Another 'gun free zone'........the high seas!

Another 'gun free zone'........the high seas!

This is a discussion on Another 'gun free zone'........the high seas! within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; AAAAARRRRGGGGGHHHHH! I know how to stop pirates..........ARM THE PREY!!!! It's so simple, but I doubt it will ever happen. What we get is a bunch ...

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  1. #1
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    Another 'gun free zone'........the high seas!

    AAAAARRRRGGGGGHHHHH!

    I know how to stop pirates..........ARM THE PREY!!!!

    It's so simple, but I doubt it will ever happen. What we get is a bunch of hand wringing & a bunch of politicians saying 'We can't do anything to stop it!'..............

    Just look at some of the stories:

    US Admiral 'stunned' by pirates' reach

    Iranian grain ship seized as Somali pirates hold world to ransom - Times Online

    Video: Pirates make contact with owner of oil supertanker - Times Online

    FT.com / World - Pirates seize another ship in Gulf of Aden

    Danish oil ship briefly seized off Nigeria - Yahoo! News

    Reuters AlertNet - Hong Kong grain ship hijacked by pirates - Xinhua

    FT.com / World - Call for navies to seek out pirates? ships

    Pirates anchor hijacked supertanker Sirius Star off Somalia coast | World news | guardian.co.uk


    Just allow these freighters & tankers to be armed.....That's all it would take. Why is so hard to figure out?

    Various navies could help, but just like Policemen....THEY CAN'T BE EVERYWHERE AT ONCE!
    Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est.-Seneca

    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. If I have a gun, what do I have to be paranoid about?" -Clint Smith

    "An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Jeff Cooper


  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by goawayfarm View Post
    AAAAARRRRGGGGGHHHHH!

    I know how to stop pirates..........ARM THE PREY!!!!

    It's so simple, but I doubt it will ever happen. What we get is a bunch of hand wringing & a bunch of politicians saying 'We can't do anything to stop it!'..............

    Just look at some of the stories:

    US Admiral 'stunned' by pirates' reach


    Iranian grain ship seized as Somali pirates hold world to ransom - Times Online

    Video: Pirates make contact with owner of oil supertanker - Times Online

    FT.com / World - Pirates seize another ship in Gulf of Aden

    Danish oil ship briefly seized off Nigeria - Yahoo! News

    Reuters AlertNet - Hong Kong grain ship hijacked by pirates - Xinhua

    FT.com / World - Call for navies to seek out pirates? ships

    Pirates anchor hijacked supertanker Sirius Star off Somalia coast | World news | guardian.co.uk


    Just allow these freighters & tankers to be armed.....That's all it would take. Why is so hard to figure out?

    Various navies could help, but just like Policemen....THEY CAN'T BE EVERYWHERE AT ONCE!
    They should have some 'undercover tankers'...loaded to the brim with soldiers and heavy duty weaponry.

    Stay armed...make shark food...stay safe!
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  3. #3
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    The problem with arming the commercial ships is that somewhere, somehow, the owners would have to hire trained people to operate the weaponry and repel the attacks. I don't think they can rely on their own crews for this--these are merchant ships, and the crews aren't trained for combat.

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    Distinguished Member Array Colin's Avatar
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    The other problem is landing at different ports of call with lots of guns, many countries won't allow that. You can almost do what you want on the high seas.

  5. #5
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    10,000+ merchant ships pass through there a year. We have fewer then 100 attacks a year; out of those maybe 20 hijackings? Which ship out of the remaining 9,900 do you fill to the brim with soldiers?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    The problem with arming the commercial ships is that somewhere, somehow, the owners would have to hire trained people to operate the weaponry and repel the attacks. I don't think they can rely on their own crews for this--these are merchant ships, and the crews aren't trained for combat.
    Just like supply and demad, it's all economics. The owners don't care enough to pay for armed guards. Only about .001% of shipping gets hijacked. If your ship does get hijacked you insurance (Lloyds of London probably) gets stuck with the bill. Arming your whole fleet would cost millions more than paying your deductable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin View Post
    The other problem is landing at different ports of call with lots of guns, many countries won't allow that. You can almost do what you want on the high seas.
    I think this could be true too. Not as much of a problem as you might think though.
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

  7. #7
    Distinguished Member Array coffeecup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    The problem with arming the commercial ships is that somewhere, somehow, the owners would have to hire trained people to operate the weaponry and repel the attacks. I don't think they can rely on their own crews for this--these are merchant ships, and the crews aren't trained for combat.
    Tell that to the WW2 U.S. Merchant Marine. If they could do it then--it can be done in this day and time too.

  8. #8
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    everything is going to get worse, especially if the big 3 auto makers go belly up! It will send a ripple effect across the globe.

  9. #9
    Distinguished Member Array Colin's Avatar
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    The pirates just tried to attack a Indian Navy Frigate, the Indians sank the pirate mothership, that should put a dent into the problem.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopyard View Post
    The problem with arming the commercial ships is that somewhere, somehow, the owners would have to hire trained people to operate the weaponry and repel the attacks. I don't think they can rely on their own crews for this--these are merchant ships, and the crews aren't trained for combat.
    Right so they send out $400million ships and spend $0 on security...really brilliant.
    The more recent one like the oil tanker comes to mind. These numbnuts send out hundreds of millions of dollars in commodities and aren't willing to spend on a decent security team to have on board. They could easily offer 150k per head per cruise to say... a 6 man team all required to be former (insert group of choice here) and/or current members of (insert group of choice here) and given list of small arms of choice for the duration of the voyage. Problem solved.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

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  11. #11
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    A coupla GE miniguns and a few ma deuces on board would make any pirate rethink his job security
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    A coupla GE miniguns and a few ma deuces on board would make any pirate rethink his job security
    Mounted on the deck! I'm sure most pirates use 'nocs or telescopes to do some reconnaissance before they approach the ship...I bet if they see some 134's and M2's mounted at various points on the deck they wouldn't even get within a mile of the thing, not knowing what other armor was in store for them.
    "I'd rather have one and not need it, than need one and not have it!"

  13. #13
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    This is no different than individual self protection. You cannot rely on the police, (or Navy), to be there to protect you at all times. Your choice is to trust to luck or arm and protect yourself. Arm and train the crews, even on luxury liners. I heard that some luxury liners are using some kind of noise device to ward off pirate attacks. Yes, a loud beam of noise is aimed at the attacking boat(s). Less-than-lethal pirate deterrent. It actually seems to work but I would prefer killing the scum so they don’t attack another ship.
    DEMOCRACY IS TWO WOLVES AND A LAMB VOTING ON WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH. LIBERTY IS A WELL ARMED LAMB CONtestING THE VOTE.

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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by packinnova View Post
    Right so they send out $400million ships and spend $0 on security...really brilliant.
    The more recent one like the oil tanker comes to mind. These numbnuts send out hundreds of millions of dollars in commodities and aren't willing to spend on a decent security team to have on board. They could easily offer 150k per head per cruise to say... a 6 man team all required to be former (insert group of choice here) and/or current members of (insert group of choice here) and given list of small arms of choice for the duration of the voyage. Problem solved.
    I was going to say the exact same thing. Thanks. Let me just add that they have a $400 million ship with $100 million in cargo and no security. They deserve to be hijacked.
    Preparing for the Zombie Apocalypse or Rapture....whichever comes first.

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    You guys just don't get it. THEY DON'T CARE! It's the price of doing business. To arm the fleet would cost hundreds of millions of dollars (for each company) each year. They could also stop these hijackings by going the long way around Mauritius and Madagascar but they don't want to spend the extra fuel and time to avoid the trouble spots. Losing one out of 5000 ships is no big deal to them. These companies have insurance to cover their losses. That's what insurance is for! Many times it is a representative of Lloyds of London or a company like them that negotiates with the pirates to recoup the losses they are already going to pay in insurance payouts.
    It is surely true that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Nor can you make them grateful for your efforts.

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