Philly -Despite ‘Castle Doctrine,’ defendant is convicted in slaying

Philly -Despite ‘Castle Doctrine,’ defendant is convicted in slaying

This is a discussion on Philly -Despite ‘Castle Doctrine,’ defendant is convicted in slaying within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Despite ‘Castle Doctrine,’ defendant is convicted in slaying It's worse than it sounds. Ex marine who is Ill defends himself....

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Thread: Philly -Despite ‘Castle Doctrine,’ defendant is convicted in slaying

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    Member Array scott625's Avatar
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    Philly -Despite ‘Castle Doctrine,’ defendant is convicted in slaying

    Despite ‘Castle Doctrine,’ defendant is convicted in slaying


    It's worse than it sounds. Ex marine who is Ill defends himself.


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    Distinguished Member Array DontTreadOnI's Avatar
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    If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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    Senior Member Array Chesafreak's Avatar
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    Read the last two paragraphs of the article and you will understand why he was convicted.
    "I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery." - Thomas Jefferson

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    Always, always, always better to try to convince one out of twelve amateurs than one out of one professional jurist.
    DontTreadOnI likes this.
    The hardest thing to explain is the glaringly evident which everybody had decided not to see.
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    Ex Member Array RayBar's Avatar
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    Sometime I'm asked "when will I know if, or,how will I know when I am justified in using deadly force"? My answer is ,You Won't, until after the trial.

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    Ex Member Array oldrwizr's Avatar
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    My CC instructor says, "Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6."

    But before you shoot somebody think about this guy and George Zimmerman. GZ may get off, but would you want to be him right now? The lawyer fees alone would cause me to turn the gun the other way.
    RayBar, Hopyard and msgt/ret like this.

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    Member Array scott625's Avatar
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    I did read the last paragraphs and the thug had a violent history. He was a marine with heart attacks. I give him the benefit of the doubt.

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    Member Array Crashoften's Avatar
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    Either there's parts not being shared or this sounds like an injustice to me. And it sounds like he had a lousy lawyer. Standing over the dying man yelling at him. So what! it's called adrenaline dump, he was attacked and fought them off he's gonna need to yell or hit something. May not have been the smartest thing to do but I couldn't blame him.

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    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
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    We really can't tell anything much from the article. It is possible to stab someone in the back while they are facing you. The article doesn't address why the prosecuting attorney argued that any of the wounds occurred before the defendant was on the ground. It looks like he needed better representation.

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    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chesafreak View Post
    Read the last two paragraphs of the article and you will understand why he was convicted.
    Don't agree... a DA saying that doesn't mean squat.... the witnesses didn't testify they saw that occur. And, in struggle for your life with someone strangling them... it's easy to see how the only place they may be able to stab them may hit them in the back.

    So, those two statements, don't really convince me of anything.... other than what the DA's argument was.

    If he was "guilty" ... then why not 1st or 2nd degree murder ? Sounds to me the Judge felt he needed to find him guilty of something, but it wasn't clearly murder, so he went with the manslaughter. I think it will be appealed, and most likely won on the appeal.

    Also comes across as another case where the Police and DA doesn't want to make the call, and doesn't necessarily support the stand your ground law, so .... they charge them anyway and put it all on the Judge to decide. That's a fairly common practice of DA's, who then .... no matter how it comes out.... can blame the Judge.

    The Stand Your Ground, and Castle Doctrine Laws put the burden of proof on the DA.... to PROVE ... it was NOT self-defense, and the defendant not having to prove it was self-defense. In this case, it reminds me of how the law was..... where the defendant was having to PROVE ... they acted in self-defense. Don't think the "judge" , get's it.... and one of the reasons I think they would win an appeal of the case.
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    VIP Member Array Spirit51's Avatar
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    I agree that the disabled Marine had a crap lawyer, but his actions after the criminal fell of yelling at the guy and trying to stab him again didn't help. I understand it...but it was used against him.

    That is why after a incident....DON'T SAY ANYTHING UNTIL YOU HAVE A LAWYER. And be careful of what you do and say around witnesses.

    If the guy was on top him...I can see how he could have stabbed the criminal a couple of times in the back.

    I really hope this poor man wins on appeal. He shouldn't be found guilty when he was attacked and clearly the victim.

    I hope next time he goes for a trial by jury and not just a judge.
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    Why in the world would you elect NOT to have a jury?

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    VIP Member Array Spirit51's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TumblingFTW View Post
    Why in the world would you elect NOT to have a jury?
    I can only guess that his lawyer gave him bad advice and he thought he would be found innocent because he felt he was the victim. I would bet he thought a "intelligent" man like a judge would see that. That was a mistake. I hope he gets another chance and takes a jury trial. A jury might agree that he WAS the victim.
    A woman must not depend on protection by men. A woman must learn to protect herself.
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    VIP Member Array Spirit51's Avatar
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    The defense needs to bring in experts to explain how emotions run when a intended victim wins against the attacker.

    Bernard Getz had the same problem with things he said after the incident....many of them not factual, but real in his mind.

    There is a reaction that happens after a life and death incident. That is why you keep your mouth shut until a lawyer who is versed in this arrives. The only comment I will make is "I was in fear of my life. Please contact my lawyer" to any and all.
    A woman must not depend on protection by men. A woman must learn to protect herself.
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    A armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one has to back it up with his life.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chesafreak View Post
    Read the last two paragraphs of the article and you will understand why he was convicted.
    That is the interpretation of the judge.

    How would they know where the victim had the opportunity to stave off the attack?
    Maybe stabbing the attacker in the back was his only option?
    Was he jumping up and down taunting like witnesses said, or is that the word of the dead guys buddies?


    Whatever happened to beyond a shadow of a doubt?
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