Bad day in Norway - Page 2

Bad day in Norway

This is a discussion on Bad day in Norway within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; I just read on fox news that the gunman on the island had a full 90 minutes to shoot people before the police were on-scene. ...

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  1. #16
    Distinguished Member Array Chaplain Scott's Avatar
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    I just read on fox news that the gunman on the island had a full 90 minutes to shoot people before the police were on-scene. Can you imagine the terror or being unarmed and at the mercy of a madman on a killing spree for an hour and a half??

    The cops took so long because they couldn't find a boat or helicopter to get to the island--the result of unOfficial mind-set of "it-can't happen-here" by the government and law-enforcement officials.
    Scott, US Army 1974-2004

    Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children what it was once like in the United States where men were free.
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  2. #17
    Distinguished Member Array alachner's Avatar
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    There are reports that the gunman used an automatic weapon. Therefore, this would prove that gun control is useless to avoid such tragedies, since the possession of automatic weapons by civilians in Norway and most countries is strictly forbidden.
    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous... If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for?" [Clint Smith - Thunder Ranch]

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaplain Scott View Post
    I just read on fox news that the gunman on the island had a full 90 minutes to shoot people before the police were on-scene. Can you imagine the terror or being unarmed and at the mercy of a madman on a killing spree for an hour and a half??

    The cops took so long because they couldn't find a boat or helicopter to get to the island--the result of unOfficial mind-set of "it-can't happen-here" by the government and law-enforcement officials.
    Unbelievable! Unbelievable! Ninety minutes. One helicopter. One sharpshooter. One dead madman.
    "The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left." Eccl. 10:2

  4. #19
    Distinguished Member Array Chaplain Scott's Avatar
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    Obviously the shooter was insane and/or evil.

    I would not want to be either the organizers of the youth event, nor would I want to be in the Norwegian Law enforcement circles during the after-action-reviews.

    It's obvious that nobody for the youth camp had any kind of realistic security or response plan. I would not want this failure to plan hanging on my conscience for years to come. ANY TIME and ANY WHERE is an axiom that law enforcement and event planners ignore to their and other's peril....
    Scott, US Army 1974-2004

    Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children what it was once like in the United States where men were free.
    - Ronald Reagan

  5. #20
    Member Array PeterCartwright's Avatar
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    It's really hard to get head and heart around this tragedy. Can you imagine being trapped like fish in a barrel while a madman systematically hunts down his victims! And I'm with earlier posters with respect to the stunning 90 minute ordeal. Sounds like some kids were making cell calls early on. 90 minutes without response?!? This adds a whole new dimension to the old saw "when seconds count, police are only minutes away". I need more information to make any sense of this response time thing.

    PC

  6. #21
    Member Array chiefrcd's Avatar
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    No civilian CCW's permited, all guns registered with the police, restrictions on caliber, type and use. Guns locked in police inspected and approved gun safes....yep, they got their gun laws in order....shame it didn't work.
    Just one armed and trained person may have well stop this individual in his tracks before he could slaughter all those people....but I'm preaching to the choir. Long live the 2nd amendment.
    Have Gun ~ Will Carry
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  7. #22
    Member Array Phoenixx6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SFury View Post
    Not only did the shooter dress up like a cop, the majority of people didn't think rationally. They failed to assess the situation and made it worse. I would never have run to anyone in a shooting situation without knowing what was happening to some extent. I guess that's the following the "be prepared" motto of the Boy Scouts I grew up with.

    My father also taught my brother and I to assess situations in case things went bad out in the woods from an early age too. Be aware, and get your game. To be unaware was to not get your game at best, but to accidently harm someone else at worse. To think, I grew up in what was one of the safest nations in the world, and my Father taught me to think first, then act just in case bad things happen. When you hear stories like this, it makes you wonder why more people don't do that.
    I agree with what you say; that they weren't thinking rationally and failed to assess the situation, but I wouldn't have expected them to. The same reactions happened at Columbine and the SWAT teams had to peel children off of their arms and legs while they were trying to move in and neutralize the shooters. Kids are told that the police are your friends and are here to help. They haven't been through trauma of this magnitude so untapped and untrained instincts kick in, all that fight of flight, and they tried to fly to the safety of a policeman. It was a brilliant and horrible strategy for the shooter to dress as the policeman.

    Those who have thought of worse case scenarios and can keep the pressence of mind to assess the situation during a scenario may do better. That is exactly why police and firefighters can go into buildings when everyone else wants out. For the masses, when bullets start flying, the mind may not have time to assess, but just react. When some hear a knock on their door late at night they sit up in bed and ask "who's there?" while others reach for a gun, sit up, and ask "who's there?".

  8. #23
    Distinguished Member Array alachner's Avatar
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    If one person had a firearm among the crowd, many lives would have been spared. It would be amazing if this ever happened and there is a guy on the crowd like Hickok45 who is packing a 1911 or a Glock 17 (not that I wish this to ever happened again...just imagining a scenario). The attack would be stopped quickly I guarantee you that!
    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous... If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid for?" [Clint Smith - Thunder Ranch]

  9. #24
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WHEC724 View Post
    I was just reading that. The horror still hasn't quite sunk in with me yet.

    My son just got back from his first week at camp. I just have to leave these things in the Lord's hands.
    Yeah and I'm sure some of the parents of those kids said the same thing before...

    edit:
    I don't even have kids yet and I wouldn't even think of sending them off to a camp or anything else without verifiable proof that those in charge had in place viable emergency response plans AND I was confident in those leaders abilities to actually FOLLOW said plans effectively.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the crap out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

  10. #25
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Now what's going to happen is more tragedy. Farmers are going to have a heck of a time getting fertilizer from now on. Legitimate legal gun owners are going to go the way of the dodo and more knee-jerk reactions like the one with the poor bugger arrested for the pocket knife when their PM showed up.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the crap out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

  11. #26
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    Norway Suspect Ordered Held, Warns of 2 More Cells - FoxNews.com

    So much disturbing info in this news article.

    Suspects can only be held for 4 weeks, must go before Judge to have detainment extended. BTW the maximum sentence for any crime is 21 years. Lets hope they have consecutive sentencing.

    He kills fellow Norwegians/Europeans to influence a revolution against Muslims.

    The Norwegian court took the very unusual step of closing the hearings before they even started.

    A step-brother to a Norwegian princess was killed on the island. He was an off duty police officer working a security detail. Note that most LEOs in Norway are unarmed. This has huge implications for political, legislative and law enforcement change.

    Shooter's father is a former diplomat, who cut off all contact with the shooter at age 16.

    Dr. Colin Poole, head of surgery at Ringriket Hospital in Honefoss northwest of Oslo, told The Associated Press that the gunman used special bullets designed to disintegrate inside the body and cause maximum internal damage. Poole said surgeons treating 16 gunshot victims have recovered no full bullets.
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

    Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
    Paramedics With Guns Scare People!

  12. #27
    Senior Member Array SFury's Avatar
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    Wow, I didn't see that most LEOs are unarmed in Norway. That defies all sorts of logic.

  13. #28
    Member Array TheGiant's Avatar
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    Surgeon-says-gunman-fired-dum-dum-bullets

    Why is this even part of the story? He killed people didn't matter if he used an ax or arrows. Those poor souls had no chance.

    Surgeon-says-gunman-fired-dum-dum-bullets

  14. #29
    Senior Member Array SFury's Avatar
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    I wonder if there will be a push to ban HP ammo here in the US now. Seeing as it's the most effective SD rounds, and one of the most humane hunting rounds in existence. I really hope it doesn't become another issue to argue with overly liberal minded people who don't get it.

    Another useless battle I don't want to fight. Sometimes you can't overcome a free willed individual that wants to cause harm. Not in time anyways.

  15. #30
    VIP Member Array packinnova's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paramedic70002 View Post
    Norway Suspect Ordered Held, Warns of 2 More Cells - FoxNews.com

    So much disturbing info in this news article.

    Suspects can only be held for 4 weeks, must go before Judge to have detainment extended. BTW the maximum sentence for any crime is 21 years. Lets hope they have consecutive sentencing.

    He kills fellow Norwegians/Europeans to influence a revolution against Muslims.

    The Norwegian court took the very unusual step of closing the hearings before they even started.

    A step-brother to a Norwegian princess was killed on the island. He was an off duty police officer working a security detail. Note that most LEOs in Norway are unarmed. This has huge implications for political, legislative and law enforcement change.

    Shooter's father is a former diplomat, who cut off all contact with the shooter at age 16.
    Well I hate to put any of this on anyone other than the shooter, but this does kinda go hand in hand with the old saying:
    Don't go to stupid places with stupid people to do stupid things!
    Labour Party Youth camp? What exactly is the Norwegian Labour party all about? STRONG social/welfare state. So basically they're sending their kids off to learn to be better socialists which in turn makes them a target for nutters. I'm just sayin... Can you imagine the uproar if the libtardal media here got wind of a FoxNews Ultra-conservative anti-socialism Youth Camp here in the US? Every nut from the ACORN tree would be plotting something.
    "My God David, We're a Civilized society."

    "Sure, As long as the machines are workin' and you can call 911. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, and you scare the crap out of them; no more rules...You'll see how primitive they can get."
    -The Mist (2007)

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