OK City Pharmacy Robbery Murder Trial

This is a discussion on OK City Pharmacy Robbery Murder Trial within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Imminent threat is the name of the game. The perp is lying on the ground, face down and totally incapacitated, as evidenced by the fact ...

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Thread: OK City Pharmacy Robbery Murder Trial

  1. #61
    Distinguished Member Array kelcarry's Avatar
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    Imminent threat is the name of the game. The perp is lying on the ground, face down and totally incapacitated, as evidenced by the fact that the pharmacist walked past him to look for his partmer. When he came back into the pharmacy and fired that last shot he committed murder. Until then, imminent threat and self defense were clear and understandable.

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  3. #62
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    Thread will be re-opened in the next hour or so, need to send out some PMs....

  4. #63
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    Thread reopened, everyone tread lightly regarding what may be construed as illegal activity...

    10. Discussion of illegal activities, except in reporting the actions of others, is not allowed. Discussion for the purpose of promoting these activities may subject the poster to being banned. Admission of illegal activity on your part will be removed. Anyone quoting or referencing deleted or edited posts will have their posts edited/removed as well. In short, DO NOT use this forum to admit to breaking the law, even in your distant past.

  5. #64
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    Get trained, learn your state's use-of-deadly-force Laws, learn about handling confrontations, drawing your weapon, shootings. This guy had every right to defend himself, and did... but he let his emotions get the best of him, you can't do that. Your reaction should be a result on your training, not a result of how you feel (emotions). Now this business owner going to jail for a long time... he let two dirt bags tap into his emotions. Too Bad.

  6. #65
    Distinguished Member Array kelcarry's Avatar
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    Gunsite's last comment said it all. Pharmacist was NOT under control anymore and with a firearm in his hand it was and turned out to be a recipe for disaster. Somewhat similar case in Bluffton , SC on Xmas eve, where brandishing and defense were evident but the accused, after eliminating the threat, stood over his "opponent" and fired a final shot to his head as he looked at the brother and wife (latinos) and said "feliz navidad". Without that final shot, I believe from what I understand the facts to be, he may have faced a difficult time in court but I would have found him not guilty--as long as the initiator (in this case the brandisher) is capable of imminent threat, you have an obligation to defend yourself until the threat is over---that final shot was murder although with all the difficult facts in this case, he will be tried for manslaughter--a much easier case to prove.

  7. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by shockwave View Post
    It's actually a whole lot worse. Ersland shot the robber who was unarmed, hitting him in the head. Justified, no problem. He then chased after the armed punk, unloading the magazine at him. Ersland comes back in, grabs another (loaded) gun, strolls up to the kid on the floor who's both unarmed and immobilized with a gunshot wound to the head and Ersland pounds 5 more rounds into the kid's stomach, killing him. Watch the video if you like.

    What really nails Ersland to the wall here is the way he's just so casual and relaxed about walking across the line from "self-defense" to "murder." We should all support the prosecution in this case because people like Ersland are an extreme threat to our rights to gun ownership. What he does here is exactly what the anti-gun community is worried about. He's the poster-child for confiscation.
    100% agree with Shockwave here.

    When he walks back into the store, calmly walks past the kid who is down with the head wound, calmly walks back and picks up a second gun, calmly walks back to the downed kid and calmly pumps 5 more rounds into his abdomen, he was guilty of murder plain and simple. The threat from this kid was long gone. Is right to use deadly force on him had stopped when he went down with the head wound.

    The jury made the right call.
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  8. #67
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    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
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  9. #68
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    Ersland is what happens to people who believe they are better prepared than they believe they are, who think they can buy skill in the box a gun comes in, who feel that training doesn't offer then anything they don't have already, and that when the time comes they will rise to the situations.

    Don't fall for the trap.

    If you aren't your own worst critic, ruthless with your own self examination as to your preperation for a use of force incident, and willing to accept that you need to do more than what you are doing today to get ready...

    Welcome to fail.

    Better to get your ego crushed by a timer & force on force or stare at the jump rope (Have I mentioned I loathe excercise? Oh...Well...I do...) and say "Oh, no...not again..." than think "I'll be fine..."

  10. #69
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    Given the totality of the circumstances I think the charge, the conviction, and the harsh sentence are all out of line.

    The pharmacist did not go looking for the trouble which found its way to his door. For me, it is that the trouble came to him and not the other way around that counts.

    He didn't handle it well once it got there, and lost his self-control and did something stupid and criminal, but within the overall circumstances I can't agree with the charge or the sentence.

    I don't think the man is any threat to society whatsoever, never was, won't be in the future, and I don't like my tax dollars going to his incarceration for that length of time.

    But then, I'm usually the softy on this board. As with the Anthony case, its the jurors who heard the case that count and not me sitting here at a keyboard second guessing.

    His case is a stern object lesson to all of us.
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  11. #70
    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    If you assert self defense, it's a justification defense. You are saying what you did was right, lawful and reasonable under the circumstances. Part of that is your admission to the prosecution's case in chief, that you did knowingly and willfully cause the death of another person.

    It's all or nothing.

    Had he gone for a temporary insanity/extreme emotional distress defense, it would be that he either didn't know what he was doing, or couldn't appreciate the wrongfullness of his actions. It would either get him a not guilty, or in the event it failed to get him acquitted, get him a lighter disposition upon conviction.

    Ersland apparently rolled the dice on self defense. He lost.

  12. #71
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    Don't worry Hopyard, it is the people of Oklahoma whose taxes are going to be paying for his incarceration. Not us. He broke the law in Oklahoma, was prosecuted and convicted and sentenced in Oklahoma. Didn't cost us Texans a nickel!

    If he hadn't done that little thing about going back and getting the second gun and then shooting the kid all over again he very well might never have been charged.
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  13. #72
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    The two adult master minds behind that robbery were convicted of murder. Both were sentenced to life in prison and additional terms.

    Men Convicted In Pharmacy Robbery Get Life In Prison - Oklahoma City News Story - KOCO Oklahoma City


    Anthony Morrison and Emmanuel Mitchell were convicted in May of the first-degree murder, conspiracy to commit an armed robbery and unauthorized use of a motor vehicle.

    Morrison received life in prison with an additional 35 years. Mitchell received life in prison with an additional 45 years. The two were sentenced at the Oklahoma County Courthouse on Monday.
    Read more: Men Convicted In Pharmacy Robbery Get Life In Prison - Oklahoma City News Story - KOCO Oklahoma City

  14. #73
    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    Ersland is what happens to people who believe they are better prepared than they believe they are, who think they can buy skill in the box a gun comes in, who feel that training doesn't offer then anything they don't have already, and that when the time comes they will rise to the situations.

    Don't fall for the trap.

    If you aren't your own worst critic, ruthless with your own self examination as to your preperation for a use of force incident, and willing to accept that you need to do more than what you are doing today to get ready...

    Welcome to fail.

    Better to get your ego crushed by a timer & force on force or stare at the jump rope (Have I mentioned I loathe excercise? Oh...Well...I do...) and say "Oh, no...not again..." than think "I'll be fine..."
    While I won't disagree that people should get as much training as they can afford in dollars and time. This one case proves very little. There are many more cases which come up every day where "untrained" individuals do just fine and have no consequences of their actions regarding legal use of self defense.

    I am not going to blame this guys actions on lack of training as much as I will lack of proper mindset and knowledge of laws regarding self defense. Then again, he may have been just fed the heck up with people robbing his pharmacy. I don't know the whole story, just the outcome.
    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
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  15. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcp1810 View Post
    Don't worry Hopyard, it is the people of Oklahoma whose taxes are going to be paying for his incarceration. Not us. He broke the law in Oklahoma, was prosecuted and convicted and sentenced in Oklahoma. Didn't cost us Texans a nickel!

    If he hadn't done that little thing about going back and getting the second gun and then shooting the kid all over again he very well might never have been charged.
    Uh, OK. The Sooners will pay not the Texans. That really isn't the point who pays; in the end it is the taxpayers. Don't take everything so dang literally.
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