AZ + Bikers + Gangs + Shootout + No real details = Front page of CNN!

This is a discussion on AZ + Bikers + Gangs + Shootout + No real details = Front page of CNN! within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; They're just hoping for something bad so they can condemn the new CC law in AZ. Nothing to report, but they put it on the ...

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Thread: AZ + Bikers + Gangs + Shootout + No real details = Front page of CNN!

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    AZ + Bikers + Gangs + Shootout + No real details = Front page of CNN!

    They're just hoping for something bad so they can condemn the new CC law in AZ. Nothing to report, but they put it on the front page. Sheesh.

    At least 4 people injured in suspected Arizona biker shootout
    http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/21/....html?hpt=Sbin
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    Member Array Deuce130's Avatar
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    I saw this earlier today and I'm a little bothered by it. There are many "1%ers" who are convicted felons who don't qualify for CC permits. So, it's quite possible that those involved in the shootout didn't have permits. Second, biker violence tends to get ignore or romanticized. I think the reasons for this are obvious, but it doesn't make it OK. The bottom line is that these clowns are gangsters and thugs who had a turf war shootout in a public place. Thankfully no innocents were killed. I hope the relatively deep pockets of these MCs don't succeed in buying their way out of this crime. It's amazing to me that we don't put these "clubs" into the same category as the Crips, Bloods, Latin Kings, MS-13, GDs or any other common street gang. The Bandidos, the HA's, the Outlaws, the Pagans, they're no better. They just seem to have better public relations.

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    Sorry dude, but if you wear any 3 piece patch and you get attention from LEOs. The M/C's you listed are all under the watchful eyes of law enforcement.

    You mention that biker violence is either romanticized or ignored. I would add that it is also blown way out of proportion too. I have known and ridden with some of these 1% barbarians you so broadly generalize and have found that many of them are blue collar working stiffs. Maybe they live a little faster and wilder than most and club life comes at considerable cost, but I know that if I ever needed anything those guys would move heaven and earth to help me out. You say that many 1%ers are convicted felons, well I would suggest that even more aren't. Of course there is no data to back either claim up.

    Why don't we let the justice system work it out and not engage in yellow journalism. The same sensationalism you are engaging in is the same attitude that anti-gun types paint all of us with. Not all gun toters are criminals. Not all clubbers are clownish thugs. Life is not black and white.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nubby View Post
    Sorry dude, but if you wear any 3 piece patch and you get attention from LEOs. The M/C's you listed are all under the watchful eyes of law enforcement.

    You mention that biker violence is either romanticized or ignored. I would add that it is also blown way out of proportion too. I have known and ridden with some of these 1% barbarians you so broadly generalize and have found that many of them are blue collar working stiffs. Maybe they live a little faster and wilder than most and club life comes at considerable cost, but I know that if I ever needed anything those guys would move heaven and earth to help me out. You say that many 1%ers are convicted felons, well I would suggest that even more aren't. Of course there is no data to back either claim up.

    Why don't we let the justice system work it out and not engage in yellow journalism. The same sensationalism you are engaging in is the same attitude that anti-gun types paint all of us with. Not all gun toters are criminals. Not all clubbers are clownish thugs. Life is not black and white.
    + 1.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nubby View Post
    Sorry dude, but if you wear any 3 piece patch and you get attention from LEOs. The M/C's you listed are all under the watchful eyes of law enforcement.

    You mention that biker violence is either romanticized or ignored. I would add that it is also blown way out of proportion too. I have known and ridden with some of these 1% barbarians you so broadly generalize and have found that many of them are blue collar working stiffs. Maybe they live a little faster and wilder than most and club life comes at considerable cost, but I know that if I ever needed anything those guys would move heaven and earth to help me out. You say that many 1%ers are convicted felons, well I would suggest that even more aren't. Of course there is no data to back either claim up.

    Why don't we let the justice system work it out and not engage in yellow journalism. The same sensationalism you are engaging in is the same attitude that anti-gun types paint all of us with. Not all gun toters are criminals. Not all clubbers are clownish thugs. Life is not black and white.
    Being an LEO in an area heavily populated with a notorious biker gang, I have to agree with this. Yeah, they are into some criminal activity, but I'd much rather deal with a biker vs. any other 'ganster' type. At least they have a little honor and understand what respect really is. Most of the time you can simply reason with them and they'll cuff themselves up if needed. Not to mention they are pretty good about policing themselves.
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    I lived across the road from a club house. They left a couple years ago. The only issue we ever had was that HD's are really loud at whatever o'clock in the morning they would roll in or out. Oh, and the US Marshalls occasionally camped out on our road. Same group lived across the road from my uncle. Occasional loud party and loud bikes were the only problems. That said, they are generally OK to live around but I would not want to hang out at a bar with them. Most problems they have are when they are out and about. Oh, and the national Outlaw rally was in town this year too. We occasionally get a shooting around this area, but not nearly on par with what the street gangs do. But pre street gangs, Charlotte, NC had a rough time with biker gangs and violence for a while.

    Nubby, the only issue I would have with what you are saying is it all depends on whether they like you. If they like you, your golden. If not, well...
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    Distinguished Member Array pcon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chiefjason View Post
    That said, they are generally OK to live around but I would not want to hang out at a bar with them.

    Nubby, the only issue I would have with what you are saying is it all depends on whether they like you. If they like you, your golden. If not, well...
    There's a biker bar in the town that I live I've been to twice. The first time was not so bad, a little rowdy and loud, but fun. I met some really cool people. The 2nd time was a little different. I learned that this is where one of the local MCs made claimed as their turf. A guy from another MC came in and tried to pick up the leader's lady, then disrespected and tried to fight the leader when he stepped in. The entire bar got really dangerous really quickly. Aside from several broken glasses and a few bystanders knocked over in the scuffle, it was over pretty quickly. Needless to say, I haven't been back.

    As for the article, it really doesn't give ANY info at all...
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcon View Post
    There's a biker bar in the town that I live I've been to twice. The first time was not so bad, a little rowdy and loud, but fun. I met some really cool people. The 2nd time was a little different. I learned that this is where one of the local MCs made claimed as their turf. A guy from another MC came in and tried to pick up the leader's lady, then disrespected and tried to fight the leader when he stepped in. The entire bar got really dangerous really quickly. Aside from several broken glasses and a few bystanders knocked over in the scuffle, it was over pretty quickly. Needless to say, I haven't been back.
    As for the article, it really doesn't give ANY info at all...
    Now that wasn't real bright, was it?

    To the OP...
    AZ gun laws have absolutely NOTHING to do with this, or any biker gang get-together or disturbance. If someone is going to have guns, let it be legal or illegal...it's going to happen...forget about any laws.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcon View Post
    There's a biker bar in the town that I live I've been to twice. The first time was not so bad, a little rowdy and loud, but fun. I met some really cool people. The 2nd time was a little different. I learned that this is where one of the local MCs made claimed as their turf. A guy from another MC came in and tried to pick up the leader's lady, then disrespected and tried to fight the leader when he stepped in. The entire bar got really dangerous really quickly. Aside from several broken glasses and a few bystanders knocked over in the scuffle, it was over pretty quickly. Needless to say, I haven't been back.

    As for the article, it really doesn't give ANY info at all...
    You get idiots everywhere and in all walks of life. I remember setting in a bar in Fayetteville NC. Home of Ft Bragg and the 82nd Air Borne. A guy walks in wearing his greens, sporting a 101st Air Borne patch and screams out "82nd SUCKS!". He made it about 5 feet before they were all over him. I discretely slipped out the door. I have no idea how many broken bones and stitches he ended up with.
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    You get idiots everywhere and in all walks of life. I remember setting in a bar in Fayetteville NC. Home of Ft Bragg and the 82nd Air Borne. A guy walks in wearing his greens, sporting a 101st Air Borne patch and screams out "82nd SUCKS!". He made it about 5 feet before they were all over him. I discretely slipped out the door. I have no idea how many broken bones and stitches he ended up with.

    Someone must have lost a big bet...right before losing his teeth.
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    You get idiots everywhere and in all walks of life. I remember setting in a bar in Fayetteville NC. Home of Ft Bragg and the 82nd Air Borne. A guy walks in wearing his greens, sporting a 101st Air Borne patch and screams out "82nd SUCKS!". He made it about 5 feet before they were all over him. I discretely slipped out the door. I have no idea how many broken bones and stitches he ended up with.
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    Member Array John Luttrel's Avatar
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    Back when I was a young military man, my buddies and I frequently hung around some pretty rough biker bars. Saw some pretty wild things during those days, but for the most part the biker clubs like military guys and as long as you aren't a trouble maker, a military guy wouldn't have any trouble from them.

    Of course, now that I'm older and wiser, I don't crave that much excitement anymore and avoid any places or anyone that may provide it.
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    Front for what? The Vagos and the HA went at it again, nothing new.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nubby View Post
    Sorry dude, but if you wear any 3 piece patch and you get attention from LEOs. The M/C's you listed are all under the watchful eyes of law enforcement.
    You mention that biker violence is either romanticized or ignored. I would add that it is also blown way out of proportion too. I have known and ridden with some of these 1% barbarians you so broadly generalize and have found that many of them are blue collar working stiffs. Maybe they live a little faster and wilder than most and club life comes at considerable cost, but I know that if I ever needed anything those guys would move heaven and earth to help me out. You say that many 1%ers are convicted felons, well I would suggest that even more aren't. Of course there is no data to back either claim up.

    Why don't we let the justice system work it out and not engage in yellow journalism. The same sensationalism you are engaging in is the same attitude that anti-gun types paint all of us with. Not all gun toters are criminals. Not all clubbers are clownish thugs. Life is not black and white.
    +1
    I have very fond memories of some 1%ers. When I lived in Maryland I was a member of ABATE. I was also a member of the Blue Knights. Some of the other guys were members of other clubs. I rode a Gold Wing. Yes, they teased me about it a bit but it was all good spirited. They knew I worked for the local PD, and never did anything shady in my presence. We did some great toy runs, had some great times and always treated each other with respect.

    One of the most surreal experiences in my life was the funeral of the fiance of one of our desk clerks. The deceased had been a Pagan. Picture if you will, about a hundred Pagans in their colors mingling with about two hundred cops, including executive staff, all wearing dress uniforms. Nobody was loud, rude, or in any way inappropriate. We were all there to support our friend in her time of need and to remember the man she loved.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Being an LEO in an area heavily populated with a notorious biker gang, I have to agree with this. Yeah, they are into some criminal activity, but I'd much rather deal with a biker vs. any other 'ganster' type. At least they have a little honor and understand what respect really is. Most of the time you can simply reason with them and they'll cuff themselves up if needed. Not to mention they are pretty good about policing themselves.
    +1 have dealt with several of them while working as a parole officer. They have an ingrained sense of honor and pride. They are usually very respectful to a point and much easier to deal with than other types of gangs.
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