Open Letter to LEO's.

This is a discussion on Open Letter to LEO's. within the Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Biker Rn, JB TX, Katana, rottkeeper, and those that recognize that COs and Jailers are LEO a great big THANK YOU! Here in Kansas they ...

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Thread: Open Letter to LEO's.

  1. #31
    Member Array Geno's Avatar
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    Biker Rn, JB TX, Katana, rottkeeper, and those that recognize that COs and Jailers are LEO a great big THANK YOU! Here in Kansas they are legally bonified LEOs. That said they do not get the recognizition that they deserve from the general and even some other LEOs in a different type of LE work. For me, back in the day, I viewed those with a notion that COs and Jailers are not LEO with disgust and pity for their ignorance and or arrogance. Thank God I only worked with a couple like that.
    Nice OP there Biker RN and keep up the good work.

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  3. #32
    Member Array TapRackBang's Avatar
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    We have Correctional Officers, Jailers, Police Officers, Deputy Sheriff's, State Troopers, Highway Patrolman, Marshals, parking enforcement officers..the list goes on..These are jobs within the criminal justice system. I'm not really sure what the term Law Enforcement Officer represents...

    Now within the Criminal Justice System there are those who have arrest powers and those that do not..those that do, are Peace Officers..lots of names for them,(see above) but the status they hold are Peace Officers.

    Actually it varies from state to state as to who is granted arrest authority. Some states give Correctional Officers authority to arrest and therefore Peace Officer status.

    Some do not..

    The jobs are both equally important, dangerous and under appreciated, Both are related & dependant on each other, however they are not the same job. Hence the titles. CO vs PO.

    That being said,

    If your talking about what someone calls themself this forum...hmmm who cares.

    If someone on this forum answers a post and calls himself a LEO and he's a CO...close enough.....welcome brother..Call yourself the Grand PooPa..no law broken.

    The chip on your shoulder is yours to carry either way..

    BTW, I am both Correctional Officer certified & Peace Officer certified( UT has different certifications and academies for both) , I have worked in our jail & have worked as a Peace Officer for over thirty years. I see us all as different pieces to the same big puzzle. equal but different.

    I got an Idea!!!

    We can vote that on this forum LEO encompasses both Correctional Officers and Peace Officers, both holding equal status.

    Then no one get thier panties in a knot over a title on a fourm..

    Motion was made any second???
    "Arms in the hands of individual citizens may be used at individual discretion..in private self defense." John Adams

  4. #33
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikerRN View Post
    Some of you seem to think that once the inmate is incarcerated they go on to become model citizens.
    Can't imagine anyone really believes this to be true. As you suggest, prisons are gladiator schools. Enter with a B.S. in thuggery; if you survive, you exit with a PhD. in whatever.

    Those of you that think we just "babysit" show your arrogance, ignorance and stupidity of how things really are.
    Assumptions are a dangerous thing, but they invariably say far more about ourselves than the subject of our assumptions. One of life's important truths.

    Now some also seem to think that because I have RN behind my name that I am nothing but a nurse. Sorry again, but that just shows how little you really know
    It's like suggesting a combat "medic" isn't a solider. Ask any who survived Bastogne, the clearing of Fallujah or any of a thousand other battles, to hear the truth of that assumption.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  5. #34
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    Is the school nurse a teacher?
    "Just blame Sixto"

  6. #35
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Is the school nurse a teacher?
    An elementary school teaches children. Teachers hold class. School nurses are outside that loop and don't engage in that primary role (teaching).

    A police force or combat group enforces control over the space, controlling the BG's (among other things). All officers tasked with the use of force to control the space come running when control needs to be enforced. Docs don't, and are like administrative staff who are outside the loop and don't engage in that primary role (security).

    It comes down to the roles assigned to the team and members, I'd say.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  7. #36
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Let me just say I think you've made an excellent post here. I know you're a dependable person, and you take your life and your work very seriously. You give 100% to anything and everything you do. What you should realize is that no matter what schooling, or what experience anyone else in this world has or can obtain, they will never be able to fill your shoes. Take comfort in knowing there's not that many who would want to in the first place....so rule out 99% of the BS that's bothering you considering the source. The other 1%.................50% of those are pretty much worthless since it would seem they get through life bestowing their unfounded opinions and prejudices upon others. 25% would just as soon remain ignorant of the facts and attach a stigma to what they are unable to define due to lack of knowledge. 20% just like to spout garbage in hopes of dragging you down to their level and pushing your buttons leaving you frustrated and dismayed at how part of society works and thrives on discontent. The last 5% of the 1% are those that are just plain unhappy in life and will ever remain so because they simply don't have the will or the fortitude to change their outlook.
    I know who you are, and even better now than I did before. You have nothing to prove to me or anyone else. I just wish you'd let that negative energy rebound off of you and not take things so personally. Your overall health pretty much depends on this taking place soon. Just my 2 and you can send me back a penny if you want to.
    Illegitimis non carborundum

  8. #37
    Senior Member Array cagueits's Avatar
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    Law Enforcement Officer (LEO)

    The law in most jurisdictions states that if you are convicted of a crime you may be incarcerated for a period of time. Correctional Officers (COs) are in fact enforcing the law that states that convicted members of society be incarcerated for X amount of time. So in fact COs are LEOs as they are enforcing the law of the jurisdiction they are in. Highway Patrol Officers are LEOs, as are Police Officers, Sherrifs, IRS-CID, Transit Police, etc, etc, because they enforce the law of a jurisdiciton, same as the COs enforcing the law that states convicted individuals will remain at Y place for X period of time.

    This is really a silly debate.
    I can no longer keep track of threads as I used to. If you need to contact me, PM me instead of asking me something in the thread. Disclaimer - No legal advice issued anywhere. Take care.

  9. #38
    Ex Member Array BikerRN's Avatar
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    Thank you all for your replies, even the one's that disagree with me.

    This thread was inspired by someone that usually defecates over on GlockTalk, but has been known to come over here once in a while to spread his or her droppings. Most of what had me a little peeved was from the words in PM. I know who it is, but will not share the name publicly, as I feel that would be disrespectful.

    If you notice the hours that I typically post, it's late and I have just gotten home from work. I use the forum as my means of a television and way to "unwind" before going to bed. Watching the TV tends to wake people up that are trying to sleep.

    Take care and stay safe,

    Biker

  10. #39
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Having to deal with criminals and a lot of them that have nothing to lose if they kill a CO,takes serious cajones,street cops encounter BG's armed and with backup in most cases,CO's have radios
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post

    It comes down to the roles assigned to the team and members, I'd say.
    This sums things up nicely.

    Quote Originally Posted by cagueits View Post
    This is really a silly debate.
    Yes it is. CO's should have pride in being CO's. They dont need another title to earn respect.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  12. #41
    Senior Member Array TheGreatGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikerRN View Post
    That same attitude was evident a few years back when people of color were considered 7/10 human.
    Biker, you were making such excellent points. Why, oh why, did you have to go there? Why did you try to co-opt the struggle for civil rights into your professional argument? Did you apply to be a CO? Did you accept the job knowing the terms and conditions? Please let me know when you meet a black person who applied to be black and then accepted the skin color knowing the terms and conditions. Don't compare the two. There is no similarity between a struggle for human dignity and survival and a struggle for professional and personal recognition.
    Respectfully,
    Gonzo
    "Skin that smokewagon!".

  13. #42
    Ex Member Array Butch's Avatar
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    If you work as a Nurse in a prison and are going around calling yourself an LEO, I'd have to say it's a bit disingenuous, even if it may technically be true if you split enough hairs .
    Why not call yourself a Nurse, or a Corrections Officer ? By the information that you leave out it appears that you want people to think that you are a Federal Agent.
    If you want to be a Cop, be a Cop. If you're a Nurse, be a Nurse,

  14. #43
    Senior Member Array usmc3169's Avatar
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    We have CO's that used to be cops, cops that used to be CO's, one cop that used to be a doctor (MD), one that used to be district attorney - a defense lawyer that used to be a cop who just defended a cop, who now used to be a cop but is now an inmate!

    The CO's up here call them selves "CO's" the Stated Troopers call themselves "Troopers" and the City police call them selves "Police" - - - The police and the troopers have just as much repect for each other as they have for the CO's, and vice versa.

    I think Gonzo brought up a valid point, as has SIXTO - call a spade a spade... in some places CO's do have the same powers and responsibilities as police, some places they dont. Up here CO's have a much wider range of options in how to deal with the problem children of society, I would not mind doing thier job - parts of it look like alot of fun, other parts look exceptionally boring. I preffer to be outside working all the same, and will stay with the job I have right now.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

  15. #44
    Senior Member Array Vaquero 45's Avatar
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    This whole thread is in response to another thread where BikerRN made a comment about an issue from his "LEO" perspective. He stated that he wouldn't take action to stop a violent crime in progress in front of him, other than perhaps calling 911 and being a good witness. I had never heard of such a thing, and thought that such a notion was abhorrent, coming from an LEO. He even went so far to say that his agency prohibited him from taking action off-duty. I finally got info from another DC member that BikerRN is a CO or works in a federal prison, who often posts as a "Federal LEO" when sharing his perspective with the board.

    Apparently, my opinion that he should be more upfront about his actual position when offering "LEO insight" on this board has affected him deeply...hence this thread. BikerRN does a valuable job, but he is not an "LEO" in the classic sense, and should not represent himself as such when posting on here.

    As far as "not knowing what I am talking about...", after serving in the Army as an MP, I was a CO with my state Department of Correction for 5 years in a maximum security prison, being promoted to correctional sergeant before joining a major metro sheriff's department as a CO in the jail. I have a total of 7.5 years of corrections experience. At no time did I consider myself an LEO, as I had no arrest authority outside of limited authority while actually on duty. I would not think of going on a message board as a CO and identifying myself as an LEO without referencing my actual position. To do so is misleading and disingenuous.

    For the last 13 years, I've been a sworn LEO with a major metro agency. I do not care for people that pretend to be something that they are not. I do not come on this board and say that I am a "government agent," although this would technically be true. It would be misleading. I say what I am....a metro police sergeant. An LEO. And I offer my opinions on various matters as such.

    BikerRN, if you are a federal corrections official, just say so. Heck, I STILL don't know what your actual position is. Why the big secret? I don't understand why you need the label of "LEO" to feel that you are worth something. (7/10ths of a human? Really? Wow. Window into your soul there, bro...) You do a difficult job, and one that not many LEOs would want. I know....I've been there. But your job is not LEO in the classic sense, while you may possess some limited arrest authority while on duty. You should be proud of the important job that you do, and the valuable role that you play in the criminal justice system, without having to masquerade as a "Federal LEO" on this board.

    And by the way....I'm not registered and have never posted one word on GlockTalk, in case it was me that you were talking about.
    Slow is smooth.....smooth is fast.

  16. #45
    Member Array ibesarcasm's Avatar
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    Ok..... just a quick question to all the "Police Officers" Since we can't really define LEO at this point because everyone has a diff. opinion.......

    Do you have persons working in your facility..... SO, PO, Trooper....whatever, that are SWORN officials, but don't go out on patrol?

    I believe the diff. you all are talking about is sworn Vs. civilian......... and to hear most "police officers" speak, they would not consider Border Patrol, Air Marshals, Customs Officers for ICE, Marshals, DEA, ATF, ECT, ECT a "real" officer. In the Federal sector the only "position" that has a wide arrest athority is a person working in a "1811" criminal investigator position. All others have SOME sort of restriction put on them.
    So bottom line is, how many "police" officers have responded to crimes on federal property? Military Posts? National Parks? and do you have juristdiction on those propertys? You might assist.....but are you the athority?

    We all have diff. positions, and we ALL have diff. jurisdictions. Bottom line is that a Federal Correctional Officer is just that.....a Federal SWORN officer.....we fall under Title 18 of United States Code. My .02.......
    Sarcasm - Just one of the many services I provide!
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