Chris Kyle - The American Sniper - shot dead today!!!

This is a discussion on Chris Kyle - The American Sniper - shot dead today!!! within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Originally Posted by Spirit51 I have lost what little respect I had for Ron Paul. Ron Paul tweets about SEAL sniper’s death: ‘He who lives ...

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Thread: Chris Kyle - The American Sniper - shot dead today!!!

  1. #91
    Senior Member Array mulle46's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spirit51 View Post
    I have lost what little respect I had for Ron Paul.

    Ron Paul tweets about SEAL sniper’s death: ‘He who lives by the sword dies by the sword’

    Read more: Ron Paul tweets about SEAL sniper's death | The Daily Caller


    Ron Paul Slams Murdered U.S. Sniper Chris Kyle

    Former Republican presidential contender Ron Paul has just put out a tweet slamming U.S. Navy SEAL sniper Chris Kyle, author of the New York Times bestseller American Sniper, who was murdered this weekend at a shooting range.

    Two observations:

    1. Chris Kyle was an American hero of the highest order. And he used the sword because he was in the military, where his job was to keep America safe.

    2. SEALS who served with Kyle said that using the gun range for persons with PTSD made sense. It put them around things with which they were "familiar" and was therefore a "very comfortable" environment.


    God bless the family of Chris Kyle.


    "Breitbart News" <noreply@breitbart.com
    but I gained more respect than I already had for Dakota Meyer for his response to Paul about Chief Kyle.
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    You gain strength, courage, and confidence by every experience in which you really stop to look fear in the face. You are able to say to yourself, "I have lived through this horror. I can take the next thing that comes along." . . . You must do the thing you think you cannot do. Eleanor Roosevelt

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  3. #92
    Distinguished Member Array Chaplain Scott's Avatar
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    OK, for all the arm-chair shrinks out there in DC land, although I have been a licensed Therapist for 20 years, I defer to somebody more knowledgable:

    “The question being asked is: Wouldn’t the shooting of a weapon out in the open trigger feelings, nightmares, flashbacks? The answer is, yes, it can,” said Dr. Harry Croft, a San Antonio-based psychiatrist who has talked with more than 7,000 veterans diagnosed with PTSD. “But the hope would be that those would be triggered in a situation that’s safe, where other people are there who understand PTSD and could help the person cope with the thoughts that may come back to them.

    In situations like a shooting range, the sounds may set off a hyper-vigilant response, maybe flashbacks and nightmares at night. But it doesn’t make you violent, like you’re going to kill the person around you. And if the person around you is a Chris Kyle, a Navy SEAL who knows and can support you, then that experience can have a more positive effect,” Croft said.
    Bold print added by me.......

    Rest In Peace Chief.

    Jon: is there a way for us here at DC to help his family in a tangible way??
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    Scott, US Army 1974-2004

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  4. #93
    VIP Member Array TedBeau's Avatar
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    Several points to ponder:

    First off it is indeed a tragedy, and let us not forget that there were TWO men killed in this incident. We need to pray for the the family of Chad Littlefield also!

    Secondly, it was reported long ago that there was a bounty on Chris's head, and while I am not a full blown conspiracy supporter, I do wonder if this was a factor. It reminds me a little bit of Timothy McVeigh in that the shooter was ex-military, and perhaps he was disillusioned with what happened in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Lastly, the shooter managed to kill two soldiers both before either of them were able to arm themselves and defend themselves. I don't know if either victum was carrying a side arm, but I would venture to say their rifles were most likely unloaded at the time of the attack. Of course we may never know exactly how the event unfolded, but it may show that even for a combat veteran, drawing against the drop is a no win situation.

  5. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by TedBeau View Post

    Lastly, the shooter managed to kill two soldiers both before either of them were able to arm themselves and defend themselves. I don't know if either victum was carrying a side arm, but I would venture to say their rifles were most likely unloaded at the time of the attack. Of course we may never know exactly how the event unfolded, but it may show that even for a combat veteran, drawing against the drop is a no win situation.
    Speculation on my part, but remember that many ranges have those pesky rules about not having any loaded guns on you, not carrying downrange, not leaving the line with a loaded gun, etc, etc,.

    It's hard to defend yourself if there is no loaded gun handy.

    I always have a concealed pistol on me at the range, private or public. Even if it might not help me in a 'drop' situation, it makes me feel better about myself...
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  6. #95
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaplain Scott View Post
    OK, for all the arm-chair shrinks out there in DC land, although I have been a licensed Therapist for 20 years, I defer to somebody more knowledgable:

    Bold print added by me.......

    Rest In Peace Chief.

    Jon: is there a way for us here at DC to help his family in a tangible way??
    Yes, there is. I'm working in Mexico until Sunday evening and will be back Monday. I'll post back once I have more specifics of what can be done. I'm also checking to see what can be done for his kids. Mine live free because of men like him, so hopefully we can somehow comfort his, however little, in these trying times.

    All proceeds from his book go to the families of two fallen teammates. I've heard it mentioned that one should buy the book to support the Kyle's. I agree with buying the book, just know that money goes to another, equally good cause.

    Edit - figured I'd add this now... While it is confirmed Eddie Ray Routh suffered from PTSD, he also suffered from other, more severe mental illnesses and had not been taking his meds. He made threats to his family and his Mother reached out to Kyle. If she warned him of the violent behavior, I don't know.

    But, apparently there has not been one single case of PTSD being the confirmed cause of violent behavior. Schizophrenics and those with bi-polar disorder are much more likely to act with violence.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  7. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaplain Scott View Post
    OK, for all the arm-chair shrinks out there in DC land, although I have been a licensed Therapist for 20 years, I defer to somebody more knowledgable:
    Unfortunately that quote doesn't do anything to cover if/when it should be done. I'm no arm-chair shrink (at least I don't think so) but saying something can be beneficial, isn't even remotely the same thing as a recommendation of treatment. I'm sure Mr. Kyle helped plenty of vets successfully, but I truly hope that it wasn't done without some professional guidance of the psychiatric kind.

    Consider the facts that are coming to light about the situation and this individual. He had just been released from a psychiatric hospital (over objections from his own parents). He had been in and out of care for mental conditions for some time. He had some run ins with law enforcement and had threatened to kill himself and apparently at least one family member. It appears that he may have had some sort of drug addiction.

    Once again, I'm not at all trying to disparage Mr. Kyle's name at all. However I don't think it's wise to simply ignore the truths that led to this terrible situation, if for no other reason than to reiterate how serious mental conditions can be.
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  8. #97
    Distinguished Member Array Chaplain Scott's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TX expat View Post
    Unfortunately that quote doesn't do anything to cover if/when it should be done. I'm no arm-chair shrink (at least I don't think so) but saying something can be beneficial, isn't even remotely the same thing as a recommendation of treatment. I'm sure Mr. Kyle helped plenty of vets successfully, but I truly hope that it wasn't done without some professional guidance of the psychiatric kind.

    Consider the facts that are coming to light about the situation and this individual. He had just been released from a psychiatric hospital (over objections from his own parents). He had been in and out of care for mental conditions for some time. He had some run ins with law enforcement and had threatened to kill himself and apparently at least one family member. It appears that he may have had some sort of drug addiction.

    Once again, I'm not at all trying to disparage Mr. Kyle's name at all. However I don't think it's wise to simply ignore the truths that led to this terrible situation, if for no other reason than to reiterate how serious mental conditions can be.
    Yep--absolutely NO problems with your questions. The real key here in my mind, would be, was the Chief actually aware of the deeper, more underlying mental illness issues? Of course we may never know the answer to that question.

    My GUESS would be that he was not aware. The SPECOPS guys I know and have served with were, for the most part, very professional, (and while a little "out there"), very level-headed and very practical in their approach to life and training.
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  9. #98
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    America has loss a hero.

  10. #99
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    There has not been one documented case of someone with PTSD committing these types of crimes. So what if he had PTSD? It was the other illnesses that were the problem and we have no idea if his mother informed Chris or not when she reached it.

    Saying someone with PTSD should not be allowed near firearms is like saying someone with diabetes shouldn't be near firearms. Historically, neither have caused violent behavior.

    All we know for sure is that Eddie Ray's mother reached out to Chris Kyle to help her son. We have no idea if she informed him of the other mental illnesses, his hospital stays or his violence towards his family as well as his suicidal gestures when his father threatened to sell his rifle. If she didn't tell Chris, she'll need to live that the rest of her life. If she did, Chris understood the risks but still reached out to a vet.

    I'll know more this week when I'm home.
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    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  11. #100
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    Jon, I bought Chief Kyle's book, along with Marcus Luttrell's book. Both are great.
    Don't believe what you hear and only half of what you see!
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  12. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by varob View Post
    Jon, I bought Chief Kyle's book, along with Marcus Luttrell's book. Both are great.
    Check out Fearless as well
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  13. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by varob View Post
    Jon, I bought Chief Kyle's book, along with Marcus Luttrell's book. Both are great.
    Read "Victory Point: Operations Red Wings and Whalers - the Marine Corps' Battle for Freedom in Afghanistan" for another perspective.
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  14. #103
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Lone Survivor, Marcus Luttrell's book on Operation Redwing, will be a movie staring Emile Hursch, Mark Whalberg and a couple others I can't recall now. But, it should be good.

    Also, the Taliban released video of the fallen SEALs of Operation Redwing. After watching video of Marcus, that video is pretty crushing.

    Sorry for the thread drift. Gotta head out to work for a bit.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  15. #104
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    it is sad to see that Westboro Baptist Church will be protesting at kyles funeral.

  16. #105
    RKM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poseidon View Post
    it is sad to see that Westboro Baptist Church will be protesting at kyles funeral.
    Seriously? I support the First amendment, even when people say things I disagree with 100%. That's what's great about this County. But these people are on the border of committing harassment in my opinion. The people that are constantly protested by these nut jobs are generally nothing but great people who have only done good things in life. Why don't they protest the funerals of criminals?

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