Man indicted for killing intruder - Page 2

Man indicted for killing intruder

This is a discussion on Man indicted for killing intruder within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by dukalmighty If It was a semi auto then shell casing should be inside the house,revolver and your not going to have the ...

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Thread: Man indicted for killing intruder

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array KBSR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    If It was a semi auto then shell casing should be inside the house,revolver and your not going to have the case as evidence,some gunshots may not bleed out for several seconds or leave any splatter so the perp may have a chance to get outside before leaking any evidence.I guess the DA figures no blood inside he must of been shot outside.
    You're probably right, re the leaking inside, but this mutt was shot 5 times? Even a .22LR would cause him to leak a little bit I think. If the rounds went entirely through him, the spent rounds are there somewhere. A good post-shooting forensic team will find it if they try.

    Of course there is a lot we don't know here. Caliber used would be helpful. What is the homeowners rep with the local police department?

    I know this shouldn't matter, but if he's a dirtbag himself, the cops are just naturally going to be less enthusiastic about doing the proper investigation. Bias you say? Yep. Cops are human too, and if they've had to fight/chase/arrest the homeowner in the past, there may be a little "getting even" going on. Don't know that obviously, but without more facts it's hard to say.
    " But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to yourself... Baa." Col. Dave Grossman on Sheep and Sheepdogs.


  2. #17
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    I hope nothing happens to the guy but.....this is an example of where, unfortunatley, we have to decide in a split second if we are within the law when we discharge a firearm. Of course we will narutally fire first if we honestly beleive our life is in danger. As far as the DA..I don't see where there is reason to speculate that he is doing this for other reasons than he beleive the man is at fault. There were no charges brought to three people the previous year for shooting a BG in the home and a GJ found enough evidence to proceed.

    Hey, I don't like it either but ya know, there is still a chance the man screwed up. Just like a BG's mom always defends the BG though they were not there so will the mom of the GG. She wasn't there either.
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  3. #18
    Member Array Metalman's Avatar
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    The Castle Doctrine in Michigan includes your buildings and grounds as well as your home. My attorney tells me a case could possibly be made that the doctrine could extend beyond your property if someone, for instance, was threatening you with a long gun from some distance.

  4. #19
    Distinguished Member Array DontTreadOnI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBSR View Post
    You're probably right, re the leaking inside, but this mutt was shot 5 times? Even a .22LR would cause him to leak a little bit I think. If the rounds went entirely through him, the spent rounds are there somewhere. A good post-shooting forensic team will find it if they try.

    Of course there is a lot we don't know here. Caliber used would be helpful. What is the homeowners rep with the local police department?

    I know this shouldn't matter, but if he's a dirtbag himself, the cops are just naturally going to be less enthusiastic about doing the proper investigation. Bias you say? Yep. Cops are human too, and if they've had to fight/chase/arrest the homeowner in the past, there may be a little "getting even" going on. Don't know that obviously, but without more facts it's hard to say.
    I have shot deer in the past that have run upwards of fifty yards before spilling a drop of blood.

    There are always exceptions to the norm or logical thought. Always.
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  5. #20
    Senior Member Array KBSR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DontTreadOnI View Post
    I have shot deer in the past that have run upwards of fifty yards before spilling a drop of blood.

    There are always exceptions to the norm or logical thought. Always.
    I have as well, but not five times. I do my best to only have to shoot them once. LOL Wish we knew the caliber used. Would be helpful in this discussion. Maybe the OP can find out.
    " But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to yourself... Baa." Col. Dave Grossman on Sheep and Sheepdogs.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBSR View Post
    I have as well, but not five times. I do my best to only have to shoot them once. LOL Wish we knew the caliber used. Would be helpful in this discussion. Maybe the OP can find out.
    The coverage began here:
    Police identify burglar shot while climbing through window | The Columbus Dispatch
    Where it was stated that the deceased was shot on the second floor after breaking in, and fell to the ground through the window through which he entered. From there, it got to here:
    Police Charge Man 3 Months After He Shot Suspected Intruder | WBNS-10TV Columbus, Ohio
    Where the prosecutor alleges that the deceased had in fact already departed the premises. Number of shots and caliber probably aren't relevant in the prosecutor's assertions. The article did state that the defendant's account of events differed significantly from what the physical evidence indicated.
    Not really knowing the particulars one way or the other, I would re-iterate that this is a great example of why one should keep one's mouth shut until having counsel present after involvement in a lethal force confrontation. Perceptions are warped and blurred, emotions run high and everything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law.

    There is precedence in the willingness of the prosecutor to charge, jail and try with shaky evidence:
    http://www.columbusmonthly.com/Febru.../Derris-Lewis/
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  7. #22
    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBSR View Post
    If the mutt was shot inside the home, there will be forensic evidence to prove that fact. If this is the case, this homeowner will walk. Because the mutt manages to stumble outside before he dies, should have no impact on whether the homeowner is indicted or not. AGREED.


    If he's outside, and he was shot outside, and he was in fact unarmed and presenting no threat to the homeowner, I think it's a coin flip. I'd like to think a decent attorney (not even a good attorney) could win this in court, with a jury. I'll not debate the finer points of the castle doctrine, as it varies from state to state, and I don't live in Columbus, Ohio. AGREED.

    One must always remember the definition of "jury" though. Jury as defined by me, for these purposes, is a group of people, to stupid to get out of jury duty. Do you really want them sitting in judgement of the facts, when your life is in the balance? Nah, me neither. :)

    While I wouldn't necessarily disagree with you that juries can be composed of stupid people, I think a better adjective would be ignorant. I also take issue with the idea that getting out of jury duty is the "smart" thing to do. I see this as an abrogation of one's civic duty. When smart, well-informed people avoid jury duty Justice is compromised, and a major element of our rights and defense against tyranny is threatened by weakness.

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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBSR View Post
    If the mutt was shot inside the home, there will be forensic evidence to prove that fact. If this is the case, this homeowner will walk. Because the mutt manages to stumble outside before he dies, should have no impact on whether the homeowner is indicted or not.

    If he's outside, and he was shot outside, and he was in fact unarmed and presenting no threat to the homeowner, I think it's a coin flip. I'd like to think a decent attorney (not even a good attorney) could win this in court, with a jury. I'll not debate the finer points of the castle doctrine, as it varies from state to state, and I don't live in Columbus, Ohio.

    One must always remember the definition of "jury" though. Jury as defined by me, for these purposes, is a group of people, to stupid to get out of jury duty. Do you really want them sitting in judgement of the facts, when your life is in the balance? Nah, me neither. :)
    Be safe.
    As one who has served on a jury in a double murder trial I find your definition of a jury to be offensive and a dereliction of a civic duty.
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  9. #24
    Distinguished Member Array shadowwalker's Avatar
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    It was the fall from the secound floor that killed him

  10. #25
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Like others said too little information at this time,All it takes is a Prosecutor with an agenda to sway a Grand Jury to indite,the problem with a home invasion/burglary is any witnesses could be painted as biased towards the defendent
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  11. #26
    Senior Member Array Dennis1209's Avatar
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    Two words... "Jury Nullification".

    Two moe words... "Crime Stopper".
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  12. #27
    Senior Member Array Tala's Avatar
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    My mama always said to make sure they die inside the house. Sounds good in theory, but not always. I'm not going to execute him if he wants to jump back out the window he came in. But the theory is that we don't shoot people on the porch or who are in the process of coming in the window or door, saves headache if you let them get all the way into the house. If they're brandishing a weapon at the time, then it's a different ballgame.
    The home invador my family was visited by appeared unarmed and fled back out the window, unharmed, he appeared to only pose a threat to property and wasn't worth shooting. It would have been a good shoot while he was standing in our living room, but he didn't even see a gun he only heard somone was home and immediately fled, at that point it would have been a bad shoot.

    Crime scene forensics aren't as good as tv shows make them out to be. Sure the technology exists, but here in podunk Arkansas the best I would hope for is pictures of the crime scene and an autopsy.

    I've been to jury duty in Arkansas. I was not impressed wih the smarts of the jury pool either. Fortunately though, most ignorant rednecks do believe in shooting dirtbags who invade your home. I would not want to face a jury from the county where my parents' house is though - too much ghetto and not enough rednecks. Might be somethin to consider about where you live I suppose, since generally you are tried in the county where the incident takes place.
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  13. #28
    Member Array mbguy29577's Avatar
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    Was there no proof of a shooting inside the home?? Blood, splatter, gun powder, shells, anything? Wish the article was more in-depth.
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  14. #29
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    Re: Man indicted for killing intruder

    I hope that it can be proven the homeowner was in the right.

    As we all know, shooting someone while facing them will cause them to fly backward between 10&50 feet, depending on the caliber used. Any shot would have propelled the perp back out through the window he entered.... I seed it on the tee vee!
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    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  15. #30
    Member Array JoshJ10's Avatar
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    Talking

    Castle Doctrine in Ohio only applies inside your home or your car(only the car registered in your name, not just any car you drive).

    Sadly, it doesn't apply to your property.

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