MS-13: kinda changes the perspective on concealed carry considerations

This is a discussion on MS-13: kinda changes the perspective on concealed carry considerations within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by WolfPack 13 stands for the 13th letter of the alphabet, "M", meaning Mexico. At least that is how I understand it from ...

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Thread: MS-13: kinda changes the perspective on concealed carry considerations

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    Unhappy ms13 not Mexican

    Quote Originally Posted by WolfPack
    13 stands for the 13th letter of the alphabet, "M", meaning Mexico. At least that is how I understand it from reading articles. My little slice of life in North Carolina is becoming overwhelmed with hispanics and I'm seeing more "tags" around from copycat juvenille gangs. Lots of "13's" being spray painted. My youngest son is a junior in high school and keeps me informed concerning gang activity.
    Sorry, no. The group originated in ElSalvador and the MS is something in spanish. I think Miggy knows exactly. Where in North Carolina are you? We're thinking of moving to Ashville in a couple of years to retire. Are these gangs overrunning that area?
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

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  3. #32
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    MS stands for "Mara Salvatrucha" - "Mara" meaning gang and "Salvatrucha" for Salvadorans.

    S.W.A.T.'s article, "On The Front Lines Against MS-13: El Salvador's UTO," ran in the August 2005 issue and was about the Salvadoran police who handle MS13 down there. In our upcoming March 2006 issue, we're having an article about MS13 here in the States.

    Nasty gang. Their tags all over here in Nashville.
    Last edited by Betty; January 23rd, 2006 at 10:17 AM. Reason: typo
    "Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power." - Yoshimi Ishikawa

  4. #33
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    Did a site search on MS 13.

    http://www.combatcarry.com/vbulletin...ra+Salvatrucha

    All very good info
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
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  5. #34
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Comparing notes

    Quote Originally Posted by Miggy
    No idea on fly. Gat is a gun and it is short for gatillo = trigger. Punto is point or dot and I have no idea what it refers to unless the writer actually meant Puto and that is not a nice word in Spanish. It means a male whore.
    That's interesting on "punto" vs. "puto". I hear it pronounced "puto" but see it spelled "punto" all the time. Some of my more "darling" students are fond of the word, and love to write it at every opportunity. It doesn't really have a good English translation. My Mexican friends have told me it's like "*******" but much stronger. Locally it's a word used to describe a potential victim, or a "mark" if you've heard that term.

    I've also been told that "Gat" comes from "gatling gun" as well as your explanation.

    Fly is another word for a knife. It's originally lifted from a "butterfly" knife (more properly called a balisong), but it's come to mean any kind of knife.

    There's some other terms I recognize when I hear them, but listing them off is kind of hard because I don't talk like that, if that makes any sense.

    Local usages and meanings are slightly different depending on what subculture you're talking about, and your locality.

  6. #35
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    It is even deeper than just plain *******. In the latin world a Puto is a Homosexual male whore which, in the machismo culture, is the lowest of the men with the exception of child molesters. Of course, to different countries may mean more or less as insult, but I wouldn't be just dropping that word in passing just anywhere.


    Go to Google, select Images and type Mara Salvatrucha. You'll see a nice collection of mugshots, pictures and assorted images of them boys.
    Last edited by Miggy; January 21st, 2006 at 09:10 PM. Reason: More Info
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  7. #36
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    Some thoughts on this thread.

    #1- MS-13 members are flesh and blood not some super-duper-gang-bangers the news-media hype wants you to believe. That means they bleed red like you and me.

    #2- If you believe in the 2nd Amendment then believe in ALL of it. And organize a "neighborhood watch" group accordingly.

    #3- In keeping with #2 get to know your neighbors at fairly well.

    #4- Get to know your local LEA and LEO's too if possible. I've also found out if you see something odd going on better results can be obtained by asking to see someone in the detective division and reporting it to them.

    #5- Some people may want to invest a lot in weapons or things like alarms. But don't neglect stuff like camera and video gear that can help gather evidence against gang members or oither criminals.

  8. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExSoldier762
    Sorry, no. The group originated in ElSalvador and the MS is something in spanish. I think Miggy knows exactly. Where in North Carolina are you? We're thinking of moving to Ashville in a couple of years to retire. Are these gangs overrunning that area?
    http://www.gangsorus.com/marasalvatrucha13.html

    Identifiers- Mara Salvatrucha is also known as Mara Salvatrucha 13, MS 13, and MS XIII. They consider the number “13” to be lucky and if also shows an alliance with Southern California Hispanic gangs. The number “13” is a reference to the thirteenth letter of the alphabet which is “M.” “M” is synonymous with La Eme or the Mexican Mafia. The Mexican Mafia is a prison gang but according to law enforcement sources, controls many Southern California Hispanic gangs. As further evidence of the MS alignment with Southern California, they may also use the terms Sureño, Sureño 13, Sur or Sur 13. “Sureño” is Spanish for “southern” while “sur” means “south.”


    I'm in eastern NC, near Goldsboro. The hispanic gang in our local high school call themselves "Joker-13". Tags around the school and I even saw a tag at the dump/recycle site.

  9. #38
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    Sorry Wolfpack but somebody has the wrong info posted on that website. They are Salvadorans and want nothing to do with the Mexicans or Mexican Mafia.

    Named for La Mara, a street in San Salvador, and the Salvatrucha guerillas who fought in El Salvador’s bloody civil war, Mara Salvatrucha 13 was organized in Los Angeles in the late ’80s. At first, the gang’s primary purpose was to defend Salvadoran immigrants from being preyed upon by other L.A. street gangs.
    Police Magazine Article on MS13

    And on what BigEd said. Yes they are human and bleed and not constricted by moral limits in their pursue of crimes. Are they crack shots? Nope, Most of the criminal element is not. The mayority are urban centered so they are restricted to where they can go practice firearms marksmanship and surely they may want to check IDPA, IPSC and other disciplines, but I doubt pretty much any club would accept somebody tattoed like that and they wouldn't be confortable around people who are pro Law Enforcement or a club that has LEOs in it.
    At the end, thier advantage is ruthlesness. We are bound by law and morality, But if we are given half a chance, their odds plummet against preparation, training and firepower.
    Even the most ardent ACLU lawyer would think at trying to sue Mr. Average Joe because he emptied his gun on a MS13 member who chose the wrong person to attack.
    At least that is my opinion.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  10. #39
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    Several have alluded to these point about MS13: ruthlessness and no rules. To me, it is the no rules that is their unique advantage. I re-read the RD article and it seems the victim and a friend were in a Chinese resturant when a gang of MS-13 came in. They claimed this guy was a member of another gang and beat him senseless and left. Then a bit later, one gang member returned and shot him in the head. That pretty well shows the ruthlessness and no rules they are known for.

    And yes they do bleed like anyone else, but if you kill one, others are likely to seek revenge. They couldn't have one their's killed by some citizen and just let it go.

    Plus, "we" as as armeds citizen are going to be outnumbered if we have to face an MS-13 gang. Visualize sitting in a resturant when 4 or 5 of these guys come in. Are we going to make our gun ready? It's really doubtful. By the time we realize there's imminent trouble, it's almost too late against their numbers and position about us.

    And again, even if we win, it may just be the beginning. This is very, very different than an armed citizen against isolated BGs. These guys may pursue you and yours until you are dead.

  11. #40
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    So, basically what you are saying is damn if we do it and damn if we don't. I'd vote Damn if I do it. I rather go down fighting.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  12. #41
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    The way these gangbangers are getting these days it makes me wish I could load a crew served weapon into the back of my truck.
    They who give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin


    Previously known as "cjm5874"

  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miggy
    So, basically what you are saying is damn if we do it and damn if we don't. I'd vote Damn if I do it. I rather go down fighting.
    I know what you mean. But this is a different enemy. Winning a battle with these guys may just bring the next battle to our home and families. Going down fighting could be a death sentence for our families.

  14. #43
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    Going down fighting could be a death sentence for our families.
    The trick is to kill all of the punks so as to insure that there wil lbe no reprecussions.

    Thats the only way that it can work.

  15. #44
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    Unhappy Odds of getting God to do the final sorting?

    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns
    The trick is to kill all of the punks so as to insure that there will be no reprecussions. Thats the only way that it can work.
    I'm afraid that in an environment where we are likely to encounter such animals we are not going to be able to avoid the inevitable witness or security camera. That means cops, (reports), reporters and news. I'd have to say your comment is possibly an ideal...but the odds of it working out like are too remote to comtemplate.

    They only travel in groups. If you get into a fight and any of them see their buds getting capped in the head over and over again, sure as God made little green apples, some of them are going to have a severe attack of "survival" and just break contact and take off.

    If any get loose from that encounter you and yours are in for a rough time. Especially if it happens in an area where you reside or do business. That makes you that much easier to spot. They will take the time to hunt you and your family down. They have nothing better to do.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  16. #45
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    I'd have to say your comment is possibly an ideal...but the odds of it working out like are too remote to comtemplate.
    Perhaps...
    but ya gotta start somewhere...

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