Shooting at shoplifters

This is a discussion on Shooting at shoplifters within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; What would be considered the difference between a shoplifter and a looter? I wouldn't hesitate to shoot a looter, yet would not shoot (even though ...

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Thread: Shooting at shoplifters

  1. #16
    Member Array Geezer's Avatar
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    What would be considered the difference between a shoplifter and a looter? I wouldn't hesitate to shoot a looter, yet would not shoot (even though they sure deserve it) a shoplifter. Either way, I'd be in deep hillary.

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  3. #17
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geezer View Post
    What would be considered the difference between a shoplifter and a looter? I wouldn't hesitate to shoot a looter, yet would not shoot (even though they sure deserve it) a shoplifter. Either way, I'd be in deep hillary.
    Ok, I don't understand your reasoning. I hope to goodness you are at least talking about someone that is armed. Most looters are just grabbing and running with stuff. You should not shoot unless a threat to you or others. What does the type of theft have to do with it?

  4. #18
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    Any thoughts on how much liability the store owner was exposing himself to since he knew his employee was keeping a gun on the premises? There's been a lot of discussion about carrying at work. Here's an example of what happens when that gets out of hand and probably why few employers welcome the idea.
    "The superior man, when resting in safety, does not forget that danger may come." ~ Confucius

  5. #19
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    It was an emergency side exit that by fire code can not be locked, except for entering.

    I'm betting he will only get a smack on the wrist.

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    If I was the owner I would install an entry with double doors with electric locks after entering outer door must wait in entry way to get buzzed into store,same to get out and if being robbed be able to trap the guy between the doors with everything made out of bullet resistant glass,When thieves realize they can't just walk in and run out they will look for an easier score
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  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    And as far as NYMike's sentiment

    I agree 100 percent. But do not take that to mean that I would ban guns to law abiding citizens. It is just an opinion like "some folks should not have kids". Sometimes folks voice an opinion with out necessarily meaning the Constitution should be changed.
    I am afraid I have to agree. Some people don't have the back ground, experience or common sense to be a responsible gun owner.

    I will use as a example my son in law. He came here from Belgium when he was in his 30s and after jumping through all the hoops for almost 20 years is now a Citizen.
    He is not a bad guy, just different. I don't know if this is the case with most European immigrants, but he just thinks he knows better than most Americans on most subjects (yeah, I know, but then I didn't pick him). He thinks he can get involved in a argument between others and stop it with just his "good heart" and "good intentions".

    This has gotten him into problems like when he thought he would get in between a bickering husband and wife and got a knife drawn on him. He had to make a fast run for the hills.
    As my daughter says, "I can't stop him from this foolishness, I can only put distance between us and make sure his life insurance is paid up. After all I have a child to raise."

    The best was when a rogue Amish farm teen decided to go drinking on New Years. I believe he fell in with bad company. He showed up at a after party breakfast at the local country club and started causing problems and got thrashed. My son in law went over to render aide (which he knows nothing about) by keeping the kid flat when the kid's nose was bleeding. If you know first aide...you know keeping such a person on their back is like "water boarding" them with their own blood.
    The Amish youth (whose size was HUGE) took his legs and kicked the "helpful" Belgium in the chest across the room....breaking several ribs. You would think that would stop him, but nope.

    I am afraid that if he had a CCW he would try to get involved in more thinking he had the method to stop it. He would either have the gun taken from him and used on him OR shoot someone that didn't need to be shot. Thank goodness he doesn't seem interested in firearms. His adult son (who lives here now) and his 9 year old daughter are not like him. The son has a weapon being the manager of a liqueur store in a college town and has the training and common sense lacking in "papa". The 9 year old is in training now for hunting with Grandpa. She is looking forward to her first deer (She loves the deer sausage).

    We don't and won't encourage the son in law with fire arms for his and society's good.

    You see my point. Not everyone should have a gun or CCW. I am quite sure they are not the majority (at least I HOPE not).
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  8. #22
    VIP Member Array tkruf's Avatar
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    Yep, sure made a mistake shooting at a fleeing unarmed petty thief. He should have saved his vigilantism for the next guy that stuck a gun in his face. Then he would have been justified. Blocking the side fire exit would be a fire code violation. Installing doors that you had to be buzzed out, would also be a fire code violation "I believe". Nice thought tho.

    If the lady that followed, got the tag and called it in, then they should have no problem finding the perps.

    Well, I guess now, he won't be able to get a permit, probably not even purchase firearms, if those are felonies.
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  9. #23
    Member Array Geezer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    Ok, I don't understand your reasoning. I hope to goodness you are at least talking about someone that is armed. Most looters are just grabbing and running with stuff. You should not shoot unless a threat to you or others. What does the type of theft have to do with it?
    My reasoning, to most, would be incorrect - but , as an example, take the LA riots after the Rodney King verdict. Those Korean store owners were defending their stores with guns against looters that not only were looting their stores, but burning them when they finished. They were within their rights to do so, and I wish they'd removed a lot of them in the process. But there could be some who say that they were nothing more than shoplifters. Looters need to be shot, shoplifters need to be prosecuted. I'm going to defend what's mine and let the courts sort it out. Here in Texas, it wouldn't be an issue.

  10. #24
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    Yep, not too smart and reckless.

    If he planned to scare, he could have at least had a starter pistol with blanks.

    I didn't think a carry permit was needed for a legally owned gun kept in a business.

  11. #25
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geezer View Post
    My reasoning, to most, would be incorrect - but , as an example, take the LA riots after the Rodney King verdict. Those Korean store owners were defending their stores with guns against looters that not only were looting their stores, but burning them when they finished. They were within their rights to do so, and I wish they'd removed a lot of them in the process. But there could be some who say that they were nothing more than shoplifters. Looters need to be shot, shoplifters need to be prosecuted. I'm going to defend what's mine and let the courts sort it out. Here in Texas, it wouldn't be an issue.
    It is your right in Texas. If they are lootting an you are in your house you are in danger. If they leave, you are not. Yes, I know the laws in Texas. But I guess you are more hardened than me to be able to shoot and kill someone, unarmed, walking away with a TV set. Ever kill someone? It is not cavalier like it is on TV. But, hey, you would be in the right in Texas.

  12. #26
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    It should be legal to shoot thieves.
    paching likes this.
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  13. #27
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    Not a wise decision on the shop owner's part...could be costly for him.
    sgb's idea is worth looking into...
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  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by sgb View Post
    It should be legal to shoot thieves.
    At least a "one shot free pass", either that or a "scare tactic" news bullitin. THIEVES CAN NOW BE FIRED UPON LEGALLY even if all gun owners were mailed a notice not to do so. (sarcasm..funny though).
    Why?? Because at the last second, the Police are minutes away.

  15. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkphillips View Post
    It was an emergency side exit that by fire code can not be locked, except for entering.

    I'm betting he will only get a smack on the wrist.
    Actually, it's not. The store sits on a corner. It has entrances from both streets that it faces.
    "The superior man, when resting in safety, does not forget that danger may come." ~ Confucius

  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    If I was the owner I would install an entry with double doors with electric locks after entering outer door must wait in entry way to get buzzed into store,same to get out and if being robbed be able to trap the guy between the doors with everything made out of bullet resistant glass,When thieves realize they can't just walk in and run out they will look for an easier score
    Imagine your local grocery store arranging the same setup. I'll bet you would be shopping somewhere else the following week.
    "The superior man, when resting in safety, does not forget that danger may come." ~ Confucius

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