Disparity of force

Disparity of force

This is a discussion on Disparity of force within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; I just read where our County has had 3 Homicides in 2 days,one of them Involved a younger man beating an older guy to death ...

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Thread: Disparity of force

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Disparity of force

    I just read where our County has had 3 Homicides in 2 days,one of them Involved a younger man beating an older guy to death with his fists,I'm older and physically disabled,so If somebody physically threatens me It could very well put me in fear for my life and if it ever came down to it and I had to use deadly force to stop a physical threat,I would find every homicide article I could that the homicide was committed by blunt force trauma as a result of using their fists,and maybe a weapon like a 2x4 or Brick after victim was incapacitated
    Deputies investigate three murders in two days in Hidalgo County : News : ValleyCentral.com
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .


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    VIP Member Array Hiram25's Avatar
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    There was just an incident where an elderly man was killed by a single blow to the head by a guy playing a game called "Knock Out". So it has been proven that a single blow to the head can kill an elderly individual who is otherwise in healthy condition.

    I myself will soon be 65, retired on a disability pension due to being struck by lightning, I can't fight as well as I did when I was younger, I also have Asthma pretty bad and endurance is hindered by that. I don't look for fights, and will avoid them at all costs, but you know what they say about picking a fight with an old guy!
    Hiram25
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    Member Array MAINE0388's Avatar
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    I dont always agree with disparity of force. Im 23 running about 300lbs and wrestled all through HS. I have also never taken a punch to the head or anywhere for that matter at least not one meant to do damage. With that being said I have no idea what I can and cannot not take. Whats to say that one of these guys playing "knock out" decides to hit me in the back of the head causing me to black out or knock me out. Then im fair game. I belive I havent been in a fight so far simply because I avoid physical altercations the best I can. Say I cant one day and I start to get the mess beat out of me. Im sorry but Im not gonna let someone beat me to death no matter how big I am someone could still deliver damaging blows to the head. I will only take so much beating before I feel deadly force is needed. So does disparity of force apply once I can no longer fend for myself in such a situation?
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAINE0388 View Post
    I dont always agree with disparity of force. Im 23 running about 300lbs and wrestled all through HS. I have also never taken a punch to the head or anywhere for that matter at least not one meant to do damage. With that being said I have no idea what I can and cannot not take. Whats to say that one of these guys playing "knock out" decides to hit me in the back of the head causing me to black out or knock me out. Then im fair game. I belive I havent been in a fight so far simply because I avoid physical altercations the best I can. Say I cant one day and I start to get the mess beat out of me. Im sorry but Im not gonna let someone beat me to death no matter how big I am someone could still deliver damaging blows to the head. I will only take so much beating before I feel deadly force is needed. So does disparity of force apply once I can no longer fend for myself in such a situation?
    I can only say that in the cases of people like Dukalmighty, Hiram25, the disparity of force application will likely be kind of obvious.

    In the case of someone who is 23 and has some bulk and mass, I will say the courts take a dim view and generally frown on people who shoot unarmed assailants. Especially when they come out unscathed and without a mark on them. Just because you have an aversion to getting smacked around a little (and who doesn't), do the courts allow you to go around and shoot anyone who wants to pick a fight.

    Do not misconstrue this as saying, there aren't times when disparity of force can come into play when in the middle of a fight and lethal force becomes justified at a certain point.

    The key is knowing exactly when and how disparity of force comes into play in any given situation. It's not always a cut and dry glaringly obvious thing. But for an example, say you are going to your car with a bag of groceries and you accidentally bump into a woman who is going into the store with her boyfriend. The boyfriend goes nuts and starts egging you on into a fight for dissin' his girlfriend. You apologize emphatically, and say you meant no harm, but that isn't cutting it. He then starts to shove you and causes you to drop your groceries. You try to just back away and all the time apologizing and saying you don't want any trouble. As you bend over to pick up your groceries, he punches you in the side of the head. You see stars, are startled and jump up and try to hit him back. At this point, based on your age, and size, I would say you are still not warranted in employing lethal force against him. You are both young, you may even outweigh him by 20 lbs. You are still on your feet and able to roll with the punches and absorb some blows.

    But say he knocks you down on the ground. And instead of walking away, he proceeds to start kicking you in the face and stomping on you with his boots. You are now trapped on the ground, and your body is unable to absorb the blows because you are against a hard surface. You can not escape and he is stomping you into oblivion. At that point, a disparity of force has clearly been created, and more than likely you will be justified in pulling your gun and using lethal force to repel the continued attack, (which can reasonably be assumed by a jury of you peers to cause grave crippling injury, if not death).


    If you want to learn a lot about disparity of force and how it applies and a variety of situations, I would recommend Massad Ayoob's video Judicious Use of Deadly Force. A two hour video of some of the best lethal force training you'll ever watch for only $35.

    If you can't take Ayoobs, MAG-40 training in person, this two hour video comes straight out of the lecture portion of his LFI-I/MAG-40 program. It's available in DVD format and worth the money. It's information you won't get elsewhere outside of taking one of his shooting courses.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

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