August 3rd, 2011 07:14 PM
August 3rd, 2011 07:19 PM
Warning shots are a horrible idea just based on what they are, a shot taken to miss its intended target on purpose. Shoot it in the air who knows where or what it will come down on, shoot it into the ground who knows where it will land once it bounces off of the pavement or dirt. That guy should have thought a little before doing that. When you carry you aren't supposed to draw unless you FULLY intend on shooting your target and it has escalated to the point of life or death. Warning shots indicate a lack of certainty of weather or not it is life or death! Just my educated 2 cents on the topic. (awaiting hire on a local PD)
August 3rd, 2011 07:38 PM
August 3rd, 2011 07:46 PM
I'm curious, is the homeowner endowed with unusual powers? How did he know this dude was unarmed? Just going home cutting through a fenced in yard and looking under tarps? This guy will get shot in the proper manner before long!
You can educate ignorance, you can't fix stupid
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August 3rd, 2011 09:52 PM
Had this been in TX, things may have been treated differently.OMO
Last edited by RETSUPT99; August 4th, 2011 at 05:07 PM.
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August 3rd, 2011 10:00 PM
I fire warning shots. It just happens that my gun is aimed center-mass when I pull the trigger...
"Rock and load, lock and roll... what's it matter? FIRE!!"
"Gun control means hitting your target every time."
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August 3rd, 2011 10:03 PM
I agree with retsupt99. Also with the post before that.
Really? he KNEW? To say that someone KNEW something is a strong statement.
He was armed. He knew Mr. Gonzalez was unarmed. He should have just left the scene if he felt he was threatened and waited for police to arrive," said Batterson.
And lets talk about this: "so and so does not deny looking under a tarp at some bikes in a fenced in backyard?! I would have been as mad as a hornet if I had had reports of scum in my neighborhood and came home to this guy "taking a short cut". Although warning shots are a bad idea, I think the police chief needs to take a good hard look at this with his common sense glasses on before trying to charge this guy with a Felony.
August 3rd, 2011 10:41 PM
Homeowner shouldn't have fired a warning shot but he does not deserve a felony rap for it.
"Was there no end to the conspiracy of irrational prejudice against Red Ryder and his peacemaker?"
Revolvers, “more elegant weapons for a more civilized age.”
August 3rd, 2011 10:53 PM
Well, from my personal experience there are some circumstances where it works.
Originally Posted by Kahnkem
A long story.
About 43 years ago.
I still have the newspaper clipping in a scrap book but I don't feel like taking the time to hunt it up tonight but it happened in 1968 or '69.
There was a peeping tom in our neighborhood, which was one of the better (the best) residential neighborhoods in town.
My daughters had been spooked several times by noises at our doors but the guy was always gone by the time I got up.
One night I was sick with some sort of intestinal bug. Early in the spring, cold outside. I got up and as I walked by the window next to the bed, I saw this guy peeking in the window of the next door neighbor.
He was like superman. Adrenalin to his eyebrows. He would look in the window next to our house and then zoom around to the back side of the neighbor's house so fast and so light on his feet that it was unreal. He made a couple of trips like that before I could get some clothes on.
So I slipped out a door on the opposite side of our house and came around the house to confront him but he was gone.
Cold, stomach bug; so I started shaking with a chill and had to go back in the house and cover up.
That scene got to me. For one year, I slept with one eye open. Every hour or so, I would get up and look out the window.
Finally one hot summer night, I looked out the window, about 1:30 AM and there he was!
Looking in the next door window, the same window as a year before.
I told my ex to not move, not even look out the window, not make a sound until she heard me challenge him and then call the cops. Long before 911. In those days you dialed zero and asked the operator for the cops.
So I slipped out the door on the opposite side of the house, same as the year before, and eased around the house.
There was a large dense hedge between the two houses and when I looked out the widow all I could see was his head and shoulders.
I knew where there was a break in the hedge and I planned to slip through it and then challenge him with: "Don't move or I'll shoot!".
Well, when I slipped through the break in the hedge and confronted him, maybe within 10 or 12 ft. of him, I saw that he was stark naked!
It went through my mind like a flash "I wouldn't be caught dead like this"...so I knew he would run. But I was primed to say it so I blurted out "Don't e or I will..." and he took off like you would not believe.
Well, I had a hunting buddy that always said when you are running game with dogs scare the game and they will make a mistake.
So I took off after him, let out a blood curdling Rebel Yell and fired my .38 in the air. Not at the ground because we were on a paved driveway and it would have ricochet.
He hit a higher gear.
I had been on the university track team about 20 years before that and I thought I was till in pretty good shape because I did a lot of running dogs and following them on foot.
But that guy was running so fast that he was out of sight when I got to the end of the driveway.
Long story and I will skip a lot of the details, but the bottom line is that I scared him so bad that he ran off without his clothes.
And where were they? Under my eldest daughter's window.
We caught him. We tried him. The cops heard the full story, I told it to the judge and there were no repercussions about my firing the .38. Of course, it helped that the captain of detectives was a good friend.
the judge thought it was a very funny story.
We convicted him.
I have a CCW and I know what the law is in my state. However there are times when a warning shot is a good idea. One just has to have the ability to do the right thing at the right time.
That guy was so quick no one else had ever been able to catch him. But I scared him so bad that he had only one thing on his mind and his clothes were not that thing.
August 3rd, 2011 10:57 PM
Is there ever a situation that justifies a warning shot? Maybe.
Let's say you wind up for whatever reason amid some kind of street party deal, some kind of flash-gang situation where there's more of them than you have rounds available. And, in this situation, we're talking your typical street trash types ("what are you looking at?" "Don't you disrespect me!" etc.).
And if you read that situation right, it could be the sort of situation where a shot fired could cause everyone around to go running for cover like cockroaches. That could be a whole lot better than dealing with a gunshot wound victim situation.
So, there's that. Now, here we have a homeowner confronting some kind of ne'er-do-well in the backyard. It's hard to see what a warning shot is going to do that just presenting a firearm won't accomplish.
In fact, I'm not even sure a firearm presentation is called for here. A verbal challenge, sure.
"It may seem difficult at first, but everything is difficult at first."
August 3rd, 2011 11:44 PM
That's exactly what it is. In a nutshell.
Originally Posted by Kahnkem
"The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."
August 3rd, 2011 11:56 PM
Why the hell would you tell the cops it was a warning shot? I would have said he tried to gain access to my house and I was scared so I shot and must have missed.
They would have let the home owner off scott free.
"I believe that the right of the citizen to keep and bear arms must not be infringed if liberty in America is to survive." - Ronald Reagan
August 3rd, 2011 11:56 PM
In my case, there was no doubt about life or death. That was not the question at all.
Originally Posted by Bark'n
The question and the purpose was how to scare the guy so bad that he would be caught.
I admit that will not always work.
But it should work on a guy with no clothes in the middle of the best residential area in town!
You have a guy running down the street, all the way home in fact, naked. Cops coming to the scene, lights coming on all over the place and people looking out to see what is happening....
Makes it hard on a guy running down the street with no clothes.
Maybe I should have said that it makes it a little tough on a guy running down the street with no clothes....
August 4th, 2011 12:51 AM
Most likely it's not the chief making the issue, but the city politicians / prosecutor etc. I work in Marshalltown and in Iowa, while reasonable force, including deadly force can be used to protect property, unless being forced to retreat from your home, business etc. you need to take another option if a safe one exists. Dropping the hammer on a guy in the back yard posing no immediate threat is a no-go here.
Originally Posted by Ianator
He fired after the guy ran, odds are the guy wasn't even in his yard when the shot was fired. Everyone repeat after me LYING TO THE POLICE IS BAD!
Originally Posted by tangoseal
Bottom line, he was not in imminent danger and the use of lethal force does not meet Iowa's requirements for legal use.
August 4th, 2011 01:13 AM
I don't believe this other guy was just passing thru and just happened to look under the tarp. I don't think anyone is going to buy that story. I don't like seeing the homeowner being charged with anything.
We had a 'peeping Tom', and the police had a good idea who it was... but couldn't catch him at it ... to arrest him. He was visiting my daughters window a lot during one summer, so I talked to the Police Chief who I knew well and told him what I had in mind.... he liked the idea.
Originally Posted by oldcurmudgeo
So, when he showed up one night.... I had my .38 starter pistol all loaded..... called them, they would get on the other end of the street since he always took off down that alleyway, and NOT come to my house. Like running a fox to the hounds.
I saw him out there, went out the door real fast..... yelled out and cussed him ... telling him I'ld shoot ..... and then began unloading the starter gun. The police were sitting there in the dark, waiting for him at the end of the alleyway. After they caught him, one came by to let me know.... and he couldn't quit laughing (belly laughter, about rolling on the ground, tears in his eyes, etc) ..... he said the guy kept yelling at them to protect him, because "some SOB down there is trying to kill me" and quite willingly jumped into the patrol car for protection. He admitted to them that he was the one who had been going around the area peeking thru windows at night.
I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers ---
Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."
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