November 21st, 2006 05:45 AM
They'll just take it away from you...
Men bailed after gang kills woman
Ms Chung was stamped and kicked to death in her own home
Three men and a youth have been bailed by police after armed raids during which a woman was kicked to death and a child was held at knifepoint.
Kam Fum Chung, 65, was killed at her west London home early on 6 November.
Later the gang raided a nearby house and threatened a man's daughter with a knife. They fled when the man grabbed their gun and fought back.
Police said the men, two aged 21, one 23 and the other 17, had been released on bail until February 2007.
Police believe the robbers may have targeted Ms Chung, who owned a Chinese restaurant, thinking she had the day's takings with her.
Detectives have established she did not have the money with her when she returned home to Meadowview, Cowley, just before the attack.
A post-mortem examination revealed mother-of-two Ms Chung, who lived alone, died of multiple stamps and kicks to the face and chest.
The gang drove off in her Volkswagen car and forced their way into a house in Vine Lane, Hillingdon, where a man and his two children were asleep.
Wearing balaclavas, one of them brandished a fake gun while another fetched the girl from her room and held a knife to her throat.
But they were forced to escape when the girl's 49-year-old father, grabbed the gun and used it to hit all three of them.
He was stabbed in the knee, but his children were not injured.
November 21st, 2006 08:23 AM
Good for him for fighting back. It could have been worse if he didn't.
I would have done same thing, only BGs would already have been facing when they came through my door. It might be different in UK, though (gun ownership and all). I don't know.
As for UK, what the heck is happening there, when BGs do all of this and then are...allowed to leave on bond until FEBRUARY? That is ashame and shows you how similar their legal system is to ours. I hear UK has a real problem when it comes to crime. Similar/worse than US? Can someone comment?
In any case, my prayers are with Ms. Chung's family.
Life, liberty, and the pursuit of the ultimate CC gun!
November 22nd, 2006 12:27 AM
Actually, it's probably good he didn't shoot them, since then we would have been charged with murder. I'm honestly surprised he wasn't arrested for threatening them with his gun, or for having the gun in the first place.
Originally Posted by walther1
The UK is a seriously screwed-up country. We like to complain here about all the silliness with gun control problems we have, but it's nothing like that complete insanity that goes on over there. It wasn't that long ago that a couple apprehended a burglar in their home, using a fake gun. The police arrested them for threatening the burglar with a firearm.
As for UK, what the heck is happening there, when BGs do all of this and then are...allowed to leave on bond until FEBRUARY?
That is ashame and shows you how similar their legal system is to ours. I hear UK has a real problem when it comes to crime. Similar/worse than US? Can someone comment?
From what I've read, the UK's per-capita crime rate is actually significantly higher than our own. Their death rate is lower, but this is mainly because they don't have as many guns, and knives and other weapons are usually used instead, leaving horrible scars on the victims. Also, they don't have all the gang violence we have, so in reality, their regular middle-class citizens are probably affected far more by street crime (mainly muggings and other assaults) than we are when we walk somewhere in public.
Basically, it seems that the criminals in UK are allowed to run rampant, and victims are prosecuted whenever they try to resist. Legally, people in the UK aren't even allowed to defend themselves in their own homes from attackers.
Last edited by dwolsten; November 22nd, 2006 at 02:00 AM.
November 22nd, 2006 01:17 AM
November 22nd, 2006 08:13 AM
The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member[/B]
November 22nd, 2006 10:38 AM
England is on a slipery down slope with little or no possibility of changing for the better.
One should never confuse good fortune with good training.
Illegitimus Non Carborundum.
In God we trust.
November 22nd, 2006 10:01 PM
This is so disgusting, I can't comment on it; I would be thrown off the forum!
Assault is a behavior, not a device.
"Don't never take no shortcuts." Patty Reed, Donner Party
Lifetime NRA member
November 23rd, 2006 09:52 AM
Hey, Jeff, it's not good to hold back, man. Let it all hang out here and tell what you really think, man....
What a nutty place. One of my favorite rants is how we got so much of our culture, country, legal system, etc. from them.
Our "Mother Country"? Nope.
Mother_ _ _ _ _ _ _ country, maybe.
But there are places like that in OUR country and those who would like to see more of them.
Jeez, I better go watch some football to cool off.....
November 23rd, 2006 11:58 AM
Here's an interesting essay on the subject:
A small excerpt from it:
... After the First World War, gun control laws began restricting the possession of firearms. Then, after the Second World War, these restrictions grew more severe, eventually disarming the civilian population of England -- or at least the law-abiding part of it.
It was during this period of severe restrictions on owning firearms that crime rates in general, and the murder rate in particular, began to rise in England. "As the number of legal firearms have dwindled, the numbers of armed crimes have risen," Professor Malcolm points out.
In 1954, there were only a dozen armed robberies in London but, by the 1990s, there were more than a hundred times as many. In England, as in the United States, drastic crackdowns on gun ownership by law-abiding citizens were accompanied by ever greater leniency to criminals. In both countries, this turned out to be a formula for disaster.
While England has not yet reached the American level of murders, it has already surpassed the United States in rates of robbery and burglary. Moreover, in recent years the murder rate in England has been going up under still more severe gun control laws, while the murder rate in the United States has been going down as more and more states have allowed private citizens to carry concealed weapons -- and have begun locking up more criminals.
In both countries, facts have no effect whatever on the dogmas of gun control zealots. ...
November 27th, 2006 12:05 PM
Originally Posted by dwolsten
Also, they only count murder cases that result in convictions in their crime statistics. Unsolved murders do not get counted and multiple murders commited by a single person are only counted as a single murder in the stats.
Keep in mind that the murder case clearance rate for NYC is somewhere around 30%...
November 27th, 2006 09:56 PM
Rubbish. The number of murders is the number of murders. I recall hearing something like that quoted before, but nothing to prove it other than some slanted internet article unable to back its figures up. As the crime figures there quote clearup rates of less than 100 percent, they are obviously counting unsolved too.
Originally Posted by mzmtg
Guys, the place is messed up, I for one have no intention of ever returning, but there is no need to resort to Brady style mis-information to make our point. The murder rate in the UK is considerably less than the US. Other ex-pats will confirm this. Will it remain like this? Who knows. Is other crime higher there? I would say definitely so.
I should also point out that a very significant number of the murders in the US are what we called in the UK 'black on black'. Nothing to do with color, but to do with criminals killing criminals. My sincere apologies if this is an offensive term over here and moderators please feel free to correct.
Now, if you take out that element (which is WAY larger over here than in the UK), you kind of narrow the gap on the murder rate.
November 29th, 2006 12:42 AM
My family escaped England 300 years ago. It was nutty even then.
"There is no such thing as too much ammo. Unless you're swimming!"
November 29th, 2006 12:58 AM
December 23rd, 2006 02:33 PM
+1to bones, couldn’t agree with you more.
"Hell of a thing, killin' a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have."
- William Munny (Clint Eastwood in the Unfrogivin)
“The graveyards are full of indispensable men.” – Napoleon Bonaparte
“My Idea of a fair fight is beating baby seals with a club”
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