Campus Shootings

This is a discussion on Campus Shootings within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; There's a shooting on a college campus and a couple of young adults are killed. Even if none are, what do you think should be ...

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Thread: Campus Shootings

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    Ex Member Array Kieth's Avatar
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    Campus Shootings

    There's a shooting on a college campus and a couple of young adults are killed. Even if none are, what do you think should be done to make the campus safer? Do you think anything can be done?
    Last edited by JD; October 5th, 2010 at 11:56 PM. Reason: Removed random link.

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    VIP Member Array automatic slim's Avatar
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    Concealed carry has made the country safer. It needs to be extended to our college campuses where all these mass shootings occur. Murderers know the police response time and tactics, gives them several minutes to kill as many as they can. They need to be challenged and confronted and taken out ASAP.
    "First gallant South Carolina nobly made the stand."
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    I strongly agree with automatic slim

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    I have never understood the thinking of "criminal safe zones". I would like to see the same gun laws for ALL school Kdg to college...just like in UT.
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    VIP Member Array zacii's Avatar
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    The standard mathematical formula is: more guns=less crime; less guns=more crime.

    Therefore, the sum of the equation is: let people be armed as is their inalienable right granted by their creator, and consequently reduce crime at the same time.
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

    "A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source

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    Distinguished Member Array skysoldier29's Avatar
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    I am all for arming normal citizens IOT protect themselves and their families. I'm even for arming college students so they can protect themselves on campus with the understanding that they are not heros and that their only obligation is to get someplace safe. I say this because of a debate I had with some fellow classmates a few years back about allowing students to conceal carry on campus. I had multiple guys in the class stand up that if there was a shooting that they would be able to go out and end it, which is a bunch of crap because these wanna be frat boys would likely piss their pants if faced with mortal danger. I know I did the first time that mortar when over my head in Iraq. I also had a guy from the Florida National Guard and that he had the training to stop a threat. Thinking to myself this guy is going to kill everyone around him but the bad guy. Not to mention that the cops will likely get a report from someone that there is a second gunman in the area and the cops will likely in confusion shoot them as well. I know if I was an officer responding to the VT shooting for example and I saw a guy with a gun running around he has exactly half a second to drop that weapon before I start shooting. Normal citizens do not posses the skills needed to respond to an active shooter situation this includes from my experience normal patrol LEOs and a vast majority of active and reserve military. Up until the last few assignments I have had within the Army, I never received any close quarters combat or active shooter training to say that I have the skills necessary to effectively stop an active shooter threat. Even now that I have received additional training in these fields I'm still not going to do something unless my life is in imminent danger because I don't want to get confused with being a BG. So I am all for allow Jane Doe college cutie to carry on campus to give her a piece of mind and the ability to stop someone from harming them, along with allowing John Doe student to pack to allow him the protection needed to get from campus to his car after a late night class. But there needs to be rules or some sort of additional training to ensure they understand the unique situations and how to handle them if a campus shooting does happen.

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    VIP Member Array SpencerB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by automatic slim View Post
    Concealed carry has made the country safer. It needs to be extended to our college campuses where all these mass shootings occur. Murderers know the police response time and tactics, gives them several minutes to kill as many as they can. They need to be challenged and confronted and taken out ASAP.
    Completely agree

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    See it from another angle

    We are not letting "college students" carry handguns. We have a class of citizens who are already trained, licensed, and experienced with weapons. They carry concealed everywhere else around the state. We are simply allowing CCW holders to also carry while they are on campus. When you think of it that way it is bizarre that we deny CCW holders the rights to protect themselves and the people around them.

    To me it seems that faculty and students who oppose CCW on campus are narcissist in thinking that campus is special. Special..just like everyone else.

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    Member Array The Dark's Avatar
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    This is a little thing I wrote as a letter to the local paper, although I figured I'd lose my job one way or the other if it ever got published.

    As an employee of a large public university, I was amused by a recent story on training students and staff to react to a shooter on campus. The guidance came down to run, hide, spread out, and throw things. None of these are self-defense, but are passive means to try to make the shooter target someone else; they may protect individual lives, but not save lives in general. They are, sadly, all that current campus policy allows in most cases. What should also have been noted was the fact that a vast majority of campuses are target-rich and self-defense impoverished environments. We are thousands of defenseless targets crammed onto a campus and any shooter knows that the only other armed force on campus is the police. History tells us that most shooters only stop when they are killed, either by themselves or by law enforcement officers and then only after they have committed an atrocity. History and common sense also tell us that law enforcement officers are destined to arrive after the carnage is underway or has ended, so tragedy is inevitable. It is an unfortunate reality that police cannot protect us from crime and, in the case of such campus shootings, any potential deterrent effect of capture and punishment disappears when the perpetrator intends to die anyway. So, if we are lucky, the police might halt crime in progress, but are even more likely to be limited to investigating, making arrests or assigning culpability after the deed is done. This is not a good scenario for individual survival and as a potential victim I take no solace in thinking that my attacker might be caught after the fact. I do not want punishment, I want prevention or protection. I was in an auditorium with 200 students during a campus lockdown a year ago. They looked to me to defend them and I would have, to the best of my ability, but as a veteran I know how futile a battle between an armed assailant and a man with a briefcase would be. If I am ever assaulted or killed on campus in a situation where the use of my lawfully-concealed firearm (the one I wear at all other times, but is at home in the safe due to campus policy) could have saved lives, I hope my survivors and those of any other victims will test out this policy in court.
    "To predict the behavior of ordinary people in advance, you only have to assume that they will always try to escape a disagreeable situation with the smallest possible expenditure of intelligence." Friedrich Nietzsche

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