82 year old man shoots and kills burglar

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Thread: 82 year old man shoots and kills burglar

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    Member Array ponchsox's Avatar
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    82 year old man shoots and kills burglar


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    Member Array ponchsox's Avatar
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    While the burglar never entered the house, the police chief claimed it was within his right of "castle doctrine."

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    Distinguished Member Array Fitch's Avatar
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    Doesn't look, no view of what or who he is shooting, heard a knock on the door, and shoots through the door? That isn't a good shoot IMO. Could have been a neighbor telling him there was a fire, could have been any number of innocent reasons to knock on the door. The police are being forgiving because it was someone they think is a bad guy, but it doesn't seem right to me.


    Fitch
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    VIP Member Array chiefjason's Avatar
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    I think there is a difference between the sound of "trying to get in" and "trying to get your attention".

    "Chitwood said the intruder was wearing a stocking ski mask and gloves, and had a hammer, screwdriver and flashlight. The side door showed evidence of being pried."

    Sounds like more than an innocent knock, and sounds like he was attempting to open the door. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.


    The money quote though.


    "Police Chief Mike Chitwood wouldn't disagree, telling a television news crew at the scene the senior did something law enforcement hasn't been able to do, put a suspected burglar out of business."
    ep1953 and bps3040 like this.
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    sgb
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    Quote Originally Posted by ponchsox View Post
    While the burglar never entered the house, the police chief claimed it was within his right of "castle doctrine."
    Mr. Burglar had pried open the door to the enclosed porch and was in the porch prying open the exterior door to the residence.

    776.013Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.—

    (1) A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:
    (a) The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that person’s will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and
    (b) The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.
    (2) The presumption set forth in subsection (1) does not apply if:
    (a) The person against whom the defensive force is used has the right to be in or is a lawful resident of the dwelling, residence, or vehicle, such as an owner, lessee, or titleholder, and there is not an injunction for protection from domestic violence or a written pretrial supervision order of no contact against that person; or
    (b) The person or persons sought to be removed is a child or grandchild, or is otherwise in the lawful custody or under the lawful guardianship of, the person against whom the defensive force is used; or
    (c) The person who uses defensive force is engaged in an unlawful activity or is using the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle to further an unlawful activity; or
    (d) The person against whom the defensive force is used is a law enforcement officer, as defined in s. 943.10(14), who enters or attempts to enter a dwelling, residence, or vehicle in the performance of his or her official duties and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with any applicable law or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known that the person entering or attempting to enter was a law enforcement officer.
    (3) A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
    (4) A person who unlawfully and by force enters or attempts to enter a person’s dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle is presumed to be doing so with the intent to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence.
    (5) As used in this section, the term:
    (a) “Dwelling” means a building or conveyance of any kind, including any attached porch, whether the building or conveyance is temporary or permanent, mobile or immobile, which has a roof over it, including a tent, and is designed to be occupied by people lodging therein at night.
    (b) “Residence” means a dwelling in which a person resides either temporarily or permanently or is visiting as an invited guest.
    (c) “Vehicle” means a conveyance of any kind, whether or not motorized, which is designed to transport people or property.
    History.—s. 1, ch. 2005-27.
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    Member Array ponchsox's Avatar
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    Thanks for the explanation. He was clearly in the process of entering the home.

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    Distinguished Member Array Fitch's Avatar
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    I stand corrected, he was definitely in the process of entering the house. The guy had a mask and tools. The shooter never saw any of that though, was going by sound.

    He may have been within the law to shoot but I'm still not comfortable with the idea of shooting an unseen villen through a door that hasn't been breeched yet, but that could just be me.

    Fitch
    “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety), by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.” by H. L. Mencken

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    Member Array DocPMD's Avatar
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    As a part of the CCW class that I took, the instructor had one of his pro-gun attorneys present some of the material. When he was explaining how the "Make My Day Law" worked (don't use the term castle doctrine here) he gave a good example. A man was home when he heard a window break in the kitchen. Got his weapon and shot the guy. Ruling was that the BG's arm had entered the home, so it was a legal shot. But the attorney pointed out that you would really be living on the edge to rely upon that argument. Much easier to defend the shoot if the BG actually has his feet in the house.

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    If this is the same Police Chief Chitwood who used to be Police Chief in Portland, Maine then I'm glad to see he's still out there telling it like it is. He was a hard edged cop in Maine when I lived there....and it was a sad day when he left the state for another postion out of state. It could be a different guy but it's not like his name is John Smith.

    And congrats to the old guy. But I might not have shot thru the door quite that way. Glad it turned out he was right.
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    sgb
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    One needs to know and abide by the laws of their State, in this case the home owner did so.
    "There is a secret pride in every human heart that revolts at tyranny. You may order and drive an individual, but you cannot make him respect you." William Hazlitt (1778 - 1830)

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    VIP Member Array Sig 210's Avatar
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    Good on the old man. One low-life is worm food.
    RETSUPT99 likes this.

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    Member Array ponchsox's Avatar
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    I believe it is. Chitwood is a no-nonsense police chief and has done a good job cleaning up the streets of Daytona. This city was littered with meth heads and prostitutes. Still ain't Plano but it's getting better.

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    Senior Member Array ep1953's Avatar
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    From the article:

    "I did what I had to do," Charles A. Robbins said of the 6 a.m. shooting. "It was something that needed to be done."


    Another way of saying, "He needed killing"!

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    Member Array dtox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fitch View Post
    "heard a knock on the door"
    I re-read the article and saw no mention of the word "knock".
    Last edited by dtox; January 13th, 2012 at 09:37 PM. Reason: grammar
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    Glad the home owner is safe...another dirtbag who is a dead offender instead of a repeat offender.
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