Police warn against dangers...

Police warn against dangers...

This is a discussion on Police warn against dangers... within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; Of ...citizen's arrest But according to the poorly written article, Police chief Bedford said, “We encourage people to take enforcement action.” Homeowner caught BG in ...

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  1. #1
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Police warn against dangers...

    Of ...citizen's arrest

    But according to the poorly written article, Police chief Bedford said, “We encourage people to take enforcement action.”

    Homeowner caught BG in his vehicle, detained perp until LEO arrived.

    Story here
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    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose


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    VIP Member Array mprp's Avatar
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    They have a good point and legitimate concern for rolling up on an armed citizen and not knowing who's who. Like he says, there have even been problems with officers out of uniform. I think this is where the CC holder has to take some responsibility upon himself / herself and think of the smartest ways to avoid being shot by the very LE that they have called.
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    Vietnam Vets, WELCOME HOME

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  3. #3
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    This dirtbag already was charged with two burglaries the previous month? Don't need gun control, we need criminal control....long term!
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  4. #4
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mprp View Post
    They have a good point and legitimate concern for rolling up on an armed citizen and not knowing who's who. Like he says, there have even been problems with officers out of uniform. I think this is where the CC holder has to take some responsibility upon himself / herself and think of the smartest ways to avoid being shot by the very LE that they have called.
    Pretty much goes without saying... But not everyone has common sense...

    Give 911 a description of yourself, the fact that you have the bad guy held at gunpoint and will holster your weapon on LEO arrival, at the very least. And of course, keep 911 on the line until LEO arrives.
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    Rats!
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  5. #5
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    This dirtbag already was charged with two burglaries the previous month? Don't need gun control, we need criminal control....long term!

    Not in Johnson county... home of the University of Iowa, and the most liberal county hereabouts...


    But... GO HAWKS! anyway.
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    Rats!
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  6. #6
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    “I don’t think there’s anything legally he did that was wrong,” said Coralville Police Chief Barry Bedford. “It turned out very well, but the potential was there that it could have been disastrous.”

    I could also potentially slip and fall in the shower, but people appreciate my taking that risk. What a doo-doo statement.

    And I would argue that the homeowner did not make a "citizen's arrest," only an apprehension. I bet the LEOs made the arrest when they arrived. There are legal differences between the two.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
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    Please, for all that is good and holy........NO

    The Chief is a tool. I think this is a good application for the CHL "Sash" like this:
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    Senior Member Array Kasey88's Avatar
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    Last week my niece was staying with me.I had left and she told she was shortly.When i got back home,the side door was open.I tried to call my niece but no answer.I felt like she forgot to close door,but i didn't know for sure.I do carry but didn't want to go in.My brother lives near me so i went and got him.He grabbed his gun and his AR and we went back to my place.He said he was taking them because you never know.

    He told me to call the cops and let them go in.When they pulled up,we were standing outside of car.He said he left the rifle in the car, so it wouldn't cause any confusion.Thankfully no one was in there.Better to be safe than sorry,as the saying goes.
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  9. #9
    VIP Member Array mprp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    Pretty much goes without saying... But not everyone has common sense...

    Give 911 a description of yourself, the fact that you have the bad guy held at gunpoint and will holster your weapon on LEO arrival, at the very least. And of course, keep 911 on the line until LEO arrives.
    And then of course there's always the likelihood of it being someone else doing the 911 calling, maybe that you don't even know about. Multiple calls for instance. Maybe someone may even call thinking that you are the BG. Either way it's probably best not to have a gun held on someone as LE rolls up. I would like to think that I'd have mine holstered. Help is here so relax, type thing.

    On a side note though: If I have to pull my gun, I've already decided that it needs to be fired. Likely that the threat is gone unless I'm still firing when LE shows up.

    And I think Rock and Glock wants someone to fire up some popcorn, so here ya go....
    Vietnam Vets, WELCOME HOME

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock and Glock View Post
    The Chief is a tool. I think this is a good application for the CHL "Sash" like this:
    I knew you had one, I just knew it!
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

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    VIP Member Array NONAME762's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasey88 View Post
    Last week my niece was staying with me.I had left and she told she was shortly.When i got back home,the side door was open.I tried to call my niece but no answer.I felt like she forgot to close door,but i didn't know for sure.I do carry but didn't want to go in.My brother lives near me so i went and got him.He grabbed his gun and his AR and we went back to my place.He said he was taking them because you never know.

    He told me to call the cops and let them go in.When they pulled up,we were standing outside of car.He said he left the rifle in the car, so it wouldn't cause any confusion.Thankfully no one was in there.Better to be safe than sorry,as the saying goes.
    Well I hope if it was your niece who left the side door open you gave her what for when she came back.

    It's absolutely vital everyone who stays at someone else's home KNOW THE RULE for keeping doors/windows SECURED. Anyone old enuf to go to the store is old enuf to secure the residence before leaving.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock and Glock View Post
    The Chief is a tool. I think this is a good application for the CHL "Sash" like this:


    ^^^I agree^^^^^^


    Here he says;

    Bedford said when police arrive on the scene and see one person holding a gun on another, they might not be able to tell right away who is the potential threat. “ When police respond, they’ll focus on the perceived threat,” he said. “The person with the gun, they don’t know if he’s the good guy or the bad guy and if they do anything that can be interpreted as a threat to the officer, the officer is going to respond.” -

    See more at: Police warn against dangers of gun-toting Coralville homeowner who thwarted burglary | TheGazette


    Call to 911;

    Homeowner:
    someone is breaking into my car and I'm holding them at gunpoint, send someone quick!

    911 operator:
    Ok, I have a unit on its way, ,,

    Car_ _ _, homeowner has suspected car burglar and is holding them at gunpoint in driveway of home at _ _ _ _ _ blah blah blah street,


    For Gods sake, even Barney Fife couldn't screw that up, how would an officer NOT be able to figure out who the GG was?
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  13. #13
    Senior Member Array kb2wji's Avatar
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    Good for the homeowner! Our policy forces dispatchers to tell people to back off. In my humble opinion it should be up to the caller. If you moved out of your parents basement and own your home, you must have at least a little common sense. That tells (me anyway) that you can likely properly evaluate the risk / reward of detaining some jackwagon that's trying to steal your stuff. Sounds like Coralville has the same problem we do. They don't lock up these repeat offenders.
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  14. #14
    Distinguished Member Array Fitch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oneshot View Post
    ^^^I agree^^^^^^


    Here he says;

    Bedford said when police arrive on the scene and see one person holding a gun on another, they might not be able to tell right away who is the potential threat. “ When police respond, they’ll focus on the perceived threat,” he said. “The person with the gun, they don’t know if he’s the good guy or the bad guy and if they do anything that can be interpreted as a threat to the officer, the officer is going to respond.” -

    See more at: Police warn against dangers of gun-toting Coralville homeowner who thwarted burglary | TheGazette


    Call to 911;

    Homeowner:
    someone is breaking into my car and I'm holding them at gunpoint, send someone quick!

    911 operator:
    Ok, I have a unit on its way, ,,

    Car_ _ _, homeowner has suspected car burglar and is holding them at gunpoint in driveway of home at _ _ _ _ _ blah blah blah street,


    For Gods sake, even Barney Fife couldn't screw that up, how would an officer NOT be able to figure out who the GG was?
    Way too many things have to go right in your scenario. Every one of your assumptions about communication has to go right, or there is the potential for a deadly mistake.

    Adrenaline causes brain shutdown. Frequently the 911 operators give out much less information that they are given. It's not like they have the responding officers on the line with you. The information has to be relayed.

    The arriving LEO's may only know there is someone with a GUN, and stopped hearing after that word kicked off their adrenaline. The person with the GUN is standing there and turns toward them ... loud noises follow. Everybody is really sorry you are dead. Really, they will all say that. The truth is they are glad to be alive, and nobody will think they did anything wrong except you and your relatives.

    I was good friends with the sergeant who ran one of the 911 call centers in LA before he retired. He said it's a very confused place with a lot going on. The operators are under a lot of pressure and there is a lot of chance for misinformation. The tendency is to communicate less rather than more. They don't want a fellow officer to be hurt or killed because they said something wrong or misunderstood what the caller was telling them.

    If I've survived the initial encounter, I regard the approach of the police as the most lethal threat I'll ever face. More lethal that the perp because I'm allowed to fight back against the perp, but not a cop that starts shooting at me. Based on recent news stories, give them any excuse at all, the arriving officers start shooting. Not because their evil but because, whether they admit it or not, they are afraid. The news is full of the stories. And it's accepted as justified by the authorities and their peers. There is little or no restraint on the officers, and since shooting is justified nearly every time, and even if it isn't they can lie about it more often than not and get away with it, so they are much more likely to shoot than accept risk in the face of any perceived threat whether or not the threat is real.

    Given those circumstances, I want completely empty hands. I'd rather the perp left so I can put my gun away than risk the gun in hand to hold him for the police. I have no interest in holding the perp at all. Not my assignment. My mission is to avoid death or grievous physical injury to myself or family from the perp or the cops. With the threat from the perp stopped, the cops are still a threat until communication is established. If the perp getting away reduces the threat from the cops, I'm not going to stop him. They can go find him. That's their job.

    If you choose to do something else, good luck with that.

    Fitch
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  15. #15
    VIP Member Array Doghandler's Avatar
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    Let's not be too hard on Chief Bedford. While not gung ho on our side he's not exactly against us either. He just wants to enforce the law. I'll bet the thought of guns coming out under any circumstances by anyone keeps him up at night. I am disappointed, however, in the words he chose to comment on the situation.

    My first rule of self defense is to not inject myself into a situation that can be avoided. What if?

    What if the perp has a hidden accomplice that you are unaware of and bushwhacks you, etc., etc. I'd have just called the cops like the Chief recommends.
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