerned store occupant that were in front of him. Nor was he concerned when the LEO showed up. He just walked past him, either before, during or after the taser was implemented.

    Here is a second video source. News 14 | 24 Hour Local News | Charlotte | Store video captures teen being Tased by police
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  3. #17
    Senior Member Array ronwill's Avatar
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    I think the best thing is to wait for completion of the investigation. Sometimes we tend to jump in with a "sentence" before the findings are complete. Who knows, maybe it will be determined the young man had a cardiac problem. If the officer is found liable, he should be fired from the force and punished for his actions.
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  4. #18
    Distinguished Member Array kazzaerexys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Also, the fact the officer is suspended does not indicate he did anything wrong, like the article insinuates.
    Okay, but does the quote from the police not say:
    [...]the board determined that [...] the prolonged use of the Taser was not [within our procedures...]
    I am certainly no Taser expert, and not a lawyer, but it just seems odd that they can say on one hand that the officer did nothing wrong but on the other hand suspend him without pay, state that he was not consistent with established procedure, and require additional training for the officer.

    Those two statements are not consistent to me.
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  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    One quick point, you cannot countinuesly taze someone for 37 seconds... the taser only cycles in 5 second intervals.
    Shhhhh. Don't introduce facts into the discussion.

    I'd be surprised if it turns out that he didn't have some recreational pharmaceuticals on board. Probably something that lowers the fibrillation threshold, like huffing hydrocarbons.

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  6. #20
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    In regards to the question on the prolonged use of the Taser. Taser recommends that you observe the bad guy for a change in his behavior, that indicates that the Taser is working. If the suspect was still walking around after the Taser was deployed, then that would indicate that the electricity was not connecting between the two wires, which most likely was a result of the volts not being able to jump through lose clothing. So it doesn't matter how many times he pulled the trigger, or what the Taser gun recorded, if the electricity was not effecting the bad guy. Who knows how many of those 5 second deployments the suspect felt. The fact is that the Police Department can CYA and talk to the press all they want, but it is the cop that has to deal with the guy until he is under control, and if he is still resisting and fighting, the cop has no choice but to keep fighting(in this case with the Taser) until the situation is resolved. Again I'm not the biggest fan of the Taser, but I am an instructor in it and I don't want the Taser or a cop to get a bad wrap form miss information.

  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by kazzaerexys View Post
    Okay, but does the quote from the police not say:

    I am certainly no Taser expert, and not a lawyer, but it just seems odd that they can say on one hand that the officer did nothing wrong but on the other hand suspend him without pay, state that he was not consistent with established procedure, and require additional training for the officer.

    Those two statements are not consistent to me.
    He may have broke policy, and who knows what policy that was. Maybe he didn't have his hat on, maybe policy states he should have shot him if the Taser did not work after the first try, maybe he was supposed to wait until another officer arrived, maybe he didnt notify his supervisor after the Taser was deployed.... who knows.

    Jake brings up an excellent point as well.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cupcake View Post

    Sixto: Is it possible that this department uses a different brand/model of device and they are just generically calling it "taser?" I don't actually know if different brands exist in the States, just curious. I'd read of a civilian version that supposedly gives a 30 second ride so you can escape.
    Its possible, but I doubt it. There isn't any. Taser bought the only other one out, and scrapped them. (they were junk anyway)
    The whole thing about "holding the trigger down" is a bunch of hooey, that doesn't work. It will only deliver one five second cycle at a time.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  9. #23
    Distinguished Member Array kazzaerexys's Avatar
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    From the cited article:
    CMPD teaches officers to pull and immediately release the Taser trigger to deliver a five-second shock. Officers may repeatedly pull the trigger in extreme circumstances when necessary to control a suspect. Holding down the trigger violates department policy.
    They mention the 5-second thing, but also talk about continuous trigger, and in fact say that that is specifically what is against policy.

    So again, I am assuming that the officer was suspended 5 days without pay (which is different than just a suspension with pay pending an investigation, no?) for violating the department policy in application of the Taser against a subject who then died.

    That is why I find it hard to accept the blanket statement that the officer is not to blame. I am not saying he necessarily is to blame, either; just that the way his department reacted suggests the possibility of either negligence or excessive force on the part of the officer.
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  10. #24
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    CMPD teaches officers to pull and immediately release the Taser trigger to deliver a five-second shock. Officers may repeatedly pull the trigger in extreme circumstances when necessary to control a suspect. Holding down the trigger violates department policy.
    What I'm saying is that this quote is very misleading to the uninformed public and well...wrong. (theres a shocker, the media printing something they haven't got a clue about)

    As a Taser instructor, one of the very few non Taser employed (I.E. independent) factory trained armorers and a established conductive energy weapons expert witness for three states, I'm saying that simply holding down the Tasers trigger is going to do absolutely nothing but deliver one five second charge.

    Therefor, the policy is either very flawed, or the news got a lot of facts wrong. You take your pick who is more credible.

    As for the five days thing... that would depend on the department. Some do the initial time off after a death as a non paid leave of absence, charge it to comp time or whatever to make the financial matters easier; its a lot easy for them to pay what is owed rather than to collect money that shouldn't have been paid out after the fact.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  11. #25
    Distinguished Member Array kazzaerexys's Avatar
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    Okay, Sixto, thanks for the explanation. I can certainly understand the media getting technical details about Tasers wrong, and even screwing up any quotes about policy, but I was kind of stuck on the unpaid suspension (or leave of absence).

    At this point I don't understand why anybody---cops, politicians, or average citizens---actually talks to reporters anymore...
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