Police fatalities for ’08 prove ccw laws no threat to cops

Police fatalities for ’08 prove ccw laws no threat to cops

This is a discussion on Police fatalities for ’08 prove ccw laws no threat to cops within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; BELLEVUE, WA – Another bogus argument of gun control extremists – that sensible concealed carry laws create an increased threat to police officers – has ...

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Thread: Police fatalities for ’08 prove ccw laws no threat to cops

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array mrreynolds's Avatar
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    Police fatalities for ’08 prove ccw laws no threat to cops

    BELLEVUE, WA – Another bogus argument of gun control extremists – that sensible concealed carry laws create an increased threat to police officers – has been refuted by statistics from the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund and published by USA Today.

    The number of officer fatalities due to gunfire is the lowest in 50 years, noted Alan Gottlieb, chairman of the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms. A report out Monday said that this year, 41 officers have died from gunshot wounds, down 40 percent from the 68 who died by gunfire in 2007. Yet the number of concealed carry permits issued by the states has risen, dramatically in some areas, in the past 12 months.

    “Better training and equipment have contributed to this decline,” Gottlieb stated, “but it must be noted for the record that growing numbers of legally-armed citizens have not resulted in more police slayings. That has been one of the many lame arguments offered by gun control fanatics over the past few years when they fought against expanded concealed carry rights.

    “The death of one police officer is a tragedy,” he continued, “but common sense right-to-carry statutes have no relation to the criminal slayings of police officers, and anti-gun rights extremists know it.”

    The National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund reports that more officers have died in traffic-related incidents than in shootings, same as last year, Gottlieb noted.

    “There are, today, more legally-armed citizens than ever before,” he commented, “and more privately-owned firearms than ten or even five years ago. More Americans own semiautomatic sport-utility rifles, growing numbers of women own guns for personal protection and more citizens are involved in shooting sports.

    “None of these law-abiding citizens pose any threat to public safety, and especially to the safety of our local police,” Gottlieb concluded. “We expect the new Congress, and state legislatures around the country, to keep this in perspective as the gun ban lobby mounts new attacks on firearm civil rights in 2009.”


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    Member Array Glock30SF's Avatar
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    Interesting. I would have thought the streets would be turned into the wild wild west by now.
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    "A report out Monday said that this year, 41 officers have died from gunshot wounds, down 40 percent from the 68 who died by gunfire in 2007."

    That is good news (the relatively low numbers) given the 300 million plus population and number or really dangerous bgs around.

    Were any (even one) of these 68 deaths due to the actions of a license holder? A firm answer of "none" would be a very powerful argument for the reasonableness of issuing carry licenses to people who pass background checks.

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    Doesn't suprise me in the least.
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    Distinguished Member Array Rcher's Avatar
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    This is encouraging for the continuation of RKBA. Every bit of positive news in our favor is a good thing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock30SF View Post
    Interesting. I would have thought the streets would be turned into the wild wild west by now.
    I wish. I read somewhere (I don't remember where) that the "Wild West" was safer per capita than most American cities are today. We just need to go back to everyone carrying all the time. Not only would we have fewer dead cops, we'd probably have fewer cops in general.

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    Senior Member Array press1280's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by agentmel View Post
    I wish. I read somewhere (I don't remember where) that the "Wild West" was safer per capita than most American cities are today. We just need to go back to everyone carrying all the time. Not only would we have fewer dead cops, we'd probably have fewer cops in general.

    Mel
    I'm not sure how far back accurate stats go, but the DOJ's stats go back to 1960, right before the GCA of '68 and other carry bans. The crime rate went straight up from that point until the early 1990's(when CC laws went into effect-coincidence?) and have been declining steadily since. The crime rate today is still about triple what it was in 1960 though.
    So,yes, the "Wild West," was safer.
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    Member Array Double Naught Spy's Avatar
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    Were any (even one) of these 68 deaths due to the actions of a license holder?
    Right, you would think that if they wanted to substantiate concealed carry, people in the know such as Alan Gottleib would have that data. Instead, he has taken a very indirect backdoor approach by saying cop deaths are down, not up, even though concealed carry is up.
    Considering yourself to be defenseless is the first administrative step to becoming a victim.

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    Another bogus argument of gun control extremists ... has been refuted ...
    Most are.

    I have one thing to say on that score, to such extremists: correlation isn't causation.

    It's nice to see so many rational-thinking organizations jumping on the bandwagon, though. Upstanding citizens who simply desire to make it through life happy and whole are not a threat. Killing police, forcing blood to run in the streets, forcing people to be fearful for their very lives ... these are not the actions nor motives of upstanding citizens.

    Now, if only we can get idiot judges to do their jobs, to judge based on the facts instead of on fears. If we can get that to turn the corner, we'll be getting somewhere.

    Imagine what safety on the streets would be if 100% of upstanding adult citizens carried the means for their own defense. Imagine how many potholes a criminal would step in, were a crime to be attempted. If only.
    Last edited by ccw9mm; February 1st, 2009 at 10:59 AM. Reason: gremur
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    Wait, what? I was told that assault weapons kill an officer every few minutes! I thoguht these were DEATH MACHINES that sprayed DEATH from their DEATH PORTS creating SHOWERS OF DEATH.

    There must be something wrong; assault weapons aren't banned, and there are more CCWs, so obviously the stats must be messed up! The anti-gunners can't possibly be wrong...

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    I would like to see the video of Sarah Brady choking on her muffin in the morning.

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    Quote Originally Posted by waterdoor View Post
    I would like to see the video of Sarah Brady choking on her muffin in the morning.
    I'd pay to see that! Wouldn't it be fun to run and wave this whole thing in their face and tell them to shove their own stats! I can think of a whole lot of other things I'd like to do, but this is the edited version!
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    Member Array Double Naught Spy's Avatar
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    Another bogus argument of gun control extremists ... has been refuted ...
    Most are.

    I have one thing to say on that score, to such extremists: correlation isn't causation.
    Actually, what we have is a bogus argument with an attempt to refute it with another bogus type of argument using a correlation to indicate causation. Overall LEO deaths could be down, but deaths due to CCW holders could be up or could compose higher percentage of LEO deaths, but those data are not included in the report, are they? In other words, the study isn't proving what it claims. It is, in essence, another bogus extremist argument.
    Considering yourself to be defenseless is the first administrative step to becoming a victim.

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    Not really.... If there were a couple of incidents where a CCWer had killed cops, it would be in every newspaper in the Nation, front page and in color with the tittle POLICE OFFICER MURDERS BY CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMIT HOLDERS INCREASED 200% IN 2008
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    Member Array swaggs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miggy View Post
    Not really.... If there were a couple of incidents where a CCWer had killed cops, it would be in every newspaper in the Nation, front page and in color with the tittle POLICE OFFICER MURDERS BY CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMIT HOLDERS INCREASED 200% IN 2008
    I agree in all liklihood. But the distinguishing leap between opinion/hypothesis and substantiation is support, which is not given in the original statement. Seems like an easy stat to include and one that would obviously bolster the position. I, too, am intrigued that there was no mention of how many deaths were attributable to permit holders.
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