Poor uninformed kid

This is a discussion on Poor uninformed kid within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Teen who shot WaveRunner thief helped homeless - Miami Shores - MiamiHerald.com...

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Thread: Poor uninformed kid

  1. #1
    Member Array CaptainZippr's Avatar
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    "An armed man is a citizen. A disarmed man is a subject."
    Anon.

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    Police reports said that Muñoz and Lopez, who were on Muñoz’s own WaveRunner, navigated to the rear of the Davis home about 2:30 p.m. Saturday. Muñoz swam toward the Davis’ WaveRunner, which was hoisted just above the water, and began lowering the vessel as Lopez returned to the marina where they planned to hoist the stolen craft onto a trailer and sell it for $2,000, the police affidavit said.
    “The thought of him stealing something is unimaginable,’’ the teacher said
    Really? Hmmm... please refer to the police affidavit, teach.

    Muñoz’s former teacher at Palm Springs Middle School said he was completely deaf in one ear and could only hear booming sounds, such as explosions, from the other ear.
    Wonder if he heard the shotgun go off...
    Smitty
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    VIP Member Array Hiram25's Avatar
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    Sad, but I think the thief got just what he asked for. The girlfriend will pay for her stupidity. The shooter should not be charged, he didn't ask them to break in.
    Hiram25
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    A no good thief is no good,doesn't matter if he has a physical disability or not,I would say if I was gonna bet,that the Girlfriend put him up to it so they could go play on a waverunner.If you feel the need to play on one,you either rent it,have a friend take you out on theirs,or work and buy one.Too bad the kid at 14 will have to deal with taking a life
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    Stealing seems to be a great way of life, but the retirement plans may be a bit disappointing. This thief retired early...
    Crime is crime and it seldom brightens the lives it touches.
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    Senior Member Array Curt58's Avatar
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    As far as I'm concerened, anyone who would do evil things to innocent people deserves to be retired permantly.

    This DEAF MF knew he was doing wrong, and so did his girlfriend.

    A shot the back of the head was a human way to deal with him.
    No pain, no trials, no excuses. Killed in the act of doing evil.

    Sadly this young man will have to deal with being forced to make the right decision.
    What have you done to prepare for the end of civilization as we know it?

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    TVJ
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    I wonder what the situational dynamic was for the homeowners kid to shoot the other kid in the back of the head:

    Just ambush deaf kid perp and bang,
    perp kid retreated/walking away and had stopped stealing then bang,
    perp kid is deaf and didn't respond/stop when shooter demanded it/bang

    Hmm

    If the kid got the drop on perp with his shotgun, i wonder if he had less lethal options to neutralize the threat.

    The homeowners kid went though a home invasion previously that centers on his mother in 2009. The lethality of this situation seems to make sense after that traumatic event and his age/experience.

    If he's on his property and within FL law, then I support his ultimate right to pull the trigger.
    "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men in a society, over the course of time they create for themselves a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that glorifies it."
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    Quote Originally Posted by TVJ View Post
    I wonder what the situational dynamic was for the homeowners kid to shoot the other kid in the back of the head:
    So many shootings where the dead guy was allegedly "shot in the back" are really cases where the one who was shot was in motion (such as turning) when the gun was fired. A local cop out here shot a woman who tried to run him over, and he fired as he jumped out of the way and the car whizzed by him. The shot caught her just aft of the mid-line, but the press all reported it from Day One that she was "shot in the back."

    I wouldn't put much faith in a news report, at least until a coroner's report is available.
    Smitty
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    Senior Member Array rolyat63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TVJ View Post
    I wonder what the situational dynamic was for the homeowners kid to shoot the other kid in the back of the head:

    Just ambush deaf kid perp and bang,
    perp kid retreated/walking away and had stopped stealing then bang,
    perp kid is deaf and didn't respond/stop when shooter demanded it/bang

    Hmm

    If the kid got the drop on perp with his shotgun, i wonder if he had less lethal options to neutralize the threat.

    The homeowners kid went though a home invasion previously that centers on his mother in 2009. The lethality of this situation seems to make sense after that traumatic event and his age/experience.

    If he's on his property and within FL law, then I support his ultimate right to pull the trigger.
    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    So many shootings where the dead guy was allegedly "shot in the back" are really cases where the one who was shot was in motion (such as turning) when the gun was fired. A local cop out here shot a woman who tried to run him over, and he fired as he jumped out of the way and the car whizzed by him. The shot caught her just aft of the mid-line, but the press all reported it from Day One that she was "shot in the back."

    I wouldn't put much faith in a news report, at least until a coroner's report is available.
    Also, Florida's Castle Doctrine makes no distinction. If someone use force to enter and they have no right to be there (summarized) then you can assume they are there to do you harm. Deadly force is allowed if the person using knew they had broken in.

    776.013 Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.—(1) A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:

    (a) The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that person’s will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and
    (b) The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.
    rolyat63
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    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    Never be a thief or burglar if you are deaf ... can't hear warnings, etc.

    Well, unfortunately for many all around, the lesson was relearned..... don't enter people's property to steal, it's a dangerous profession and not worth the risks to your life.
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    mkh
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    I'm surprised how the article downplayed the seriousness of the crime. They called it a "a petty crime ". I don't consider stealing a $2000 vehicle petty.

    Still it is tragic that it had to end this way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mkh View Post
    I'm surprised how the article downplayed the seriousness of the crime. They called it a "a petty crime ". I don't consider stealing a $2000 vehicle petty.

    Still it is tragic that it had to end this way.
    Given that they were going to sell it for $2,000 - hot, it was probably worth more than that if it was not hot.
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    Aside from the event, which is sad anyway, the tone of the article really pisses me off. 3 lives/ families destroyed? No. One person tried to take advantage of another, and paid a stiff price. The idea that there is parity between a kid defending his home and property and a thief is just wrong.

    There is absolutely nothing in the article that even suggests that the theft was anything other than some kind of prank.
    Anybody can get scared, but you must absolutely not let that affect your behavior. Cowardice kills. -Jeff Cooper

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    Distinguished Member Array BigStick's Avatar
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    I was annoyed by the article also. It seems like they spent the whole time trying to humanize and warm the public to the plight of the poor little Robin Hood who was surely going to give the money from the boosted vehicle to the poor. How about some more facts from the situation, or discussion of how him and his gurlfriend have eternally scarred the young 14 year old that now has to live with the fact that he killed someone for the rest of his life.

    Or maybe they didn't want to say anything about the true victim because his dad is a lawyer and anything they wanted to print would have gotten them sued.
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  16. #15
    Senior Member Array Curt58's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by mkh
    I'm surprised how the article downplayed the seriousness of the crime. They called it a "a petty crime ". I don't consider stealing a $2000 vehicle petty.

    Still it is tragic that it had to end this way.


    Quote Originally Posted by ksholder View Post
    Given that they were going to sell it for $2,000 - hot, it was probably worth more than that if it was not hot.
    I was going to say the same thing. That Wave Runner could have cost 4 to 5 times that.
    And so this was no petty theft under $250 dollars.
    This was grand larceny. Clearly he was not stealing a candy bar because he was hungry!

    The fact that he was shot in the back of the head I think is irrelevant.
    After all, we do not know the size and first impression the 20 year old dead thief made.
    Nor do we know the size and first impression the Victim made.
    I have come across people that at first glance are scary as hell.
    Just like I've come across guys that are perceived as no threat at all!
    The 20 year old Bad Guy may very well presented a real threat to the young man that made him fear for his life!

    I can assure you that at 60 years old, I am not going to try and physically restrain a 20 year old man I find committing a major and intentional theft on my property! I’ll shoot him at the first sign of defiance too. I’m too old to fight. And if I kill him then it will be my word and the forensics against his.

    The 14 year old boy was clearly out classed in a fist fight. I wouldn’t want my 14 year old son to try and physically restrain a 20 ear old man. And had he tried to hold the Man for the cops it’s very probably he would have been overpowered and possibly killed with his own gun.
    And as a 20 year old man, he should have been pursuing other forms of entertainment like working for a living instead of stealing for cash. He clearly was there to do an evil deed.

    And so he was killed during the commission of a major crime.

    HE GOT WHAT HE DESERVED.
    Sadly it was at the hands of an apparently naive little boy.

    Take something that doesn't belong to you intentionally and willfully, pay the price.
    This time the price was his life.

    And this time the Taxpayers don't have to support the deaf dead guy for the next 10 years.

    And lastly, if an incident similar to this happened on my land, I assure you my Lawyer would be called for any interview too!
    It’s too easy for an over zealous Official to take case the wrong way.
    What have you done to prepare for the end of civilization as we know it?

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