Hollow points are controversial - CNN

This is a discussion on Hollow points are controversial - CNN within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by gasmitty By the 1980s, three decades ago, American law enforcement had nearly universally adopted expanding-bullet ammo, and withstood ACLU challenges as to ...

Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 77

Thread: Hollow points are controversial - CNN

  1. #31
    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    420
    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    By the 1980s, three decades ago, American law enforcement had nearly universally adopted expanding-bullet ammo, and withstood ACLU challenges as to its alleged brutality.
    Can you point me to a link or news story about the ACLU's challenge of hollow point bullets, and on what basis it was made?

    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    It's only "controversial" if the news station is trying to hype-up a drive-by shooting of a somewhat known (?) celebrity...

    I wonder what an idiot TV reporter would say if told that most/all LEOs carry HP/JHP ammo....
    There is a controversy regarding hollow point bullets. Should there be? No. But to deny there is one is ridiculous. The reporter didn't say anything wrong or inaccurate. They reported what police sources said. They said nothing incorrect about hollow point bullets, nor did they take a side on the controversy, they only mentioned its existence.

    This doesn't belong on the long and sorry list of dumbest gun-related things written by a journalist.

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #32
    Member Array KSCarry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    412
    HP is just a nice hot button word to attract those unfamiliar with guns and capture more page views. However it's certainly correct that HP is still controversial for civilians, just like concealed carry. Unless things have changed since my last research efforts, they are still illegal for civilian use in NJ.

  4. #33
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    7,653
    Every bullet is made to 'kill' and do damage. End of story.
    I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
    Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."

  5. #34
    Senior Moderator
    Array HotGuns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    14,845
    Much adieu about nothing.

    Whether I kill ya with a hollopoint or a softpoint makes no difference.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


    AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
    Like custom guns and stuff? Check this out...
    http://bobbailey1959.wordpress.com/

  6. #35
    Moderator
    Array gasmitty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Gilbert, AZ
    Posts
    10,178
    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    Can you point me to a link or news story about the ACLU's challenge of hollow point bullets, and on what basis it was made?
    No, I only am aware of that anecdotally because I paid close attention during the active controversy over several years. There aren't that many Internet links to news articles that weren't front-page news in the 80s, but - shouldn't be hard for a resourceful person to find.

    No one is denying a controversy over hollow point ammo, only why it is being resurrected after so many years after being put to rest.
    Smitty
    NRA Endowment Member

  7. #36
    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    420
    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    No, I only am aware of that anecdotally because I paid close attention during the active controversy over several years. There aren't that many Internet links to news articles that weren't front-page news in the 80s, but - shouldn't be hard for a resourceful person to find.
    I'm guessing no one is going to find that. It sounds like the typical demonizing urban legend often attached to people or groups that other people don't like.

    No one is denying a controversy over hollow point ammo, only why it is being resurrected after so many years after being put to rest.
    No controversy was resurrected. The story stated a fact: hollow point ammo is controversial. That is correct. It's a stupid and empty controversy, but it's still a controversy.

  8. #37
    Senior Moderator
    Array HotGuns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    14,845
    The story stated a fact: hollow point ammo is controversial. That is correct. It's a stupid and empty controversy, but it's still a controversy.
    I disagree.

    Its only a controversy to people that are ignorant.
    To people that know better, there is no controversy.

    I'd be willing to be that any controversy over it is somewhat limited to those regions that are known to be antigun.

    Talking that crap down here would get one laughed at.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


    AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
    Like custom guns and stuff? Check this out...
    http://bobbailey1959.wordpress.com/

  9. #38
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    new york
    Posts
    1,291
    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    I disagree.

    Its only a controversy to people that are ignorant.
    To people that know better, there is no controversy.

    I'd be willing to be that any controversy over it is somewhat limited to those regions that are known to be antigun.

    Talking that crap down here would get one laughed at.
    OP> I think a lot of people are ignorant about much to do with self-defense; they're not bad because of that, we're all ignorant of whole areas also; it's a fact, and I posted the story as an example. The significance is that "community standards" end up directly or otherwise influencing the application of the law. And any self-defense actions are a legal matter. And we're involved in self-defense. Draw the conclusions you wish.

  10. #39
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Kommie-fornia-stan
    Posts
    7,046
    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    There is a controversy regarding hollow point bullets. Should there be? No. But to deny there is one is ridiculous. The reporter didn't say anything wrong or inaccurate. They reported what police sources said. They said nothing incorrect about hollow point bullets, nor did they take a side on the controversy, they only mentioned its existence.

    This doesn't belong on the long and sorry list of dumbest gun-related things written by a journalist.
    Where does this alleged controversy exist?? Among which circles of learned professionals (vs the tripe served by "news" media) do these kinds of discussions happen??

    It's like saying... "Going out to dinner? Watch out, American people, there is a guy in the back trained to use sharp knives...Who is he? and Why is he in the back? News at 11...Also, water is still wet"
    Magazine <> clip - know the difference

    martyr is a fancy name for crappy fighter
    You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know

  11. #40
    Senior Member
    Array babarock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Dacula, GA
    Posts
    576
    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    It's like saying... "Going out to dinner? Watch out, American people, there is a guy in the back trained to use sharp knives...Who is he? and Why is he in the back? News at 11...Also, water is still wet"
    Not to mention he has unregulated access to dihydrogen monoxide.

  12. #41
    VIP Member
    Array Hopyard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Disappeared
    Posts
    11,598
    Quote Originally Posted by babarock View Post
    Not to mention he has unregulated access to dihydrogen monoxide.
    Oh my G-d. You know all that hydrogen is the most powerful reducing agent around. Dangerous stuff indeed.

  13. #42
    VIP Member
    Array OldVet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    S. Florida, north of the Miami mess, south of the Mouse trap
    Posts
    15,961
    I concluded that there is no intelligence in the news media after a local reporter said the deceased homeowners were found "passed out dead." I surely hope the deceased regained consciousness before being embalmed.
    Retired USAF E-8. Remember: You're being watched!
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

  14. #43
    Member Array torgo1968's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    420
    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    I disagree.

    Its only a controversy to people that are ignorant.
    To people that know better, there is no controversy.
    In other words, there is a controversy. I didn't say there was a controversy with knowledgeable people. I said there was a controversy and though you claim to disagree, you then admitted there is one.

    I'd be willing to be that any controversy over it is somewhat limited to those regions that are known to be antigun.
    And again you mention the controversy that you also say doesn't exist.

    Talking that crap down here would get one laughed at.
    Yes it would. It's still a controversy. If you went to a forum populated by biologists and tried to argue intelligent design bull crap, you'd get laughed at. It is still accurate to say that evolution is "controversial", not because there is anything to the controversy (there isn't) but because one exists, no matter how stupid those who keep it alive are.

    Quote Originally Posted by SIGguy229 View Post
    Where does this alleged controversy exist?? Among which circles of learned professionals (vs the tripe served by "news" media) do these kinds of discussions happen??
    You guys aren't paying attention. The issue isn't whether or not the controversy is legitimate or who gives it life. The fact is, many ignorant people think that HP bullets are cop killing, exploding in the body, banned by the Shriner's convention, devil weapons. They are wrong. The media is usually wrong. But in this news story, all the reporter said was that they were controversial, which is correct.

    It's like saying... "Going out to dinner? Watch out, American people, there is a guy in the back trained to use sharp knives...Who is he? and Why is he in the back? News at 11...Also, water is still wet"
    It's nothing like that. To match your analogy, the story would have had to make claims about HP bullets that were sensationalized or inaccurate. It didn't. HP bullets do expand upon entry. And they are controversial.

  15. #44
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Gulf Coast of Florida
    Posts
    9,340
    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    Boy, I thought we were long past the hollow point ammo discussion. Must we drag this up again? HPs are only "news" to those who are unaware and uninterested in guns and shooting, which lamentably describes a lot of people in the news media. To most of the rest of us, HP ammo is simply de rigueur and frankly, old hat. By the 1980s, three decades ago, American law enforcement had nearly universally adopted expanding-bullet ammo, and withstood ACLU challenges as to its alleged brutality.

    Since the OP is "hamlet," I'll paraphrase Polonius's advice - "to thine own defensive ammo be true."
    As we saw in the story posted last week about the man who defended himself in his driveway against 3 people (2 women and a man) and used his firearm, he went to trial twice. In the jury selection process, they eliminated anyone who owned firearms. That being the case, it seems likely that you would be facing a jury that is unaware of such matters. I thought about this as I travelled and carried a snub .38 in my weak side pocket and a semi-auto .40s&w IWB strong side. If in a justified defense sitation I had to use a firearm, could a liberal anti-gun overzelous DA use this against me to a jury of non-gun-owners? Probably. Would he be successful? Who knows. Everything from size, type, caliber, capacity, ammo selection, etc. can be scrutinized to the Nth degree...and probably will be.
    Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
    No Guns, No Safety, No Peace.


    Guns are like sex and air...its no big deal until YOU can't get any.

  16. #45
    Ex Member Array hamlet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    new york
    Posts
    1,291
    OP>I'm going to re-post this below because I don't think it was seen and only a few see it's the point of why I posted this story. The purpose was not to take sides in an argument about hollow-point anmo, or call those that don't know about such things every name we can think of, and then do the same with the press. This knee-jerk hostility besides missing the point, is really alienating. Sure way to produce black and white reactions is to engage in black and white actions. The world is gray. Automatically treat everyone like the enemy and you'll have a lot of enemies. What do you expect?

    " I think a lot of people are ignorant about much to do with self-defense; they're not bad because of that, we're all ignorant of whole areas also; it's a fact, and I posted the story as an example. The significance is that "community standards" end up directly or otherwise influencing the application of the law. And any self-defense actions are a legal matter. And we're involved in self-defense. Draw the conclusions you wish. "[/B]

Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Hollow Points ??
    By NDN-MAN in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: March 31st, 2011, 04:42 PM
  2. FS: 40 S&W Hollow Points UMC!!
    By dbraves8 in forum Member Buy, Sell & Trade
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: April 30th, 2009, 04:30 PM
  3. Hollow Points for a Kahr CW-40
    By soulfixinman in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: January 31st, 2009, 03:29 PM
  4. hollow points
    By elrey718 in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
    Replies: 32
    Last Post: August 30th, 2006, 10:10 PM

Search tags for this page

aclu hollowpoint

,

are hollow point bullets illegal in ohio

,
are hollow point bullets illegal in va
,
are hollow point bullets legal in florida
,

are hollow point bullets legal in north carolina

,
controversial nra hollow poin\t
,
hollow point
,
hollow point controversial
,
is carrying hollowpoints bad
,

what is the controversy over hollow point bullets

,

why are hollow points illegal

,
why are muzzle shrouds controversial
Click on a term to search for related topics.